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<DIV><FONT face=Arial>So let me get this straight. If one of your buddies comes
right out and threatens a person on this forum with bodily harm,
ala punch them in the nose or kick their cod piece into low earth orbit it's
merely a jolly jest. To express an opinion on matters theological or
temporal is "horrific" and "intimidating."I think what it is that I'm forgetting
is the enormous double standard that you have erected for yourself and your
faithful.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial>g</FONT></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE
style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV>
<DIV
style="BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: black"><B>From:</B>
<A title=kjajmix1@msn.com href="mailto:kjajmix1@msn.com">keely emerinemix</A>
</DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A title=jampot@roadrunner.com
href="mailto:jampot@roadrunner.com">g. crabtree</A> ; <A
title=joekc@adelphia.net href="mailto:joekc@adelphia.net">Joe Campbell</A>
</DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Cc:</B> <A title=vision2020@moscow.com
href="mailto:vision2020@moscow.com">vision2020@moscow.com</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Tuesday, August 14, 2007 8:53
AM</DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> RE: [Vision2020] Trinity
Festival protest</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>There's another saying, Gary, that goes, "All things in their
own time." I think you're forgetting that they don't feel free to do the
"action" thing now -- but have every expectation to when the time is right for
good ol' Christian patriarchal dominion to take center stage.<BR><BR>And, by
the way, words are horrific as well. I know of a man on this list who's
still reeling from Joan Opyr's frustration-driven-but-still-in-jest promise to
levy a well-placed kick in the groin. It's evidently had quite the
impact on him. Words can, indeed, have enormous
effect.<BR><BR>keely<BR><BR><BR><BR><BR><BR><BR><SPAN
style="FONT-STYLE: italic"></SPAN><BR><BR><BR>
<BLOCKQUOTE>
<HR>
From: jampot@roadrunner.com<BR>To: joekc@adelphia.net<BR>Date: Tue, 14 Aug
2007 06:52:22 -0700<BR>CC: vision2020@moscow.com<BR>Subject: Re:
[Vision2020] Trinity Festival protest<BR><BR>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Mr. Campbell,</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>There is a big difference between how people
ARE treated and how someone might feel after misinterpreting (or having it
misinterpreted for them) any given message. One you have direct control over
and are completely responsible for the other is left in the hands of the
recipient to do with what they will. If they decide to "feel" bad I'm afraid
that there is little to be done for it. As I have said before, it's my
understanding that Mr. Wilson's congregation is made up of a variety of
people including minorities and homosexuals. (a recent interview in the LMT
on seminary student Chris Morris leaps immediately to mind) </FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>There's an old saying that periodically makes
the rounds that states "actions speak louder than words." I think that this
particularly applies when the words have been manipulated by others to stir
up the maximum level of foment. On the other hand the actions that
I have been able to see with my own two eyes lead me to believe
that the community in question is ultimately benign. </FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>If you want to make an effective case against
this group, stop reinterpreting fellow detractors reinterpretations of
books, articles and news stories and point to solid evidence of the horrors
that you claim are occurring on a daily basis. I'm guessing that while you
and yours are long on rhetoric your short on specifics. Till you can turn
that equation around I'm afraid that it's you that is
"irrelevant."</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>g</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>----- Original Message ----- </FONT>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>From: "Joe Campbell" <</FONT><A
href="mailto:joekc@adelphia.net"><FONT face=Arial
size=2>joekc@adelphia.net</FONT></A><FONT face=Arial
size=2>></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>To: "g. crabtree" <</FONT><A
href="mailto:jampot@roadrunner.com"><FONT face=Arial
size=2>jampot@roadrunner.com</FONT></A><FONT face=Arial
size=2>></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Cc: "Andreas Schou" <</FONT><A
href="mailto:ophite@gmail.com"><FONT face=Arial
size=2>ophite@gmail.com</FONT></A><FONT face=Arial size=2>>; "Warren
Hayman" <</FONT><A href="mailto:whayman@adelphia.net"><FONT face=Arial
size=2>whayman@adelphia.net</FONT></A><FONT face=Arial size=2>>;
<</FONT><A href="mailto:vision2020@moscow.com"><FONT face=Arial
size=2>vision2020@moscow.com</FONT></A><FONT face=Arial
size=2>></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Sent: Monday, August 13, 2007 2:33
PM</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Trinity Festival
protest</FONT></DIV></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial><BR><FONT size=2></FONT></FONT></DIV><FONT face=Arial
size=2>Gary,<BR><BR>For the most part, your points below are irrelevant. My
concern for Wilson is not with <BR>how he treats the women in his family. My
concern is not even about how he'd treat me, <BR>or how Doug Farris would
treat me, were I to join either for dinner. I feel pretty confident <BR>that
they'll treat me just fine -- white, Christian male that I am.<BR><BR>My
concern is about how my Jewish friends might be treated. My concern is how
my <BR>Muslim, lesbian, and atheist friends ARE being treated, given
Wilson’s threatening and <BR>divisive speech. I worry about the feelings of
my Christian, African-American friends, <BR>given Wilson’s justification of
slavery.<BR><BR>I noticed that you haven't said anything about this
view:<BR><BR>All non-Christians hate God,<BR><BR>which was apparently
endorsed by some of your Kirk friends. I imagine that it will take
<BR>awhile to piece together a justification for this, or even to explain
how it is that folks can <BR>say something so stupid yet complain when they
get criticism back in response.<BR><BR>--<BR>Joe Campbell<BR><BR>---- "g.
crabtree" <</FONT><A href="mailto:jampot@roadrunner.com"><FONT face=Arial
size=2>jampot@roadrunner.com</FONT></A><FONT face=Arial size=2>> wrote:
<BR><BR>=============<BR>Other works by this author causes me to firmly
doubt that he is likely to <BR>refer to his mother, sister, wife, daughters,
daughters in law or grand <BR>daughters as "chattel." Prove me
wrong.<BR><BR>g<BR>----- Original Message ----- <BR>From: "Andreas Schou"
<</FONT><A href="mailto:ophite@gmail.com"><FONT face=Arial
size=2>ophite@gmail.com</FONT></A><FONT face=Arial size=2>><BR>To: "g.
crabtree" <</FONT><A href="mailto:jampot@roadrunner.com"><FONT face=Arial
size=2>jampot@roadrunner.com</FONT></A><FONT face=Arial size=2>><BR>Cc:
"Warren Hayman" <</FONT><A href="mailto:whayman@adelphia.net"><FONT
face=Arial size=2>whayman@adelphia.net</FONT></A><FONT face=Arial
size=2>>; <</FONT><A href="mailto:vision2020@moscow.com"><FONT
face=Arial size=2>vision2020@moscow.com</FONT></A><FONT face=Arial
size=2>>; "Joe <BR>Campbell" <</FONT><A
href="mailto:joekc@adelphia.net"><FONT face=Arial
size=2>joekc@adelphia.net</FONT></A><FONT face=Arial size=2>><BR>Sent:
Sunday, August 12, 2007 5:56 PM<BR>Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Trinity
Festival protest<BR><BR><BR>>> I recommend _Her Hand
in<BR>>> Marriage_ or _Reforming Marriage_, in which Doug discusses
how a woman<BR>>> is to pass as chattel between her father and her
future husband.<BR>>><BR>>> Quite simply it does
not.<BR>><BR>> And how, Gary, did you come to be aware of this, given
that you have<BR>> read neither book?<BR>><BR>> -- ACS<BR>>
<BR><BR><BR><BR></FONT></BLOCKQUOTE><BR>
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