<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
<HTML><HEAD>
<META http-equiv=Content-Type content="text/html; charset=iso-8859-1">
<META content="MSHTML 6.00.2800.1561" name=GENERATOR>
<STYLE></STYLE>
</HEAD>
<BODY bgColor=#ffffff>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>D-</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>how do you know whether someone accused of being a
terrorist, actually is one? As is common with combatants in guerilla wars,
today's terrorists do not differentiate themselves from the regular population
by wearing a uniform or painting a big red T on their foreheads.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>In the first chaotic days of the "War of Terror"
hundreds of people were taken from Afganistan and Pakistan and other countries
and brought to Guantanamo. How many were terrorists? How many were
average guys in the wrong place at the wrong time? Why not give them a
trial to discover the answer?</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Why do you suddenly discard the "innocent until
proven guilty" rule?</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>And much more importantly, why do you condemn Sunil
as a terrorist-supporter for asking those same questions?</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>BL</FONT></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE
style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV>
<DIV
style="BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: black"><B>From:</B>
<A title=donovanjarnold2005@yahoo.com
href="mailto:donovanjarnold2005@yahoo.com">Donovan Arnold</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A title=sunilramalingam@hotmail.com
href="mailto:sunilramalingam@hotmail.com">Sunil Ramalingam</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Cc:</B> <A title=vision2020@moscow.com
href="mailto:vision2020@moscow.com">vision2020@moscow.com</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Tuesday, August 22, 2006 1:22
PM</DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> Re: [Vision2020] stop the false
accusations against Sunil</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>Sunil has stated repeatedly, that he believes that if we cannot
find each and every terrorist guilty of a crime by a trial, we should let them
go. Since it is not possible to try every terrorist and get a conviction, and
he knows this, and we cannot detain them otherwise, Sunil is suggesting we let
many of them go. I think that is supporting the terrorists. Creating a
situation where the US military cannot defend us by placing the new and
unprecedented restriction of a trial and conviction for every foreign enemy
combatant shooting at us before we can lock them up until the conflict is
over, cannot be anything but favoring the enemy. <BR><BR>I think that Sunil is
dead right in his disagreement with Bush on foreign policy for opposing
torture.. But deadly wrong in making sure every enemy of the United States
gets a full paid trial on us before we can defend the country.
<BR><BR>Best,<BR><BR>_DJA<BR><BR><BR><BR><BR><BR><BR><BR> <BR><BR><BR><BR><B><I>Sunil
Ramalingam <sunilramalingam@hotmail.com></I></B> wrote:
<BLOCKQUOTE class=replbq
style="PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: rgb(16,16,255) 2px solid">I've
tried not to post responses to Donovan after Roger's comments a couple
<BR>of weeks ago, but I'm sick of his crap. First he and now Tony have made
the <BR>irresponsible and incorrect statements that I support terrorists or
<BR>terrorism; certainly Donovan has made the claim that I only defend
<BR>terrorists and sworn enemies of the U.S.<BR><BR>I have tried to explain
to Donovan offline with no success that I oppose the <BR>prison in
Guantanimo; I oppose the war in Iraq; I oppose the torture of <BR>prisoners
and the abandonment of the Geneva Convention; I oppose this
<BR>administration's foreign policy. As far as I know, we're still allowed
to <BR>object to our govenrnment's actions. If he wants to say that means I
defend <BR>terrorists, then he's going to do that, but he's not going to be
able to <BR>defend his lies with anything I've said.<BR><BR>I do object to
Donovan's lies about me. I think he's making dangerous and <BR>irresponsible
statements about me, and I don't think I should have to sit <BR>here and put
up with them. Sure, I could say no one takes anything he says <BR>seriously,
but I have no idea who might come across his swill and believe
<BR>it.<BR><BR>I never mentioned Tony's wife in my post. If Donovan read
that in my post I <BR>have to question his literacy.<BR><BR>Tony told me I
was not allowed to change the subject, and I made the <BR>apparently
incomprehensible joke that he mistook himself for my wife. <BR>Donovan, get
your big reading book and look up 'pronouns.' I did not and <BR>would not
make fun of Tony's wife. I don't know if he's married and don't
<BR>care.<BR><BR>Tony, I have never said I think I'm intellectually superior
to you. Quit <BR>being so sensitive. I won't be comparing myself to Lincoln,
and I'm no <BR>fancy pants lawyer. I don't think of myself as one, and I
don't think I'm <BR>better than anyone else because I'm a lawyer. But if you
make incorrect <BR>statements about a legal issue, after a while I'm going
to point that out to <BR>you, as I did with your First Amendment statements
some time ago, and as <BR>with your recent statements about freedom of
expression.<BR><BR>Sunil<BR><BR><BR>>From: Donovan Arnold
<DONOVANJARNOLD2005 @yahoo.com=""><BR>>To: Joe Campbell <JOEKC
@adelphia.net="">, Tony Simpson <BR>><TONYTIME
@clearwire.net=""><BR>>CC: vision2020@moscow.com<BR>>Subject: Re:
[Vision2020] stop the false accusations against Sunil<BR>>Date: Tue, 22
Aug 2006 11:56:09 -0700 (PDT)<BR>><BR>>Sunil attacked Tony and made a
reference to his wife. Why aren't you <BR>>condemning that Joe? Is making
references to people's relatives that you <BR>>don't like now acceptable
if the person is not a liberal, Joe. Appears to <BR>>be the
case.<BR>><BR>> I hope others join me in condemning attacks on
people's relatives and <BR>>spouses, and not defend people that do
so.<BR>><BR>> I never said Sunil supported Terrorism, Joe. I said he
defends <BR>>terrorists. Which he has done repeatedly. One can defend the
person <BR>>without condoning the actions of that person.<BR>><BR>>
Best,<BR>><BR>> _DJA<BR>><BR>>Joe Campbell <JOEKC
@adelphia.net="">wrote: Tony,<BR>><BR>>It is one thing to call Sunil
offensive names and accuse him of being an <BR>>elitist. The first is
just childish and the second merely indicates that <BR>>you just don't
know Sunil. Both of these sorts of things only make me
<BR>>laugh.<BR>><BR>>But in our contemporary context it is just
plain irresponsible and wrong <BR>>to suggest in anyway that Sunil is a
supporter of terrorism. Both you and <BR>>Donovan have made this absurd
accusation -- neither one of you even <BR>>attempting to support the
claim in any way. You need to get a grip.<BR>><BR>>I hope that others
will join me in condemning these kinds of
accusations.<BR>><BR>>--<BR>>Joe Campbell<BR>><BR>>---- Tony
Simpson wrote:<BR>><BR>>=============<BR>>Suenil: Yep pal, I need
to go and "oppress someone."<BR>><BR>>Anyone who supports terrorists
instead of his own country I will oppress.<BR>>Anyone who revels in
rubbing everyone else's nose in his supposed<BR>>intellectual superiority
I will oppress. Anyone who sees no injustice in<BR>>the premeditated
murder of the innocent, I will oppress. Anyone who tries<BR>>to deny
freedom of expression to those with whom they disagree, I
will<BR>>oppress. Anyone who wishes to weaken or destroy the institutions
that have<BR>>held civilization together, I will
oppress.<BR>><BR>>So get used to it Lawyer Man, I'm not going
anywhere.<BR>><BR>>Despising arrogant and smug elitists,
--TONY<BR>>----- Original Message -----<BR>>From: "Sunil
Ramalingam"<BR>>Cc:<BR>>Sent: Tuesday, August 22, 2006 7:24
AM<BR>>Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Celebrate
freedom<BR>><BR>><BR>> > Tony,<BR>> ><BR>> > You're
the one who brings up my law degree, not me. Since you inquired<BR>> >
about how I passed the bar, I thought I'd answer you.<BR>> ><BR>>
> If you're well-informed, Tony, you're hiding your light under a
bushel.<BR>> > Now<BR>> > I'll get out of your hair; you
probably need to go oppress someone.<BR>> ><BR>> > Sunil<BR>>
><BR>> ><BR>> >>From: "Tony Simpson"<BR>> >>To:
"Sunil Ramalingam"<BR>> >>CC:<BR>> >>Subject: Re:
[Vision2020] Celebrate freedom<BR>> >>Date: Mon, 21 Aug 2006
23:02:33 -0700<BR>> >><BR>> >>Sunil,<BR>>
>><BR>> >>Me mistaking myself for your wife? I'm afraid I
have absolutely no idea<BR>> >>what you are talking about. But pal,
that equation would NEVER work out<BR>> >>THAT way. The reason for
the "hon" comment is old news, weren't you<BR>> >>paying<BR>>
>>attention councilor?<BR>> >><BR>> >>Ya' know, Your
fancy pants law degree really doesn't mean SHIT to me,<BR>>
>>Sunil. Abraham Lincoln had no formal schooling yet he was as
brilliant <BR>>and<BR>> >>persuasive as any "credentialed" man
of his time. As it is with you and<BR>> >>I.<BR>> >>We are
both very well informed, just not necessarily in the same exact<BR>>
>>areas. You could really do with a dose of humility, Mr.
Constitutional<BR>> >>law<BR>> >>hotshot.<BR>>
>><BR>> >>Now go sue somebody or something..... -Tony<BR>>
>>----- Original Message ----- From: "Sunil Ramalingam"<BR>>
>><BR>> >>Cc:<BR>> >>Sent: Monday, August 21, 2006
8:36 PM<BR>> >>Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Celebrate freedom<BR>>
>><BR>> >><BR>> >>>For someone who comes across
as a homophobe, Tony, it's odd to find you<BR>> >>>mistaking
yourself for my wife. However, it prepared me for finding
<BR>>your<BR>> >>>response to Andreas and your use of the
endearment, 'Hon,' for him. <BR>>Hey,<BR>> >>>not that
there's anything wrong with it, but does his wife know about<BR>>
>>>this?<BR>> >>><BR>> >>>But since you're
neither she nor the boss of me, I guess I'm allowed to<BR>>
>>>change the subject.<BR>> >>><BR>> >>>I
will give you one clue about how I passed the bar exam, since you<BR>>
>>>brought<BR>> >>>it up: On the Constitutional law
section, I discussed the established<BR>> >>>law<BR>>
>>>of the United States, not the imagined law and jurisprudence of
Tony<BR>> >>>Simpson. Until you're the Fuhrer, I will recommend
this approach to<BR>> >>>those<BR>> >>>preparing for
that exam.<BR>> >>><BR>> >>>I understand that you
oppose flag burning. That puts you with almost <BR>>the<BR>>
>>>entire population of the United States, since this hardly ever
happens.<BR>> >>>I've never seen it in person; have you? But
saying it's not speech <BR>>does<BR>> >>>not<BR>>
>>>make you right, even if you say it in multiple posts. It's also
pretty<BR>> >>>ineffective speech, but speech it still
is.<BR>> >>><BR>> >>>Sunil<BR>>
>>><BR>> >>><BR>> >>>>From: "Tony
Simpson"<BR>> >>>>To: "Sunil Ramalingam"<BR>>
>>>>CC:<BR>> >>>>Subject: Re: [Vision2020]
Celebrate freedom<BR>> >>>>Date: Mon, 21 Aug 2006 10:29:17
-0700<BR>> >>>><BR>> >>>>Sunil,<BR>>
>>>><BR>> >>>>No, you are not going to be allowed
to change the subject. Address my<BR>> >>>>point about the
difference between license and freedom.<BR>> >>>><BR>>
>>>>Standing in opposition to double talking lawyers,
--Tony<BR>> >>>>----- Original Message ----- From: "Sunil
Ramalingam"<BR>> >>>><BR>> >>>>Cc:<BR>>
>>>>Sent: Monday, August 21, 2006 9:44 AM<BR>>
>>>>Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Celebrate freedom<BR>>
>>>><BR>> >>>><BR>> >>><BR>>
>>><BR>>
>>>=======================================================<BR>>
>>>List services made available by First Step Internet,<BR>>
>>>serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.<BR>>
>>> http://www.fsr.net<BR>> >>>
mailto:Vision2020@moscow.com<BR>>
>>>=======================================================<BR>>
>>><BR>> >>><BR>> >><BR>> >><BR>>
><BR>> ><BR>> >
=======================================================<BR>> > List
services made available by First Step Internet,<BR>> > serving the
communities of the Palouse since 1994.<BR>> >
http://www.fsr.net<BR>> > mailto:Vision2020@moscow.com<BR>> >
=======================================================<BR>> ><BR>>
><BR>><BR>><BR>>=======================================================<BR>>
List services made available by First Step Internet,<BR>> serving the
communities of the Palouse since 1994.<BR>> http://www.fsr.net<BR>>
mailto:Vision2020@moscow.com<BR>>=======================================================<BR>><BR>>=======================================================<BR>>
List services made available by First Step Internet,<BR>> serving the
communities of the Palouse since 1994.<BR>> http://www.fsr.net<BR>>
mailto:Vision2020@moscow.com<BR>>=======================================================<BR>><BR>><BR>><BR>>---------------------------------<BR>>Stay
in the know. Pulse on the new Yahoo.com. Check it
out.<BR><BR><BR>>=======================================================<BR>>
List services made available by First Step Internet,<BR>> serving the
communities of the Palouse since 1994.<BR>> http://www.fsr.net<BR>>
mailto:Vision2020@moscow.com<BR>>=======================================================<BR><BR><BR>=======================================================<BR>List
services made available by First Step Internet, <BR>serving the communities
of the Palouse since 1994. <BR>http://www.fsr.net
<BR>mailto:Vision2020@moscow.com<BR>=======================================================<BR></JOEKC></TONYTIME></JOEKC></DONOVANJARNOLD2005></BLOCKQUOTE><BR>
<P>
<HR SIZE=1>
<A
href="http://us.rd.yahoo.com/evt=43257/*http://advision.webevents.yahoo.com/mailbeta">All-new
Yahoo! Mail </A>- Fire up a more powerful email and get things done faster.
<P>
<HR>
<P></P>=======================================================<BR> List
services made available by First Step Internet, <BR> serving the
communities of the Palouse since 1994.
<BR>
http://www.fsr.net
<BR>
mailto:Vision2020@moscow.com<BR>=======================================================</BLOCKQUOTE></BODY></HTML>