Jackie,<br> <br> If you are arguing the child molester's point of view and their request to be released, are you not supporting them?<br> <br> Best,<br> <br> DJA<br><br><b><i>J Ford <privatejf32@hotmail.com></i></b> wrote:<blockquote class="replbq" style="border-left: 2px solid rgb(16, 16, 255); margin-left: 5px; padding-left: 5px;"> That is NOT defending their actions, DJA...it is ARGUING the prisoner's new <br>point of view and new request(s).<br><br>HUGE difference.<br><br><br>J :]<br><br><br><br><br><br>>From: Donovan Arnold <donovanjarnold2005 @yahoo.com=""><br>>To: J Ford <privatejf32 @hotmail.com="">, vision2020@moscow.com<br>>Subject: [Vision2020] Reponse to Jackie and Wayne<br>>Date: Sat, 16 Sep 2006 23:44:51 -0700 (PDT)<br>><br>>J,<br>><br>> It is legally possible to defend child molesters AFTER a conviction. <br>>They go to trial and visit a judge later after their conviction, for early <br>>release and the ability
to get in a car unsupervised, and go to work, <br>>church, a doctor, etc, their lawyers are the ones that get them those <br>>rights. I don't think they should be able to travel or be released <br>>unsupervised. You are free to disagree.<br>><br>> Second, Sunil and others do defend convicted child molesters. They admit <br>>so much.<br>><br>> Wayne,<br>><br>> Perhaps you can outline for V2020 what rights you think convicted child <br>>molesters should have? Perhaps you can explain why an unsupervised release <br>>of a convicted child molester takes precedence over that of the safety of <br>>the general public? And why these rights of self admitted and convicted <br>>child molesters get support and public dollars while millions of other <br>>poor, elderly, and disabled plights for justice go unheard?<br>><br>> Best,<br>><br>> _DJA<br>><br>>J Ford <privatejf32 @hotmail.com=""> wrote:
DJA:<br>><br>>You can not "defend" a convicted anyone. You may defend ACCUSED criminals,<br>>but you can not defend someone that is already convicted. "Defending a<br>>convicted person during sentencing" is NOT defending them so much as<br>>presenting reasons for a convicted person's actions, reasons to be lenient<br>>and people who speak up about the defendant's character. The attorney does<br>>NOT defend at sentencing.<br>><br>>Secondly - couch it anyway you want, you HAVE said Sunil (and others) are<br>>defenders of terrorists and child molesters. Considering your penchant for<br>>standing up for the kirkers and Dougie, this is rather like the pot calling<br>>the kettle black. Well, ok - the pot calling the stainless steel kettle<br>>black, considering Sunil is NOT the one hiding molesters in his midst or<br>>writing them letters to reduce their sentence because "he just did not<br>>understand what he was doing was wrong
or would be seen as wrong by<br>>society."<br>><br>>And slander is a legal term used to say "You said something you KNOW was<br>>wrong for the purpose of committing damage to a person's reputation".<br>>Sounds like what you do on a daily basis, certainly in view of your opinion<br>>of Sunil.<br>><br>>Have you ever met him, BTW? Have you had dealings with him that did not<br>>turn out the way you wanted? I mean, just what is your problem with him?<br>>Or is it any lawyer that you do not like?<br>><br>>J :]<br>><br>><br>><br>><br>><br>> >From: Donovan Arnold<br>> >To: Sunil Ramalingam , vision2020@moscow.com<br>> >Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Sunil and His Defense of Terrorists<br>> >andConvictedChild Molesters<br>> >Date: Sat, 16 Sep 2006 14:02:45 -0700 (PDT)<br>> ><br>> >J,<br>> ><br>> > I never stated that Sunil supports terrorism and child molestation,
<br>>that<br>> >is preposterous, re-read what I wrote. I said he defends those that do.<br>> ><br>> > Keely,<br>> ><br>> > The definition of slander is the saying of something that is false <br>>and<br>> >damaging. If it is true, it isn't slander. Sunil himself admits to<br>> >defending convicted child molesters:<br>> ><br>> ><br>> >"It is true that I defend convicted child molesters at sentencing<br>> ><br>> >hearings that occur after a client has been convicted by a jury"<br>> ><br>> > Sunil Ramalingam--<br>> >http://mailman.fsr.com/pipermail/vision2020/2006-September/035436.html<br>> ><br>> ><br>> > Sunil,<br>> ><br>> > I am not going to try and argue with you. For you are the master of<br>> >convincing the jury that the Sun really rises in the West depending on<br>> >ones point of view.<br>> ><br>> > I
am sure that you can argue that I got the context wrong in some of<br>> >your posts, but after 20+ such posts over 2.5 years it is hard to write<br>> >all them off.<br>> ><br>> >FYI, I did support Sami Omar. He was living in UI Family Housing at the<br>> >time he was abducted. I represented Family Housing in the UI student<br>> >government at the time. I defended Sami in student council and even<br>> >brought his family there, which was even aired on public television. I<br>> >kept in contact with John Dickinson about what was going at the trial in<br>> >Boise. That case is different, because it was a domestic case and there<br>> >was no evidence whatsoever that Sami was a terrorist, in fact it all<br>> >pointed in the opposite direction. Further, Sami was not saying he was<br>> >planning on killing Americans when he gets out like those detained<br>> >overseas. And, at least one member
of Sami's family was born right here <br>>in<br>> >Moscow.<br>> ><br>> > I don't think the government can detain someone forever without at <br>>least<br>> >trying to find out if someone is guilty. But letting them go if they say<br>> >"Death to America" is just to risky when they are capable of acting on <br>>it.<br>> ><br>> > My disagreement with you Sunil, is that you clearly are brilliant, yet<br>> >rather than using your talents to defend victims in our society, you use<br>> >your wit and experience to defend convicted child molesters.<br>> ><br>> > I am not arguing you are not doing your job, or you are not good at <br>>it.<br>> >I am arguing that your job should be something more productive and<br>> >meaningful then the release of child molesters and the scum of the earth<br>> >when you know they are guilty.<br>> ><br>> > I am sure you with your
big brain will justify that in your own mind.<br>> >But I think anyone with a heart will ask WHY the child molesters get a<br>> >good lawyer and trial when there are so many other more deserving and<br>> >wronged people with their rights being stepped on. They should be a <br>>higher<br>> >priority to you and any lawyer concerned about justice.<br>> ><br>> > Best,<br>> ><br>> > _DJA<br>> ><br>> >Sunil Ramalingam wrote: Tom,<br>> ><br>> >It is true that I defend convicted child molesters at sentencing hearings<br>> >that occur after a client has been convicted by a jury (or a judge in<br>> >juvenile cases) at the sentencing hearing and in subsequent legal<br>> >proceedings, or at a post-conviction hearing filed by a client who is<br>> >usually in prison. If a convicted child molester is charged with a new<br>> >crime, then I may defend that person. As a
public defender I don't judge<br>> >my<br>> >clients; there is no shortage of people ready to do this (regardless of <br>>how<br>> >much or how little information they have about the crime or the criminal)<br>> >and it's not my place or job to do so. I try to represent them to the <br>>best<br>> >of my ability, and I don't apologize for this.<br>> ><br>> >I have never represented a convicted terrorist as a lawyer, though I <br>>would<br>> >were I to be appointed to do so or if I were retained to do so. I did<br>> >represent a witness in Sami al Hussein's case, and am happy I was able to<br>> >offer him assistance. Perhaps Donovan would like to insult me for doing<br>> >so.<br>> ><br>> >As one who believes our judicial system has underlying principles, I<br>> >believe<br>> >that all people who are held have the right to due process and a fair and<br>> >proper hearing.
I do not believe that we have the right to imprison<br>> >people,<br>> >no matter what we label them, forever, or to try them in kangaroo courts.<br>> >This is a defense of legal principle and human rights. I consider it a<br>> >defense of our country, and the notion that we have enduring principles<br>> >These are beliefs that Donovan neither shares nor supports. He is a fan <br>>of<br>> >expedience.<br>> ><br>> >Though Donovan does not support the Iraq war, he appears to find the Bush<br>> >Administration infallible once they arrest or confine a Muslim. At that<br>> >point he believes it is appropriate to hold that person indefinately. I<br>> >find this position shameful and disgusting, and Donovan finds me <br>>repugnant<br>> >because of this, I am willing to live with the loss of his approval.<br>> ><br>> >It is interesting to note the subject line of Donovan's most recent
post.<br>> >He has claimed he only attacks those who attack him. Most recently he<br>> >incorrectly made fun of Keely's spelling; I asked him if he wanted the <br>>same<br>> >done to him. Since we all post all too quickly, we all make spelling<br>> >errors, and few of us would really want to have our own posts criticized<br>> >for<br>> >our typos. This is the point I was making.<br>> ><br>> >Donovan, in the thoughtful and Christian response we have all learned so<br>> >well, responds by attacking my character in a way that has the smallest<br>> >germ<br>> >of truth but is intended to be a slur. I have written him offline and<br>> >pointed out that hatred of Middle Easterners has often resulted in racial<br>> >slurs and threats being directed towards me; I have told him that I<br>> >consider<br>> >his calling me a defender of terrorists could actually be harmful to me.<br>>
>You see the effect (or is it 'affect' Donovan?) my request has had on <br>>him.<br>> ><br>> >Of course, this is the man, or aging adolescent, who has suggested it <br>>would<br>> >benefit the gene pool if children were to die playing in construction <br>>sites<br>> >that should be off-limits if their parents fail to provide proper<br>> >supervision, so I would be foolish to expect better of him.<br>> ><br>> >Sunil<br>> ><br>> ><br>> > >From: "Tom Hansen"<br>> > >To: "'Donovan Arnold'" , "'Sunil<br>> > >Ramalingam'" ,<br>> > >Subject: RE: [Vision2020] Sunil and His Defense of Terrorists and<br>> > >ConvictedChild Molesters<br>> > >Date: Sat, 16 Sep 2006 07:05:37 -0700<br>> > ><br>> > >Arnold -<br>> > ><br>> > ><br>> > ><br>> > >Your statement, here on a public listserve, that Sunil Ramalingam
<br>>defends<br>> > >convicted child molesters and convicted terrorists, reflects upon your<br>> >lack<br>> > >of maturity and sense of decency, and in virtually all litigious <br>>circles<br>> > >maybe considered libelous.<br>> > ><br>> > ><br>> > ><br>> > >Name ONE convicted child molester which Sunil has defended!<br>> > ><br>> > ><br>> > ><br>> > >Name ONE convicted terrorist which Sunil has defended!<br>> > ><br>> > ><br>> > ><br>> > >Failing either of these requests, you owe Sunil a VERY meaningful and<br>> >VERY<br>> > >public apology.<br>> > ><br>> > ><br>> > ><br>> > >Tom Hansen<br>> > ><br>> > >Vandalville, Idaho<br>> > ><br>> ><br>> ><br>> >=======================================================<br>> > List services
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