<DIV>I think the truth here is that although someone who commits grand arson may not intend to kill people when they commit the act of setting a building on fire, they are nonetheless also committing an act that is likely to kill someone. Just like when someone robs a bank and doesn't intend to shoot and kill, they are accepting the liability for their actions, and murder may be a part of the consequences of actions they choose to take.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>A person that commits grand arson against a building which is designed to hold people should also be charged with manslaughter or attempted manslaughter. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Best,</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Donovan<BR><BR><B><I>"Kai Eiselein, editor" <editor@lataheagle.com></I></B> wrote:</DIV> <BLOCKQUOTE class=replbq style="PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #1010ff 2px solid">So we go into the "what ifs"<BR>What if a
custodian or another employee had been working late?<BR>Sure, maybe someone scouted the place out before hand, recorded the times <BR>people came and left. But there is always that chance that someone inside <BR>had a change of plans.<BR>Then again, there are the firefighters, you know, the people that go inside <BR>a burning building to make sure no one is inside. What if the building <BR>collapses on them?<BR>Firefighters have been killed at intentionaly set fires, Sunil. Even if no <BR>one was inside the building at the time the fire was set, there is still a <BR>chance that a firefighter could be killed. If one is willing to burn a <BR>building, one is willing to kill.<BR>Why do you think arsonists are charged with murder when someone is killed?<BR><BR><BR>----- Original Message ----- <BR>From: "Sunil Ramalingam" <SUNILRAMALINGAM@HOTMAIL.COM><BR>Cc: <VISION2020@MOSCOW.COM><BR>Sent: Monday, October 01, 2007 3:17 PM<BR>Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Are you enabling
extremism?<BR><BR><BR>> Kai,<BR>><BR>> If my memory serves, most of those arsons took place at night, when the<BR>> buildings were unoccupied. You make a big leap when you say "Anyone who <BR>> is<BR>> willing to torch a building is willing to kill anyone inside." If that <BR>> were<BR>> the case, wouldn't they burn them down in the daytime when labs and<BR>> businesses were occupied?<BR>><BR>> I'm not condoning or defending arson or the tactics you describe below. I<BR>> just don't agree with your premise. Just because someone commits some bad<BR>> acts does not mean they're willing to kill.<BR>><BR>> Sunil<BR>><BR>><BR>>>From: "Kai Eiselein, editor" <EDITOR@LATAHEAGLE.COM><BR>>>To: "Ted Moffett" <STARBLISS@GMAIL.COM><BR>>>CC: Vision2020 <VISION2020@MOSCOW.COM><BR>>>Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Are you enabling extremism?<BR>>>Date: Mon, 1 Oct 2007 13:16:47
-0700<BR>>><BR>>>Ted,<BR>>>I can't believe you've never heard of the Animal Liberation Front (ALF) or<BR>>>the Earth Liberation Front (ELF), both of which engage in attacks against<BR>>>entities they disagree with. Perhaps you've forgotten the string of <BR>>>arsons<BR>>>that took place from the 90's and into 2001 in Oregon and Washington in<BR>>>which the ELF claimed responsibility? Or the arrests in 2006 of several<BR>>>members of ELF in connection with those arsons? Anyone who is willing to<BR>>>torch a building is willing to kill anyone inside.<BR>>>I must have struck a nerve, since you are making demands rather than<BR>>>engaging in debate. From your posts about global warming, typhoons and<BR>>>such, I know you are perfectly capable of finding information on the web.<BR>>>Quit feigning ignorance/stupidity, it doesn't become you.<BR>>>I'll not waste my time digging up information
that has been well <BR>>>publicized<BR>>>and is readily available just because you demand it.<BR>>>Debate is the art of point-counter point, Ted. Not demand, counter demand.<BR>>> ----- Original Message -----<BR>>> From: Ted Moffett<BR>>> To: Kai Eiselein, editor<BR>>> Cc: Andreas Schou ; Paul Rumelhart ; Vision2020<BR>>> Sent: Monday, October 01, 2007 12:19 PM<BR>>> Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Are you enabling extremism?<BR>>><BR>>><BR>>><BR>>> Kai et. al.<BR>>><BR>>> Will you please offer examples of what you call "eco-terrorism," <BR>>> engaged<BR>>>in by what you described as "on the left are extremist environmental<BR>>>groups," that have resulted in deliberately caused deaths by "fanatics<BR>>>willing to kill," as you phrased it, such as a terrorist bombing (a road<BR>>>side IED, or a car bomb, truck bomb, or bombing of a train or bus, etc.)
<BR>>>of<BR>>>civilians would inflict? This is a very serious charge, that should not <BR>>>be<BR>>>made casually.. I am not saying there are not examples of this, just<BR>>>asking you to provide well founded empirical documentation. Please <BR>>>provide<BR>>>the name of the environmental group, document their affiliation with what<BR>>>you termed "the left" (please explain how you define "the left," and why<BR>>>they represent "the left," rather than just "left field"), and the date <BR>>>and<BR>>>details of the terrorist attack.<BR>>><BR>>> Ted Moffett<BR>>> ----<BR>>> Kai wrote:<BR>>><BR>>> Most notably on the left are<BR>>> extremist environmental groups that engage in eco-terrorism. Using<BR>>>Dawkins<BR>>> line of reasoning, anyone who is environmentaly friendly could be <BR>>> seen<BR>>>as<BR>>> supportive of
eco-terrorism.<BR>>> Any belief, taken too far, can result in fanatical zealots willing to<BR>>>kill<BR>>> anyone opposed to their viewpoint.<BR>><BR>><BR>>>=======================================================<BR>>> List services made available by First Step Internet,<BR>>> serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.<BR>>> http://www.fsr.net<BR>>> mailto:Vision2020@moscow.com<BR>>>=======================================================<BR>><BR>><BR>> =======================================================<BR>> List services made available by First Step Internet,<BR>> serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.<BR>> http://www.fsr.net<BR>> mailto:Vision2020@moscow.com<BR>> =======================================================<BR>> <BR><BR>=======================================================<BR>List services made available by First Step Internet, <BR>serving the
communities of the Palouse since 1994. <BR>http://www.fsr.net <BR>mailto:Vision2020@moscow.com<BR>=======================================================<BR></BLOCKQUOTE><BR><p> 
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