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<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Donovan, your convoluted reasoning has you going
again. </FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Sue</FONT></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE
style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV>
<DIV
style="BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: black"><B>From:</B>
<A title=donovanjarnold2005@yahoo.com
href="mailto:donovanjarnold2005@yahoo.com">Donovan Arnold</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A title=suehovey@moscow.com
href="mailto:suehovey@moscow.com">Sue Hovey</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Cc:</B> <A title=vision2020@moscow.com
href="mailto:vision2020@moscow.com">vision2020@moscow.com</A> ; <A
title=carlwestberg846@hotmail.com
href="mailto:carlwestberg846@hotmail.com">Carl Westberg</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Wednesday, May 30, 2007 8:35
PM</DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> Re: [Vision2020] No
Compassionate People? Just Look Around</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV>Sue,</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>If people were compassionate and caring we would not need programs like
"Doctors Without Boarders." We would not have had the shooting. We would have
a skilled and assisted care center in Moscow for the indigent. If
people cared those with disabilities would not be forced to live in the
grinding poverty of $660 a month. </DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>I think there is way too much suffering and the ignoring of suffering in
the world to say that people care. </DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>People in the county voted for $17,000,000 for additional education, but
it would not vote for $1 to keep its only indigent care facility in the
community. To me, that says a lot, it says that people don't care. Sell
Grandma's house for $1 and send her off. That to me says the county is full of
some pretty selfish heartless bastards. </DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>Proof is in the pudding. If people cared, there would not be all this
needless suffering and mistreatment of people in disadvantaged positions.
</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>Best,</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>Donovan<BR><BR><B><I>Sue Hovey <suehovey@moscow.com></I></B>
wrote:</DIV>
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<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Donovan,</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>A former student of mine was until a few months
ago an MD working with Doctors Without Borders. I send money to that
organization because it is a vivid reminder to me that people are
compassionate, are willing to use their skills, subject themselves to
possible harm, and sacrifice a very lucrative income because they are driven
to help others. I see many who give of themselves to those who are not
talented, pretty, young, cute, rich--those descriptors you
outlined. When you say nobody sheds a tear for the old, disabled, ill
and not so perfect, you are wrong. Not only do they shed tears, they
offer help. Isn't your life an example of one who works with the not
so perfect (and that fits most of us) to bring them comfort?
Why would you believe you are the exception and not the
rule?</FONT></DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Sue </FONT> </DIV>
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style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV>
<DIV
style="BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: black"><B>From:</B>
<A title=donovanjarnold2005@yahoo.com
href="mailto:donovanjarnold2005@yahoo.com">Donovan Arnold</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A title=suehovey@moscow.com
href="mailto:suehovey@moscow.com">Sue Hovey</A> ; <A
title=carlwestberg846@hotmail.com
href="mailto:carlwestberg846@hotmail.com">Carl Westberg</A> ; <A
title=vision2020@moscow.com
href="mailto:vision2020@moscow.com">vision2020@moscow.com</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Tuesday, May 29, 2007 9:25
PM</DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> Re: [Vision2020] Daily News:
"OUR VIEW: Dog fights have noplaceinsociety"</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV>Sue,</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>Sorry, but I don't think people do care about people. They care about
certain people, but they don't care about the people that need
the caring. They primarily only care about people that have current
or future value to them. When the talented, pretty, cute, young, rich and
the courageous are harmed the world cries Armageddon, while the old,
disabled, ill, and not so perfect are tossed to the side in
horrible conditions and nobody sheds a tear for their grinding poverty and
suffering. Sorry, I don't buy the notion that people truly care about
other people, by their fruits you shall know them. </DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>Best,</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>Donovan<BR><BR><B><I>Sue Hovey <suehovey@moscow.com></I></B>
wrote:</DIV>
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<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Now, Donovan, those concerns aren't
mutually exclusive, you know. It seems pretty self evident to me,
particularly after the events of the past week, the people on Vision
2020 are highly concerned about people as well as animals.
</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Sue </FONT></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE
style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV>
<DIV
style="BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: black"><B>From:</B>
<A title=donovanjarnold2005@yahoo.com
href="mailto:donovanjarnold2005@yahoo.com">Donovan Arnold</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A
title=carlwestberg846@hotmail.com
href="mailto:carlwestberg846@hotmail.com">Carl Westberg</A> ; <A
title=vision2020@moscow.com
href="mailto:vision2020@moscow.com">vision2020@moscow.com</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Tuesday, May 29, 2007 7:26
PM</DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> Re: [Vision2020] Daily
News: "OUR VIEW: Dog fights have noplaceinsociety"</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV>I am just curious, why are people concerned about the ethical
treatment of animals but not people?</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>Best,</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>Donovan<BR><BR><B><I>Carl Westberg <<A
href="mailto:carlwestberg846@hotmail.com">carlwestberg846@hotmail.com</A>></I></B>
wrote:</DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE class=replbq
style="PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #1010ff 2px solid">I
very recently read an article about dog fighting and how easy it is,
in <BR>rural areas, to conduct dog fights with very negligible risk
of being <BR>caught. Set it up deep in the woods, send out lookouts
miles away to give <BR>ample warning. Unfortunately, if our
legislators need hard evidence, merely <BR>because it hasn't been
found doesn't mean the ugly problem does not exist in <BR>our state.
48 other states have figured it out. There is no doubt an
<BR>element that thinks "what the hell, they're only dogs". I feel
sorry for <BR>those people. Thank you, Mr. Trail, for your efforts.
Carl Westberg Jr.<BR><BR><BR>>From: "Tom Hansen"
<THANSEN@MOSCOW.COM><BR>>To: "'Tom Trail'"
<TTRAIL@MOSCOW.COM><BR>>CC:
<CARLWESTBERG846@HOTMAIL.COM><BR>>Subject: RE: Re: [Vision2020]
Daily News: "OUR VIEW: Dog fights have no
<BR>>placeinsociety"<BR>>Date: Tue, 29 May 2007 16:50:19
-0700<BR>><BR>>Rep Trail -<BR>><BR>>It is apparent by
your response that mere articles and/or photos will not<BR>>shame
legislators into taking the high ground on this
matter.<BR>><BR>>As far as witnesses are concerned, I am
afraid that you would almost have <BR>>to<BR>>force somebody
that is already active in dog fighting to "roll over"
on<BR>>other dog fighting participants. As long as the penalty
amounts to nothing<BR>>more than a six-month jail term and giving
up their lunch money, the threat<BR>>of prosecution will not
force a potential witness' hand. Couple that with
<BR>>a<BR>>legislature that doesn't even feel it necessary to
require criminal checks<BR>>on potential day care center
employees and you have a recipe for a dog<BR>>fighting
haven.<BR>><BR>>Certainly there is something we here in Moscow
can do to help.<BR>><BR>>Tom Hansen<BR>>Moscow,
Idaho<BR>><BR>>"Don't tell my why I can't.<BR>>Show me how
I can."<BR>><BR>>- Author Unknown<BR>><BR>>-----Original
Message-----<BR>>From: Tom Trail
[mailto:ttrail@moscow.com]<BR>>Sent: Tuesday, May 29, 2007 3:31
PM<BR>>To: thansen@moscow.com<BR>>Subject: Fwd: Re:
[Vision2020] Daily News: "OUR VIEW: Dog fights have
no<BR>>placeinsociety"<BR>><BR>>Tom I'll be working with
the PNW Humane Society to try and get the<BR>>dog/gamecock felony
penalty introduced again this next session. We have<BR>>the
support from Bill Thompson who is the President of the Idaho
State<BR>>Prosecutors Association. Frankly to convince the hard
headed legislators<BR>>we need hard evidence that dog fighting
exists in Idaho--a witness, etc.<BR>>We haven't been able to come
up with this in four years. We have lots of<BR>>evidence on the
game cock arena.<BR>><BR>>Rep. Tom
Trail<BR>><BR>><BR>><BR>> >X-From_:
vision2020-bounces@moscow.com Tue May 29 15:17:06 2007<BR>>
>From: "Tom Hansen" <THANSEN@MOSCOW.COM><BR>> >To: "'Carl
Westberg'"
<CARLWESTBERG846@HOTMAIL.COM>,<BR>><VISION2020@MOSCOW.COM><BR>>
>Date: Tue, 29 May 2007 15:16:10 -0700<BR>> >Thread-Index:
AceiPDHDscunW4ERRUis7KoxQt62fQAAjvEg<BR>> >X-pstn-levels:
(S:99.90000/99.90000 R:95.9108 P:95.9108 M:97.0282
<BR>>C:98.6951<BR>>)<BR>> >Subject: Re: [Vision2020]
Daily News: "OUR VIEW: Dog fights have no<BR>> >
placeinsociety"<BR>> >X-BeenThere:
vision2020@moscow.com<BR>> >List-Id: Moscow/Latah county
community discussion list<BR>><VISION2020.MOSCOW.COM><BR>>
>List-Unsubscribe: <HTTP: mailman.fsr.com mailman listinfo
vision2020>,<BR>> >
<MAILTO:VISION2020-REQUEST@MOSCOW.COM?SUBJECT=UNSUBSCRIBE><BR>>
>List-Archive: <HTTP: mailman.fsr.com vision2020
pipermail><BR>> >List-Post:
<MAILTO:VISION2020@MOSCOW.COM><BR>> >List-Help:
<MAILTO:VISION2020-REQUEST@MOSCOW.COM?SUBJECT=HELP><BR>>
>List-Subscribe: <HTTP: mailman.fsr.com mailman listinfo
vision2020>,<BR>> >
<MAILTO:VISION2020-REQUEST@MOSCOW.COM?SUBJECT=SUBSCRIBE><BR>>
>Sender: vision2020-bounces@moscow.com<BR>> >X-pstn-levels:
(S:99.90000/99.90000 R:95.9108 P:95.9108<BR>> >M:97.0282
C:98.6951 )<BR>> ><BR>> >Carl et al -<BR>>
><BR>> >Rep Tom Trail has been campaigning for the past few
years to increase dog<BR>> >fighting to a felony. I have sent
him article after article depicting <BR>>how<BR>> >these
animals are mistreated and how (after they have outlived
their<BR>> >usefulness) they are simply tossed out into the
Idaho wilderness, often<BR>>with<BR>> >their brains fried
on gun powder and missing a limb.<BR>> ><BR>> >Perhaps
we should push for it locally as well.<BR>> ><BR>> >How
about it, Carl? Care to join me off-list and get this party
started?<BR>> ><BR>> >Tom Hansen<BR>> >Moscow,
Idaho<BR>> ><BR>> >-----Original Message-----<BR>>
>From: vision2020-bounces@moscow.com
<BR>>[mailto:vision2020-bounces@moscow.com]<BR>> >On Behalf
Of Carl Westberg<BR>> >Sent: Tuesday, May 29, 2007 2:56
PM<BR>> >To: vision2020@moscow.com<BR>> >Subject: Re:
[Vision2020] Daily News: "OUR VIEW: Dog fights have no<BR>>
>placeinsociety"<BR>> ><BR>> >If any good can come of
the Michael Vick story, it focuses our attention <BR>>of<BR>>
>what, according to experts, is a far more pervasive problem than
we know.<BR>> >If you can stomach it, Sports Illustrated has a
lengthy, if disturbing<BR>>story<BR>> ><BR>> >on the
dog fighting operation that Michael Vick is almost
certainly<BR>>involved<BR>> ><BR>> >in:<BR>>
>http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2007/football/nfl/05/29/vick0604/index.htm<BR>>l<BR>>
><BR>> > Why is dog fighting not a felony in Idaho? Carl
Westberg Jr.<BR>> ><BR>> ><BR>> >>From:
"Saundra Lund" <SSLUND@ROADRUNNER.COM><BR>> >>To:
<VISION2020@MOSCOW.COM><BR>> >>Subject: [Vision2020] Daily
News: "OUR VIEW: Dog fights have no place<BR>>
>>insociety"<BR>> >>Date: Tue, 29 May 2007 14:49:13
-0700<BR>> >><BR>> >>Visionaries:<BR>>
>><BR>> >>The following editorial appears in today's
Moscow-Pullman Daily News.<BR>> >><BR>> >>As an
aside, I served on the City of Moscow's Animal (Care and)
Control<BR>> >>Task<BR>> >>Force in 2005, and I
was shocked to find out from Lori Freeman from the<BR>>
>>Humane Society of the Palouse (HSOP) that we have dog
fighting right <BR>>here<BR>> >>in<BR>> >>Latah
County :-( Unlike the example of Virginia in the editorial,
<BR>>Idaho<BR>> >>CONTINUES to be one of only eight
states, IIRC, lacking any felony<BR>> >>provision<BR>>
>>for animal cruelty, no matter how heinous the cruelty
:-(<BR>> >><BR>> >><BR>> >>Saundra
Lund<BR>> >>Moscow, ID<BR>> >><BR>> >>The
only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good people to
<BR>>do<BR>> >>nothing.<BR>> >>- Edmund
Burke<BR>> >><BR>> >><BR>> >>"OUR VIEW:
Dog fights have no place in society<BR>> >>By Doug Bauer,
for the editorial board<BR>> >>May 29, 2007<BR>>
>><BR>> >>Brutality is as common in the world of
sports as home runs and <BR>>touchdowns.<BR>> >>In some
instances, such as ultimate fighting and even NASCAR, it's
the<BR>> > >primary reason many choose to watch the
sport.<BR>> >><BR>> >>Dog fighting is a far
different animal - no pun intended.<BR>> >><BR>>
>>The canines are pitted against one another in a battle that
is bloody,<BR>> >>inhumane and often deadly.<BR>>
>><BR>> >>There is absolutely nothing sporting about
that.<BR>> >><BR>> >>Police in Virginia are
investigating whether Atlanta Falcons quarterback<BR>>
>>Michael Vick was part of what appears to be an organized
dog-fighting<BR>>ring.<BR>> >>Dogs and equipment
associated with dog fighting were seized from a home<BR>>
>>owned by the NFL star earlier this year.<BR>>
>><BR>> >>Vick has denied any involvement, blaming
relatives for taking advantage <BR>>of<BR>> >>his
generosity and insisting he's rarely at the house, even though
he's<BR>>the<BR>> >>owner.<BR>> >><BR>>
>>Surry County Commonwealth Attorney Gerald Poindexter has
said as many as<BR>> >>six<BR>> >>to 10 people
could be involved. Dog fighting is a felony in Virginia.<BR>>
>><BR>> >>"I'm convinced from what I saw that dog
fighting has occurred down <BR>>there,<BR>> >>but who
was involved in it I don't know at this point," said
Poindexter,<BR>> >>noting that he saw what looked like
blood splatters in a room over a<BR>> >>garage.<BR>>
>><BR>> >>The splatters were the "most suggestive
evidence of dog fighting," he<BR>> >>added.<BR>>
>>"There were blood splatters, and somebody would have to
explain to me <BR>>how<BR>> >>you draw blood in the
normal training of pit bulls."<BR>> >><BR>> >>You
don't.<BR>> >><BR>> >>Dogs are commonly referred
to as man's best friend. Those who take part <BR>>in<BR>>
>>dog fighting - at any level - are hardly reciprocating that
friendship.<BR>> >><BR>> >>Dogs that are forced to
fight one another don't get a posh retirement<BR>>party<BR>>
>>when their fighting days are done. Many eventually are
euthanized, <BR>>either<BR>> >>due to their injuries or
because they're too aggressive.<BR>> >><BR>>
>>Some are put down simply because they're poor
fighters.<BR>> >><BR>> >>Vick plays in an arena
where opposing fans cheer for his demise. They <BR>>want<BR>>
>>to see him harassed, chased and sacked - maybe even
injured.<BR>> >><BR>> >>He's paid a great deal of
money for his efforts, and he usually gets up<BR>> >>after
he's been taken down.<BR>> >><BR>> >>Neither can
be said of the so-called sport police believe has been<BR>>
>>occurring<BR>> >>at his home."<BR>>
>><BR>> >><BR>>
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>=======================================================<BR>><BR>><BR>>--<BR>>Dr.
Tom Trail<BR>>International Trails<BR>>1375 Mt. View
Rd.<BR>>Moscow, Id. 83843<BR>>Tel: (208) 882-6077<BR>>Fax:
(208) 882-0896<BR>>e mail
ttrail@moscow.com<BR>><BR>><BR>><BR><BR>_________________________________________________________________<BR>PC
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