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<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Mr. Rumelhart brings up an interesting point when
he says,"<FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3>Freedom of Speech is not a
piecemeal concept. It has to be all or nothing. The minute you start
limiting it, it's usefulness in all areas goes right out the door. Look at
"hate speech". This concept is becoming broader by the second in our PC
society.<FONT face=Arial size=2>" It would seem that the folks who would be the
first to defend someone's right to burn our flag would loudly howl if a
disparaging term was used by someone to express an "unapproved" opinion with
regard to minorities, women, homosexuals, food animals, or what have you.
These "patriots" are mighty quick to celebrate diversity and dissent
as long as its the right kind. Gore their ox and their much yapped about
tolerance flies out the window. </FONT></FONT></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>gc</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV></FONT>
<BLOCKQUOTE
style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV>
<DIV
style="BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: black"><B>From:</B>
<A title=godshatter@yahoo.com href="mailto:godshatter@yahoo.com">Paul
Rumelhart</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A title=vision2020@moscow.com
href="mailto:vision2020@moscow.com">vision2020@moscow.com</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Sunday, August 20, 2006 9:19
PM</DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> Re: [Vision2020] Celebrate
freedom, kick a flag--burner's ass!</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>I'm sure you've heard all these reasons before, but I'll
outline a few just in case you've missed them.<BR><BR>- Burning the American
flag falls under Freedom of Speech. Yes, it's not "speech" per se, but
the courts have extended the concept of "speech" to cover most forms of
expression, not just the spoken word.<BR><BR>- Freedom of Speech is not a
piecemeal concept. It has to be all or nothing. The minute you
start limiting it, it's usefulness in all areas goes right out the door.
Look at "hate speech". This concept is becoming broader by the second in
our PC society.<BR><BR>- Burning a flag is an expression of dissent. Of
all types of speech, the expressions of dissent are in most need of
protection. Without it, you have a tyrrany.<BR><BR>- Freedom is
difficult. If you give someone the freedom to say whatever they like,
they may say something that annoys or disgusts or offends you. That is
the price of freedom. For example, I wish that people would stop burning
the American flag; it just leads to emotion-driven reactions instead of
rational, thoughtful reactions. However, they have the right to express
their dissent in whatever way they choose whether I like it or not.
Freedom is worth it, though.<BR><BR>- Even if you can in no way think that
this administration has done anything that people should be making such
politically-charged statements like burning the flag, what about the next
one? Or the next? What if your worst nightmare came into
office? I don't know for you if that's Hillary Clinton, Butch Otter, the
Antichrist, or Marilyn Manson - but whoever it is, what if you did not have
the freedom to express your dissent? What if they changed all the rules
and made this country into whatever it is you fear they will make it
into?<BR><BR>- Being a patriot does not mean cowtowing to whoever is in
charge. What if our founding fathers thought that way? The
Constitution is a document of checks and balances. Freedom of Speech and
the Right to Bear Arms are two powerful tools we have been given to use as
checks against a government that might get out of control.<BR><BR>- Assaulting
someone (or is it battery? I get them confused) is orders of magnitude
worse than an expression of dissent. There you are treading on the
rights of another individual. The fact that you don't see an
overwhelming difference between the two of them frightens me.<BR><BR>Anyway,
I'm sure there are others. I'm also sure you actually agree with some of
them to some extent or you wouldn't be proud to live here.
<BR><BR>Paul<BR><BR>- <BR><BR>Tony Simpson wrote:
<BLOCKQUOTE cite=mid007201c6c4c9$82d69790$298ae942@simpson type="cite"><PRE wrap="">Leave it to a subversive Hippie like Bill London to praise those who would
burn the American flag. Pathetic and loathsome. Flower child London says,
"If I chose to desecrate a flag by burning it in an open place.... so what?
That is free speech."
What pure, unadulterated horseshit! There is no speech involved in such a
juvenile, thoughtless, ungrateful and snotnosed activity. It is
unpatriotic, typically liberal acting out. If that is free speech, Billy
Boy, then it would be free speech for me to walk up to said burner and bury
my boot a foot up his terrorist--enabling ass!
Sick to death of America's domestic enemies, --TONY
----- Original Message -----
From: "Bill London" <A class=moz-txt-link-rfc2396E href="mailto:london@moscow.com"><london@moscow.com></A>
To: "Matt Decker" <A class=moz-txt-link-rfc2396E href="mailto:mattd2107@hotmail.com"><mattd2107@hotmail.com></A>; <A class=moz-txt-link-rfc2396E href="mailto:kerrybecker6924@hotmail.com"><kerrybecker6924@hotmail.com></A>;
<A class=moz-txt-link-rfc2396E href="mailto:sslund@adelphia.net"><sslund@adelphia.net></A>; <A class=moz-txt-link-rfc2396E href="mailto:vision2020@moscow.com"><vision2020@moscow.com></A>
Sent: Friday, August 18, 2006 10:13 AM
Subject: Re: [Vision2020] West of Paris, Grand Opening
</PRE>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite"><PRE wrap="">Since you asked.....
a few of my reasons why I think a Constitutional amendment against
desecrating the flag is stupid....
1. what is the problem? how many descrated flags are there?
2. if I own the flag and choose to desecrate it by burning it in an open
place that will not cause a general fire, so what? That is free speech.
The flag is a symbol, and burning it is Constitutionally-protected.
3. what is desecration? wearing a flag on the butt of your jeans?
wrapping
your used car in flags to sell it at a used car lot? getting a tattoo of
flag upside down? Boy Scouts burning old flags?
BL
----- Original Message -----
From: "Matt Decker" <A class=moz-txt-link-rfc2396E href="mailto:mattd2107@hotmail.com"><mattd2107@hotmail.com></A>
To: <A class=moz-txt-link-rfc2396E href="mailto:london@moscow.com"><london@moscow.com></A>; <A class=moz-txt-link-rfc2396E href="mailto:kerrybecker6924@hotmail.com"><kerrybecker6924@hotmail.com></A>;
<A class=moz-txt-link-rfc2396E href="mailto:sslund@adelphia.net"><sslund@adelphia.net></A>; <A class=moz-txt-link-rfc2396E href="mailto:vision2020@moscow.com"><vision2020@moscow.com></A>
Sent: Thursday, August 17, 2006 9:21 PM
Subject: Re: [Vision2020] West of Paris, Grand Opening
</PRE>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite"><PRE wrap="">Mr. London,
And just as they should. Why shouldn't the congress take one day out of
their schedule in order to make flag burning an offense? If they focus on
baseball why not on the flag?
Matt
</PRE>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite"><PRE wrap="">From: "Bill London" <A class=moz-txt-link-rfc2396E href="mailto:london@moscow.com"><london@moscow.com></A>
To: "kerry becker" <A class=moz-txt-link-rfc2396E href="mailto:kerrybecker6924@hotmail.com"><kerrybecker6924@hotmail.com></A>, <A class=moz-txt-link-rfc2396E href="mailto:sslund@adelphia.net"><sslund@adelphia.net></A>,
<A class=moz-txt-link-rfc2396E href="mailto:vision2020@moscow.com"><vision2020@moscow.com></A>
Subject: Re: [Vision2020] West of Paris, Grand Opening
Date: Thu, 17 Aug 2006 12:33:43 -0700
Yes, it is true that Chicago has (for the reasons Ms. Lund has
</PRE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE><PRE wrap="">enumerated)
</PRE>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite"><PRE wrap="">banned foie gras, because of the disgusting and inhumane way the birds
</PRE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE><PRE wrap="">are
</PRE>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite"><PRE wrap="">force-fed to create these inflated livers. Chicago has not banned duck
liver, only foie gras.
And as for the reason, it's all a question of values, as the Republicans
say every year when they try to amend the US Constitution to end the
non-existant problem of people burning US flags.
BL
----- Original Message -----
From: kerry becker
To: <A class=moz-txt-link-abbreviated href="mailto:sslund@adelphia.net">sslund@adelphia.net</A> ; <A class=moz-txt-link-abbreviated href="mailto:vision2020@moscow.com">vision2020@moscow.com</A>
Sent: Wednesday, August 16, 2006 4:56 PM
Subject: Re: [Vision2020] West of Paris, Grand Opening
This is absurd. The city of Chicago has taken the time to ban duck
liver?? - Meanwhile the inner city runs rampant with crime, poverty and
drugs. Odd really.
</PRE></BLOCKQUOTE><PRE wrap="">---------------------------------------------------------------------------
</PRE></BLOCKQUOTE><PRE wrap="">-
</PRE>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite"><PRE wrap=""> From: "Saundra Lund" <A class=moz-txt-link-rfc2396E href="mailto:sslund@adelphia.net"><sslund@adelphia.net></A>
To: <A class=moz-txt-link-rfc2396E href="mailto:vision2020@moscow.com"><vision2020@moscow.com></A>
Subject: Re: [Vision2020] West of Paris, Grand Opening
Date: Wed, 16 Aug 2006 15:38:46 -0700
>Visionaries:
>
>I have debated and debated about whether to post this or not, but
</PRE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE><PRE wrap="">I'd
</PRE>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite"><PRE wrap="">hate
>for an unsuspecting person to go to West of Paris only to be
horrified.
>
>I was deeply disappointed to see that West of Paris will be
selling
foie
>gras:
><A class=moz-txt-link-freetext href="http://www.westofparis.com/dinner_menu.html">http://www.westofparis.com/dinner_menu.html</A>
>For that reason alone, I will refuse to patronize the business, no
matter
>how delicious other menu items look or sound -- it's a matter of
ethics for
>me.
>
>The process used to make foie gras is animal cruelty, pure and
</PRE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE><PRE wrap="">simple
</PRE>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite"><PRE wrap=""> :-(((
>Fifteen nations (including the UK, the Czech Republic, Denmark,
Finland,
>Germany, Luxembourg, Norway, Poland, Sweden, Switzerland, and
</PRE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE><PRE wrap="">Israel
</PRE>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite"><PRE wrap="">--
>formerly the fourth largest producer in the world) have banned
force-feeding
>birds for foie gras production. The City of Chicago has banned
the
sale of
>foie gras, and Philadelphia is likely to follow. Beginning 2012,
</PRE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE><PRE wrap="">the
</PRE>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite"><PRE wrap=""> >production and sale of foie gras from force-fed birds will be
</PRE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE><PRE wrap="">banned
</PRE>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite"><PRE wrap="">in the
>State of California.
>
>I won't go into the horrifying and graphic details of how foie
gras
is
>produced, but for those who want to learn more, you can check out:
><A class=moz-txt-link-freetext href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Foie_gras">http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Foie_gras</A>
>You can also Google it, but WARNING: there's a lot of deeply
disturbing
>(although accurate) information and photos you'll find.
>
>Very disappointing that foie gras will be sold in *any* Moscow
restaurant
>:-(((
>
>
>JMNSHO,
>Saundra Lund
>Moscow, ID
>
>The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good
people
to do
>nothing.
>- Edmund Burke
>
>***** Original material contained herein is Copyright 2006,
Saundra
Lund.
>Do not copy, forward, excerpt, or reproduce outside the Vision
2020
forum
>without the express written permission of the author.*****
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: <A class=moz-txt-link-abbreviated href="mailto:vision2020-bounces@moscow.com">vision2020-bounces@moscow.com</A>
[<A class=moz-txt-link-freetext href="mailto:vision2020-bounces@moscow.com">mailto:vision2020-bounces@moscow.com</A>]
>On Behalf Of Daniel Foucachon
>Sent: Monday, August 14, 2006 7:59 PM
>To: <A class=moz-txt-link-abbreviated href="mailto:vision2020@moscow.com">vision2020@moscow.com</A>
>Subject: [Vision2020] West of Paris, Grand Opening
>
> West of Paris<A class=moz-txt-link-rfc2396E href="http://www.westofparis.com/images/west_paris.gif"><http://www.westofparis.com/images/west_paris.gif></A>
>Grand Opening
>Friday, August 18th, 2006
>
>Now accepting reservations
>
>Call (208) 882-4279
>
><A class=moz-txt-link-abbreviated href="http://www.westofparis.com">www.westofparis.com</A> <A class=moz-txt-link-rfc2396E href="http://www.westofparis.com/"><http://www.westofparis.com/></A> | opening at
</PRE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE><PRE wrap="">6:00
</PRE>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite"><PRE wrap="">p.m.
>
>
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