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<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>My goodness, what was it that Latah Lounger said
that brings out the inner Nancy Drew in our resident web cops? More
interestingly, why did we not see this kind of zeal for sleuthing
out sources and identity when we started to receive anonymous words of
wisdom from T.Scimitar, J. Flores, and B. Herodotus?</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Mr. Lounger, if you have been lurking around this
site for any time at all you should be aware that there is but one item of local
interest with a signifigant number of folks on this list and it seems that you
are about to be identified with it. My condolences.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>g</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE
style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV>
<DIV
style="BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: black"><B>From:</B>
<A title=deco@moscow.com href="mailto:deco@moscow.com">Art Deco</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A title=vision2020@moscow.com
href="mailto:vision2020@moscow.com">Vision 2020</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Wednesday, June 06, 2007 4:16
PM</DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> Re: [Vision2020] Christ is Our
Commander-in-Chief</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Verdana>IP 129.101.190.123</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Verdana></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Verdana>Is registered to node:</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Verdana></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Verdana>| PC053237.for.uidaho.edu
|<BR>---------------------------<BR></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Verdana>Registrant:<BR> University of
Idaho<BR> Administration Building Room 140<BR> Moscow,
ID 83844-3155<BR> UNITED STATES</FONT></DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Verdana>Administrative Contact:<BR> Mary L
George<BR> University of Idaho - Information Technology
Services<BR> University of Idaho<BR> PO Box 443155,
Admin Bldg Rm 140<BR> Moscow, ID 83844-3155<BR> UNITED
STATES<BR> (208) 885-6721<BR> <A
href="mailto:domainbilling@uidaho.edu">domainbilling@uidaho.edu</A></FONT></DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Verdana>Technical Contact:<BR>
Hostmaster<BR> University of Idaho - Information Technology
Services<BR> University of Idaho<BR> PO Box 443155,
Admin Bldg Rm 140<BR> Moscow, ID 83844-3155<BR> UNITED
STATES<BR> (208) 885-6721<BR> <A
href="mailto:hostmaster@uidaho.edu">hostmaster@uidaho.edu</A></FONT></DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Verdana>Name Servers: <BR>
DNS1.UIDAHO.EDU 129.101.119.223<BR>
DNS2.UIDAHO.EDU 129.101.119.220</FONT></DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Verdana>Domain record activated:
12-Jun-1988<BR>Domain record last updated: 06-Jun-2006<BR>Domain
expires:
31-Jul-2007<BR></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Verdana></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Verdana></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Verdana>W.</DIV></FONT>
<DIV><FONT face=Verdana> </DIV></FONT>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message -----
<DIV style="BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; font-color: black"><B>From:</B> <A
title=thansen@moscow.com href="mailto:thansen@moscow.com">Tom Hansen</A>
</DIV>
<DIV><B>To:</B> <A title=latahlounger@yahoo.com
href="mailto:latahlounger@yahoo.com">'Latah Lounger'</A> ; <A
title=vision2020@moscow.com
href="mailto:vision2020@moscow.com">'Vision-2020'</A> </DIV>
<DIV><B>Sent:</B> Wednesday, June 06, 2007 2:45 PM</DIV>
<DIV><B>Subject:</B> Re: [Vision2020] Christ is Our
Commander-in-Chief</DIV></DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV class=Section1>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial color=navy size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">Just for y’all’s
edificaction –<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial color=navy size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"><o:p> </o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial color=navy size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">The IP address for
the computer used by “Latah Lounger” was:<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial color=navy size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"><o:p> </o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial color=navy size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">129.101.114.147<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial color=navy size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"><o:p> </o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial color=navy size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">Any guesses where
that IP address is located?<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial color=navy size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"><o:p> </o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial color=navy size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">64.126.190.123 ain’t
much, but I call it home.<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial color=navy size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"><o:p> </o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial color=navy size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">Tom
Hansen<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><st1:place w:st="on"><st1:City w:st="on"><FONT face=Arial
color=navy size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">Moscow</SPAN></FONT></st1:City><FONT
face=Arial color=navy size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">, <st1:State
w:st="on">Idaho</st1:State></SPAN></FONT></st1:place><FONT face=Arial
color=navy size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"><o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
<DIV>
<P><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt"><o:p> </o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
<P><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt">"As more
and more heathens 'choose' to not have children the number of Godly souls will
increase. If the number of Christian births out number the number of Islamic
births the battle will be over in 3 or 4
generations."<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
<P><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt">- Doug
"No-Clue" Farris (March 10, 2007)<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<DIV class=MsoNormal style="TEXT-ALIGN: center" align=center><FONT
face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt">
<HR tabIndex=-1 align=center width="100%" SIZE=2>
</SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><B><FONT face=Tahoma size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold; FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Tahoma">From:</SPAN></FONT></B><FONT
face=Tahoma size=2><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Tahoma">
vision2020-bounces@moscow.com [mailto:vision2020-bounces@moscow.com] <B><SPAN
style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">On Behalf Of </SPAN></B>Latah Lounger<BR><B><SPAN
style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">Sent:</SPAN></B> Wednesday, June 06, 2007 12:52
PM<BR><B><SPAN style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">To:</SPAN></B>
Vision-2020<BR><B><SPAN style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">Subject:</SPAN></B> Re:
[Vision2020] Christ is Our Commander-in-Chief<BR><B><SPAN
style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">Importance:</SPAN></B>
High</SPAN></FONT><o:p></o:p></P></DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt"><o:p> </o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt">Why is it relevant with regard to HOW MANY individuals
were killed by such-and-such people of a certain faith. Isn't it the simple
act of killing and the reason behind the killing that is of importance?
Keeping scorecards of "number killed" by "faith/belief structure" seems a bit
sophomoric if the ultimate issue is to address the REASON behind the killing.
Is one faith more evil or despicable because it killed 2,000 more than another
for the exact same reason?<BR><BR>Furthermore, what does Gier's post really
have to do with the stated objective of Vision 2020: "<st1:PersonName
w:st="on">Moscow Vision 2020</st1:PersonName> is an informal, multi-partisan
group of <st1:City w:st="on">Moscow</st1:City> residents formed in 1993 to
encourage more public information and debate about the future of <st1:City
w:st="on">Moscow</st1:City> and <st1:place w:st="on"><st1:PlaceName
w:st="on">Latah</st1:PlaceName> <st1:PlaceType
w:st="on">County</st1:PlaceType></st1:place>." I fail to comprehend where
Gier's post, as well as many other posted here, has any connection with
<st1:City w:st="on">Moscow</st1:City> or <st1:place w:st="on"><st1:PlaceName
w:st="on">Latah</st1:PlaceName> <st1:PlaceType
w:st="on">County</st1:PlaceType></st1:place>. It appears that several posters
use the board as a soapbox to spout off their own partisan or religious
beliefs, or, in this case, to develop a thesis, without connecting how their
post relates to <st1:City w:st="on">Moscow</st1:City>'s or <st1:place
w:st="on"><st1:PlaceName w:st="on">Latah</st1:PlaceName> <st1:PlaceType
w:st="on">County</st1:PlaceType></st1:place>'s future.<BR><BR><B><I><SPAN
style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold; FONT-STYLE: italic">nickgier@adelphia.net</SPAN></I></B>
wrote:<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt">Good Morning:<BR><BR>I would like to thank Gary
Crabtree for the inspiration for this week's KRFP radio
commentary.<BR><BR><st1:PersonName w:st="on">Nick
Gier</st1:PersonName><BR><BR>CHRIST IS OUR COMMANDER-IN-CHIEF:<BR>RELATIVE
VIOLENCE IN ISLAM AND CHRISTIANITY<BR><BR>I'm writing a book on the origins of
religious violence and my thesis is that there has been far more religiously
motivated violence in the Abrahamic religions—Judaism, Christianity, and
Islam—than the Asian religions. Draft chapters can be viewed at
www.class.uidaho.edu/ngier/orv.htm.<BR><BR>A person on our local list-serve
Vision2020 had this to say about relative violence in Islam and Christianity:
<BR><BR>"Up to the eleventh century Islam had a sizable lead. From 1095 to
1291 the Church picked up the pace and nosed ahead. It was neck and neck till
1834 and the end of the Spanish Inquisition. After that Allah's chosen made it
no contest." <BR><BR>There are more than a few problems with this summary
history.<BR><BR>Islam could not possibly have had any sort of lead before the
11th Century because Christianity had a very good head start. Under Theodosius
I, being a pagan was a capital crime, and even Christians were arrested if
they practiced even the most minor of pagan practices. <BR><BR>On December 25,
390, Theodosius ordered the slaughter of 7,000 pagans in Thessalonica. The
British historian Hugh Trevor Roper called Theodosius "the first Spanish
Inquisitor," and "the Christian monarch who introduced the world to religious
totalitarianism." <BR><BR>Bishop Ambrose, who baptized <st1:City
w:st="on"><st1:place w:st="on">St. Augustine</st1:place></st1:City>, made
Theodosius do penance for the atrocities at Thessalonica, but he still
proclaimed that "Christ was now at the head of the [Roman] legions."
<BR><BR>This reminds me of the sign outside a fundamentalist church in
<st1:City w:st="on">L.A.</st1:City>, right after the invasion of
<st1:country-region w:st="on"><st1:place
w:st="on">Iraq</st1:place></st1:country-region>: "Christ is our
Commander-in-Chief." I'm assuming that our born-again president would have to
agree with this demotion. <BR><BR>Under Muslim rule Jews and Christians were
generally asked to offer a special tax, not their heads. The slaughter of
4,000 Jews in Muslim Granada in 1066 was the exception rather than the rule,
and Jews generally had much better lives in Muslim Spain than anywhere else in
Christian Europe.<BR><BR>In 1099, men, women, and children were slaughtered
indiscriminately when Christian forces captured <st1:City w:st="on"><st1:place
w:st="on">Jerusalem</st1:place></st1:City>. An eyewitness reported that the
Crusaders "rode in blood up to their knees and bridle reins. Indeed, it was a
just and splendid judgment of God that this place should be filled with the
blood of the unbelievers, since it had suffered so long from their
blasphemies." <BR><BR>When Saladin retook the city in 1187, Christians were
only required to pay a ransom and then free to return home. Some of Saladin's
officers paid for those who could not afford it, and about 7,000 others were
sold into slavery.<BR><BR>In Muslim India Buddhist and Hindus were, incredibly
enough, declared "People of the Book," and the tax on non-Muslims was only
sporadically enforced and even more infrequently collected. <BR><BR>Most of
the ancestors of Muslims in <st1:country-region
w:st="on">Pakistan</st1:country-region>, <st1:country-region
w:st="on">Bangladesh</st1:country-region> (especially here),
<st1:country-region w:st="on">India</st1:country-region>, <st1:country-region
w:st="on">Indonesia</st1:country-region>, and <st1:country-region
w:st="on"><st1:place w:st="on">Malaysia</st1:place></st1:country-region>
freely converted to Islam. Areas in <st1:country-region w:st="on"><st1:place
w:st="on">India</st1:place></st1:country-region> where forced conversions were
attempted are now the places where one finds the fewest Muslims per
capita.<BR><BR>Some Mughal emperors ordered the destruction of Hindu and
Buddhist temples, but local resistance and intimidated Mughal functionaries
meant that relatively few temples were liquidated. Early Christian emperors
were much more successful in destroying pagan temples, including the one in
<st1:City w:st="on"><st1:place w:st="on">Alexandria</st1:place></st1:City>
that housed the finest library in the ancient world. <BR><BR>Curiously, the
Vision2020 post above ended Christian atrocities in 1834, but during the
Taiping Rebellion, Chinese Christian armies were responsible for killing 10-20
million people between 1852-1864. I would hazard a guess that more Daoist,
Buddhist, and Confucian temples were destroyed by the Taipings in 12 years
than 600 years of Muslim rule in <st1:country-region w:st="on"><st1:place
w:st="on">India</st1:place></st1:country-region>. <BR><BR>Some have claimed
that the Taipings were not really Christians, but that is simply not the case.
They took great pains to eliminate Chinese religious influences; they enforced
the 10 Commandments at the point of a sword; and they followed the Bible very
carefully, including the prophecies in the Book of Revelation.<BR><BR>Short of
Osama bin Laden getting several nukes and using them, <BR>militant Muslims
have a long way to go to match the historical Christian kill rate.
<BR><BR><st1:PersonName w:st="on">Nick Gier</st1:PersonName> taught religion
and philosophy at the <st1:place w:st="on"><st1:PlaceType
w:st="on">University</st1:PlaceType> of <st1:PlaceName
w:st="on">Idaho</st1:PlaceName></st1:place> for 31 years. See his columns as
the Palouse Pundit at
www.NickGier.com.<BR><BR><BR><BR>=======================================================<BR>List
services made available by First Step Internet, <BR>serving the communities of
the Palouse since 1994. <BR>http://www.fsr.net
<BR>mailto:Vision2020@moscow.com<BR>=======================================================<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt"><o:p> </o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
<P><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt">
<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
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face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt">
<HR align=center width="100%" SIZE=1>
</SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt">No need to miss a message. <A
href="http://us.rd.yahoo.com/evt=43910/*http:/mobile.yahoo.com/mail%0d%0a">Get
email on-the-go </A><BR>with Yahoo! Mail for <st1:City w:st="on"><st1:place
w:st="on">Mobile</st1:place></st1:City>. <A
href="http://us.rd.yahoo.com/evt=43910/*http:/mobile.yahoo.com/mail%0d%0a">Get
started.</A><o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P></DIV>
<P>
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