<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
<HTML><HEAD>
<META http-equiv=Content-Type content="text/html; charset=iso-8859-1">
<META content="MSHTML 6.00.6000.16441" name=GENERATOR>
<STYLE></STYLE>
</HEAD>
<BODY bgColor=#ffffff>
<DIV>Latah Lounger wrote:</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT color=#0000ff>"I fail to comprehend where Gier's post, as well as
many other posted here, has any connection with Moscow or Latah
County."</FONT></DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>The Lounger's inability to make cognitive connections is his
problem, not the problem of others.</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>We see in the Lounger's post another attempt to limit discussions to what
one short-sighted individual or another sees as relevant to current events in
Latah County.</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>"No man is an island" --John Donne</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>No community is an island either. Latah County is affected by
activities and issues world-wide, whether scientific, political, religious,
economic, etc.</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>To: Latah Lounger: If you do not want to read about a topic,
then delete the post that irritates your small-mindedness. Or are you
afraid that the posts on some subjects will eventually bring about awarenesses
that will be adverse to your interests?</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV><BR>Art Deco (Wayne A. Fox)<BR><A
href="mailto:deco@moscow.com">deco@moscow.com</A><BR></DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message -----
<DIV style="BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; font-color: black"><B>From:</B> <A
title=latahlounger@yahoo.com href="mailto:latahlounger@yahoo.com">Latah
Lounger</A> </DIV>
<DIV><B>To:</B> <A title=vision2020@moscow.com
href="mailto:vision2020@moscow.com">Vision-2020</A> </DIV>
<DIV><B>Sent:</B> Wednesday, June 06, 2007 12:51 PM</DIV>
<DIV><B>Subject:</B> Re: [Vision2020] Christ is Our
Commander-in-Chief</DIV></DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New Roman','serif'">Why is it
relevant with regard to HOW MANY individuals were killed by such-and-such people
of a certain faith. Isn't it the simple act of killing and the reason behind the
killing that is of importance? Keeping scorecards of "number killed" by
"faith/belief structure" seems a bit sophomoric if the ultimate issue is to
address the REASON behind the killing. Is one faith more evil or despicable
because it killed 2,000 more than another for the exact same
reason?<BR><BR>Furthermore, what does Gier's post really have to do with the
stated objective of Vision 2020: "Moscow Vision 2020 is an informal,
multi-partisan group of Moscow residents formed in 1993 to encourage more public
information and debate about the future of Moscow and Latah County." I fail to
comprehend where Gier's post, as well as many other posted here, has any
connection with Moscow or Latah County. It appears that several posters use the
board as a soapbox to spout off their own partisan or religious beliefs, or, in
this case, to develop a thesis, without connecting how their post relates to
Moscow's or Latah County's
future.</SPAN><BR><BR><B><I>nickgier@adelphia.net</I></B> wrote:
<BLOCKQUOTE class=replbq
style="PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: rgb(16,16,255) 2px solid">Good
Morning:<BR><BR>I would like to thank Gary Crabtree for the inspiration for
this week's KRFP radio commentary.<BR><BR>Nick Gier<BR><BR>CHRIST IS OUR
COMMANDER-IN-CHIEF:<BR>RELATIVE VIOLENCE IN ISLAM AND CHRISTIANITY<BR><BR>I'm
writing a book on the origins of religious violence and my thesis is that
there has been far more religiously motivated violence in the Abrahamic
religions—Judaism, Christianity, and Islam—than the Asian religions. Draft
chapters can be viewed at www.class.uidaho.edu/ngier/orv.htm.<BR><BR>A person
on our local list-serve Vision2020 had this to say about relative violence in
Islam and Christianity: <BR><BR>"Up to the eleventh century Islam had a
sizable lead. From 1095 to 1291 the Church picked up the pace and nosed ahead.
It was neck and neck till 1834 and the end of the Spanish Inquisition. After
that Allah's chosen made it no contest." <BR><BR>There are more than a few
problems with this summary history.<BR><BR>Islam could not possibly have had
any sort of lead before the 11th Century because Christianity had a very good
head start. Under Theodosius I, being a pagan was a capital crime, and even
Christians were arrested if they practiced even the most minor of pagan
practices. <BR><BR>On December 25, 390, Theodosius ordered the slaughter of
7,000 pagans in Thessalonica. The British historian Hugh Trevor Roper called
Theodosius "the first Spanish Inquisitor," and "the Christian monarch who
introduced the world to religious totalitarianism." <BR><BR>Bishop Ambrose,
who baptized St. Augustine, made Theodosius do penance for the atrocities at
Thessalonica, but he still proclaimed that "Christ was now at the head of the
[Roman] legions." <BR><BR>This reminds me of the sign outside a fundamentalist
church in L.A., right after the invasion of Iraq: "Christ is our
Commander-in-Chief." I'm assuming that our born-again president would have to
agree with this demotion. <BR><BR>Under Muslim rule Jews and Christians were
generally asked to offer a special tax, not their heads. The slaughter of
4,000 Jews in Muslim Granada in 1066 was the exception rather than the rule,
and Jews generally had much better lives in Muslim Spain than anywhere else in
Christian Europe.<BR><BR>In 1099, men, women, and children were slaughtered
indiscriminately when Christian forces captured Jerusalem. An eyewitness
reported that the Crusaders "rode in blood up to their knees and bridle reins.
Indeed, it was a just and splendid judgment of God that this place should be
filled with the blood of the unbelievers, since it had suffered so long from
their blasphemies." <BR><BR>When Saladin retook the city in 1187, Christians
were only required to pay a ransom and then free to return home. Some of
Saladin's officers paid for those who could not afford it, and about 7,000
others were sold into slavery.<BR><BR>In Muslim India Buddhist and Hindus
were, incredibly enough, declared "People of the Book," and the tax on
non-Muslims was only sporadically enforced and even more infrequently
collected. <BR><BR>Most of the ancestors of Muslims in Pakistan, Bangladesh
(especially here), India, Indonesia, and Malaysia freely converted to Islam.
Areas in India where forced conversions were attempted are now the places
where one finds the fewest Muslims per capita.<BR><BR>Some Mughal emperors
ordered the destruction of Hindu and Buddhist temples, but local resistance
and intimidated Mughal functionaries meant that relatively few temples were
liquidated. Early Christian emperors were much more successful in destroying
pagan temples, including the one in Alexandria that housed the finest library
in the ancient world. <BR><BR>Curiously, the Vision2020 post above ended
Christian atrocities in 1834, but during the Taiping Rebellion, Chinese
Christian armies were responsible for killing 10-20 million people between
1852-1864. I would hazard a guess that more Daoist, Buddhist, and Confucian
temples were destroyed by the Taipings in 12 years than 600 years of Muslim
rule in India. <BR><BR>Some have claimed that the Taipings were not really
Christians, but that is simply not the case. They took great pains to
eliminate Chinese religious influences; they enforced the 10 Commandments at
the point of a sword; and they followed the Bible very carefully, including
the prophecies in the Book of Revelation.<BR><BR>Short of Osama bin Laden
getting several nukes and using them, <BR>militant Muslims have a long way to
go to match the historical Christian kill rate. <BR><BR>Nick Gier taught
religion and philosophy at the University of Idaho for 31 years. See his
columns as the Palouse Pundit at
www.NickGier.com.<BR><BR><BR><BR>=======================================================<BR>List
services made available by First Step Internet, <BR>serving the communities of
the Palouse since 1994. <BR>http://www.fsr.net
<BR>mailto:Vision2020@moscow.com<BR>=======================================================</BLOCKQUOTE><BR>
<P>
<HR SIZE=1>
No need to miss a message. <A
href="http://us.rd.yahoo.com/evt=43910/*http://mobile.yahoo.com/mail">Get email
on-the-go </A><BR>with Yahoo! Mail for Mobile. <A
href="http://us.rd.yahoo.com/evt=43910/*http://mobile.yahoo.com/mail">Get
started.</A>
<P>
<HR>
<P></P>=======================================================<BR> List
services made available by First Step Internet, <BR> serving the
communities of the Palouse since 1994.
<BR>
http://www.fsr.net
<BR>
mailto:Vision2020@moscow.com<BR>=======================================================</BODY></HTML>