Joe,<br> <br> It is illogical. But not for the reasons you stated. You cut my argument in half and ignored the most important half. <br> <br> It is illogical to be against the unnecessary torture and pain of a creature, and not be against abortion when it is not necessary, because it does cause unnecessary torture and pain of a creature, regardless of how you define that current status of that creature, it feels pain and is a creature. <br> <br> I am not saying anything about criminalizing it or not. I am against abortion, but I am for keeping it legal, for reasons I won't get into in this email. <br> <br> Members of PeTA, and other animal rights groups main claim in all their arguments is that the animals feel pain. Well, so do fetuses getting aborted. If they wish to make the claim that a worm, fish, or bird is a person and that is why they deserve to live, then I just say let them make that claim, but I don't think many would agree with the logic
of that argument either. The only sound argument, and the one I agree with when it comes to treating all life with respect, is that animals should not experience pain when it is unnecessary in the production of the goods we are extracting from them or in their death process. Humans may be animals, but animals are not humans. <br> <br> In fact, there is more physiological scientificially conclusive evidence that a fetus experiencing an abortion feels more pain and stress than that of a duck being forced fed. <br> <br> The second issue I wish you to address, is that you stated you will not be eating this duck liver because of their mistreatment. Well, does that also mean that you are going to stop eating fish, chicken, pigs, turkey, and cows (beef)? They are also horribly tortured and suffer for much longer periods of time then the 15-18 days of forced fed ducks and geese. Or is it just easier to pick on one business serving one bird? How about the senseless
torture of lobster and shellfish? Or for that matter protesting establishments that sell fly swatters, fishing tackle, and wasp spray? <br> <br> Best,<br> <br> _DJA<br> <br> <br> <br><b><i>Joe Campbell <joekc@adelphia.net></i></b> wrote:<blockquote class="replbq" style="border-left: 2px solid rgb(16, 16, 255); margin-left: 5px; padding-left: 5px;"> Donovan,<br><br>You wrote: "it is illogical to be opposed to the torture of animals and be for abortion." This is incorrect. <br><br>Some animal rights activists think that animals are persons -- have rights -- yet also believe that no fetus is a person. You might disagree with this view (I do) but it is not "illogical." <br><br>Also, it is not illogical to suppose that the prolonged torture of any animal is wrong but that it is sometimes permissible to kill a fetus, for instance when the mother's life is in danger. One might hold this view and be "for abortion" in the sense that one is against making
abortion illegal. This is close to my own view and it is not "illogical."<br><br>One last comment which didn't occur to me when I wrote my previous post. It is silly to talk about being "for abortion" or "against abortion." Abortion is just the killing of a fetus. No one would ever say that they were "for killing" and few people are willing to live with the consequences of being "against killing."<br><br>Best, Joe<br><br>---- Donovan Arnold <donovanjarnold2005 @yahoo.com=""> wrote: <br><br>=============<br>Doug makes a good point.<br> <br> If you are opposed to the killing and/or torture of any animal, which is the bases for fighting against eating some types of animals. Why not be against abortion? Even if it is not a "human being" to some people's definitions, it certainly can feel pain and suffer as it is being aborted. I don't expect an answer from that because it is illogical to be opposed to the torture of animals and be for abortion.<br> <br>
Best,<br> <br> _DJA<br><br>Andreas Schou <ophite @gmail.com=""> wrote: On 8/26/06, heirdoug@netscape.net wrote:<br>><br>> Joe,<br>><br>> I'm still wondering if you have had any more thoughts about my<br>> comparison and my challenge to you, Saundra and Megan and any others<br>> who still think that human life begins after birth.<br><br>Doug --<br><br>If there is a moral equivalency between a fetus and an infant, why are<br>the Biblical punishments for causing the death of an fetus and causing<br>the death of a child so radically different?<br><br>-- ACS<br><br>> Time to put your money where your mouth is. It's only $50.00 a month<br>> and I know that they could use it.<br>><br>> Doug!<br>><br>> ________________________________________________________________________<br>> Check Out the new free AIM(R) Mail -- 2 GB of storage and<br>> industry-leading spam and email virus protection.<br>><br>>
=======================================================<br>> List services made available by First Step Internet,<br>> serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.<br>> http://www.fsr.net<br>> mailto:Vision2020@moscow.com<br>> =======================================================<br><br>=======================================================<br> List services made available by First Step Internet, <br> serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994. <br> http://www.fsr.net <br> mailto:Vision2020@moscow.com<br>=======================================================<br><br><br> <br>---------------------------------<br>Do you Yahoo!?<br> Next-gen email? Have it all with the all-new Yahoo! Mail.<br></ophite></donovanjarnold2005></blockquote><br><p> 
<hr size=1>Do you Yahoo!?<br>
Get on board. <a href="http://us.rd.yahoo.com/evt=40791/*http://advision.webevents.yahoo.com/mailbeta">You're invited</a> to try the new Yahoo! Mail.