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<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>It was stated a few years ago and remains
valid today:<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>“We are not in <st1:country-region
w:st="on"><st1:place w:st="on">Iraq</st1:place></st1:country-region> because of
the terrorists. The terrorists are in <st1:country-region w:st="on"><st1:place
w:st="on">Iraq</st1:place></st1:country-region> because of us.”<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>We are now heavily militarily involved in
a theocratic civil war between the Suunis and Shiites. I feel that the
Al-Qaeda, being dominantly Suuni, are attracted to the Iraqi Suunis as they
both have a common cause.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><st1:country-region w:st="on"><font size=2 color=navy
face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Iran</span></font></st1:country-region><font
size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:navy'> does not want an unsettled <st1:country-region w:st="on"><st1:place
w:st="on">Iraq</st1:place></st1:country-region> any more than we do. An
unsettled <st1:country-region w:st="on">Iraq</st1:country-region> would result
in a massive exodus of refugees into <st1:country-region w:st="on"><st1:place
w:st="on">Iran</st1:place></st1:country-region>.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>We MUST sit down with <st1:country-region
w:st="on">Iran</st1:country-region>, <st1:country-region w:st="on">Iraq</st1:country-region>,
and <st1:country-region w:st="on">Syria</st1:country-region> as we did with the
<st1:place w:st="on">Soviet Union</st1:place> during the Cold War.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Tom Hansen<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><st1:place w:st="on"><st1:City w:st="on"><font size=2
color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:navy'>Moscow</span></font></st1:City><font size=2 color=navy
face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>, <st1:State
w:st="on">Idaho</st1:State></span></font></st1:place><font size=2 color=navy
face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
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<div>
<p><font size=2 color=navy face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:10.0pt;
color:navy'>***************************************************<br>
<br>
"Seldom, if ever, has a war ended leaving the victors with such a sense of
uncertainty and fear -- with such a realization that the future is obscure and
that survival is not assured."<br>
<br>
- Edward R. Murrow<br>
<br>
***************************************************</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal><b><font size=2 face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Tahoma;font-weight:bold'>From:</span></font></b><font size=2
face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'>
vision2020-bounces@moscow.com [mailto:vision2020-bounces@moscow.com] <b><span
style='font-weight:bold'>On Behalf Of </span></b>Nick Gier<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Sent:</span></b> Friday, December 15, 2006
12:51 PM<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>To:</span></b> Mark Solomon<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Cc:</span></b> vision2020@moscow.com<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Subject:</span></b> [Norton AntiSpam] Re:
[Vision2020] Mass Slaughter in <st1:country-region w:st="on"><st1:place w:st="on">Vietnam</st1:place></st1:country-region>?</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'>Hi Mark,<br>
<br>
Thanks for your comments. I am aware of some of these facts, but did not
know that Sihanouk has resigned. I hold no brief for him (his past cozy
relations with <st1:City w:st="on"><st1:place w:st="on">Beijing</st1:place></st1:City>
was nauseating) or the current leader. <br>
<br>
All that I'm saying is that the <st1:country-region w:st="on"><st1:place w:st="on">U.S.</st1:place></st1:country-region>
is very much responsible for the chaos that led to the rise of the Khmer Rouge,
and nothing you've said disputes that.<br>
<br>
Nick<br>
<br>
At 12:37 PM 12/15/2006 -0800, you wrote:<br>
<br>
<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'>Nick,<br>
<br>
<st1:country-region w:st="on"><st1:place w:st="on">Cambodia</st1:place></st1:country-region>
has been changing rapidly, for the worse, in the past few years. Sihanouk
resigned as King in an attempt to force political reform. He has been replaced
as King by one of his sons who spent most of his life in <st1:City w:st="on"><st1:place
w:st="on">Paris</st1:place></st1:City> and is a creature of the Prime
Minister. The PM, Hun Sen, is a former Khmer Rouge thug who "saw the
light" as the Vietnamese Armies were crossing the border and switched
allegiances. As partial payback for being given a country to own, Hun Sen
recently "negotiated" a new border with <st1:country-region w:st="on">Vietnam</st1:country-region>
which of course gives a good chunk of the highlands where the Montagnard tribe
lives to <st1:country-region w:st="on"><st1:place w:st="on">Vietnam</st1:place></st1:country-region>.
Needless to say, given the Montagnard/American history of the Vietnam War, the
Montagnards are in deep #$@%. The theoretical democracy is only that, a theory.
Hun Sen rules with absolute power, including its corollary, absolute
corruption. Opposition political leaders either are in exile or dead at Hun
Sen's hand. Until the foreign donor countries that prop up Hun Sen pull the
foreign aid plug, it will only get worse. <st1:country-region w:st="on">China</st1:country-region>
and <st1:country-region w:st="on"><st1:place w:st="on">Vietnam</st1:place></st1:country-region>
are now the largest donor countries followed by the EU.<br>
<br>
It's very sad. I spent several months there two years ago working/teaching
metal sculpture techniques to Khmer artists using decommissioned weapons,
mostly AK47s, for our raw material. A life changing experience for them, and
me.<br>
<br>
The best in-country source of news I know of is Khmer Intelligence:</span></font><font
size=4><span style='font-size:13.5pt'> <a
href="http://www.khmerintelligence.org/3Q2004.html" eudora=autourl>http://www.khmerintelligence.org/3Q2004.html</a></span></font><br>
<br>
the website is only sporadically maintained but you can subscribe to their
yahoo news group for periodic messages of the low down in <st1:country-region
w:st="on"><st1:place w:st="on">Cambodia</st1:place></st1:country-region>. Link
to subscribe from their website.<br>
<br>
Mark S.<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
At 10:17 AM -0800 12/15/06, <nickgier@adelphia.net> wrote:<br>
<br>
<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'>Greetings:<br>
<br>
Some more really wild claims from down the hill, this time about <st1:country-region
w:st="on"><st1:place w:st="on">Vietnam</st1:place></st1:country-region>.
Where is the evidence for mass slaughter in <st1:country-region w:st="on"><st1:place
w:st="on">Vietnam</st1:place></st1:country-region> after we left? Yes,
many were sent to reeducation camps, and many of those fleeing lost their lives
to pirates in the <st1:place w:st="on">South China Sea</st1:place>.<br>
<br>
More people are being killed, maimed, and born malformed by leftover munitions
and Agent Orange than ever lost their lives at the hands of the Communist
regime. I would also hazard to guess that we killed more Vietnamese (at
least one million) than the Viet Cong ever would have killed if we had not
intervened.<br>
<br>
Before we invaded <st1:country-region w:st="on"><st1:place w:st="on">Cambodia</st1:place></st1:country-region>,
the country was stable and ruled by Prince Sihanouk, who, along with his wife,
are now King and Queen of Cambodia. (When I was there in 2002, their
pictures were everywhere.) Our invasion, plus support for right-wing thugs,
alienated the people and forced them right into the hands of the Khmer Rouge.<br>
<br>
The Killing Fields are just as much our responsibility as theirs. The
great irony of course is that Communist Vietnamese troops defeated the Khmer
Rouge, and the UN had one of greatest successes in making elections possible
there.<br>
<br>
The Johns Hopkins report on Iraqi causalities, which looked at every single
death certificate (90 percent of households surveyed produced one), showed that
a majority of deaths occurred by coalition air strikes. This survey was
done before the upsurge in sectarian killings, mainly in <st1:City w:st="on"><st1:place
w:st="on">Baghdad</st1:place></st1:City>. Taking the low end of their
estimates at 400,000 dead, it would take Shias and Sunnis a very long time to
top Bush's slaughter.<br>
<br>
Yours for accurate history,<br>
<br>
Nick Gier<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'><br>
=======================================================<br>
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======================================================= <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'></x-sigsep><font size=2 face="Times New Roman"><span
style='font-size:10.0pt'><x-sigsep>"Truth is the summit of being; justice
is the application of it to human affairs."<br>
--Ralph Waldo Emerson<br>
<br>
"Abstract truth has no value unless it incarnates in human beings who
represent it, by proving their readiness to die for it."<br>
--Mohandas Gandhi<br>
<br>
"Modern physics has taught us that the nature of any system cannot be
discovered by dividing it into its component parts and studying each part by
itself. . . .We must keep our attention fixed on the whole and on the
interconnection between the parts. The same is true of our intellectual life.
It is impossible to make a clear cut between science, religion, and art. The
whole is never equal simply to the sum of its various parts." --Ma</span></font><font
size=1><span style='font-size:7.5pt'>x Planck<br>
<br>
</span></font>Nicholas F. Gier<br>
Professor Emeritus, Department of Philosophy, <st1:place w:st="on"><st1:PlaceType
w:st="on">University</st1:PlaceType> of <st1:PlaceName w:st="on">Idaho</st1:PlaceName></st1:place><br>
<st1:address w:st="on"><st1:Street w:st="on">1037 Colt Rd.</st1:Street>, <st1:City
w:st="on">Moscow</st1:City>, <st1:State w:st="on">ID</st1:State> <st1:PostalCode
w:st="on">83843</st1:PostalCode></st1:address><br>
<a href="http://users.adelphia.net/~nickgier/home.htm" eudora=autourl>http://users.adelphia.net/~nickgier/home.htm</a><br>
208-882-9212/FAX 885-8950<br>
President, <st1:State w:st="on"><st1:place w:st="on">Idaho</st1:place></st1:State>
Federation of Teachers, AFL-CIO<br>
<a href="http://users.adelphia.net/~nickgier/ift.htm" eudora=autourl>http://users.adelphia.net/~nickgier/ift.htm</a><o:p></o:p></p>
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