Keely,<br> <br> Once again, you prove you are unable to follow an argument. My father was in the military, so was my brother, as well as both grandfathers, and other relatives that even died for this country.<br> <br> I love the soldiers that fought admirably for this country.<br> <br> That was not my argument and you know it. <br> <br> Trying to twist around my comments in a OVERLY dramatic over reactionary piece of bullshit meant to file my statement as an attack on the majority of people that served our country honorably, is either, malicious or incompetence in understanding an argument. It is hard to tell which one was intended by you because you illustrate so much of both in all your work. To bad you have to resort to that level of rhetoric, again even in response to defending my own blood. But I am not surprised. <br> <br> I will make it clear, even to you, my statement so even you can understand it, if that is possible:<br> <br> Tom Hansen is not
a hero. My father is. For him to slander for my father's service in the military, is wrong. And you can sit on and spin that all you want.<br> <br> Regards,<br> <br> _DJA<br> <br> PS, You can kiss civility out the window when you attack my family. I don't attack your family, don't attack mine. <br><br><b><i>keely emerinemix <kjajmix1@msn.com></i></b> wrote:<blockquote class="replbq" style="border-left: 2px solid rgb(16, 16, 255); margin-left: 5px; padding-left: 5px;"> The producer of the vitriol and vomit below deserves nothing but <br>condemnation for his latest screed against Tom. I don't intend to get into <br>it with the author, but I would like to make a plea for some semblance of <br>civility again on Vision 2020.<br><br>Civility doesn't have to be that idiotic nonsense that begins everything <br>with "Thanks for sharing. It sounds like you have a problem with what I <br>said about . . . " It doesn't have to be fawning, shallow, bland and simple
<br>enough to not cause offense. Quite the contrary. Who would read that? If <br>you want shallow, bland and simple, go peruse the fiction section of a <br>"Christian" bookstore. Vision 2020 exists to further discussion. I <br>appreciate sharp, pointed, even angry rebuttals of bad arguments; I don't <br>flinch at tough words and witty rejoinders, even -- especially -- when <br>directed at me. I know what to ignore, and I know what to respond to. I'm <br>no tougher than anyone else on the list, but that's my point: We're all <br>adults and should be able to handle a few, or many, strongly written parries <br>and thrusts. Even warnings about groin kicks and soprano singing, which <br>most adults would take as the hyperbolic expression of protectiveness and <br>warning intended.<br><br>But the garbage below goes too far.<br><br>My pity for the writer is surpassed only by my disgust at his <br>characterization of soldiers dead and alive. I grew up in a family that
<br>protested the war at every possible turn; I was carrying picket signs and <br>singing in candlelight vigils at Davis-Monthan Air Force Base starting when <br>I was 7 or so. I hate war and I am unalterably opposed to our continued <br>presence in Iraq. I am discouraging my 17-year-old from joining the <br>military or even talking to recruiters. But I will stand toe-to-toe against <br>anyone who calls a Vietnam-era or any other veteran a baby killer -- someone <br>who participated in "the carpet bombing of little kids with napalm" -- and <br>I'll be damned if I'll let a comment like that go unchallenged, even from <br>someone I consider worthy of more compassion than scorn. This isn't debate, <br>or witty repartee, or a verbal joust. There's no rational thought or <br>rhetorical prowess here; there isn't even a coherent statement, much less a <br>reasoned argument. It's just a diarrheac spewing of irrational ballast, and <br>I'm afraid it makes it much easier for
other discourse on Vision to slide <br>down the same filthy slope.<br><br>(And yes, I'm aware that the author loathes me, but I don't hate him, and if <br>he had a need I could fulfill, I'd try to help. With a stern, motherly <br>rebuke afterwards . . . )<br><br>Royally PO'd,<br><br>keely<br><br><br>From: Donovan Arnold <donovanjarnold2005 @yahoo.com=""><br>To: Tom Hansen <idahotom @hotmail.com="">, vision2020@moscow.com<br>Subject: RE: [Vision2020] government checks? please!<br>Date: Wed, 17 May 2006 13:22:55 -0700 (PDT)<br><br>Tom,<br><br> Once again, I appreciate your taking a bullet in the head for this <br>country.<br><br> However, my attacks against you, were AFTER you attacked my Father and <br>his service in the Military. He is your superior officer, an 0-5, and who <br>did much for this country and his work has saved the lives many 10000s of <br>soldiers and the innocent, most notably, with providing the electronic <br>components for the Tomahawk Cruise
missile.<br><br> You attack my father, mother, sister, brother, cousin, or any relative <br>and I only called you a couch potato??? Hey, you are lucky. I must have <br>been having a good day, eh?<br><br> The immaturity here Hansen, is you going after my Father, a military <br>veteran, because you don't like me.<br><br> That was way over the line and I responded, when I should just wrote you <br>off, with an equally offensive comment to you. Which apparently it was <br>because you have not shut up about it for 2 1/2 years.<br><br> DO NOT MAKE FUN OF MY FATHER. And I will not call your war buddies dead <br>beats that deserved to get shot in some pointless war. I believe anyone <br>that hangs out with a grunt in the military that called you a friend could <br>not possible be a hero if all they make fun of the people that design the <br>planes and weapons that cover your ass from enemy fire.<br><br> I am so sick, of you playing the "I was in the military"
card. I don't <br>give a rat's ass. I only care if you actually did something when you were <br>there. Anyone can put on a uniform. How many pedophiles, rapists, <br>murderers, traitors, former Nazis, and other useless pieces of garbage have <br>been in the military? Wearing a military uniform does not make you a hero, <br>Bush wore a military uniform, it is what you do while wearing the uniform <br>that makes you a hero.<br><br> All you have done with your military service Mr. Hansen is use it to try <br>and say that you are always right about everything, and to put down many of <br>your superior officers and fellow solders.<br><br> So stop telling me you were in the military, I don't give a shit. You <br>were in the military, so what. You joined an organization which you knew at <br>the time was carpet bombing little kids with napalm in Asia, whoopee!<br><br> Regards,<br><br> _DJA<br><br><br><br>Tom Hansen <idahotom @hotmail.com=""> wrote: Thank you
for your support, keely.<br><br>This is nothing new from Arnold. This is the same idiot that made a similar<br>(almost identical) joke concerning two close friends of mine killed in<br>Vietnam.<br><br>At that time the discussion on V2020 concerned General Wesley Clark and his<br>(Gen Clark's) candidacy for president. I had mentioned that I was assigned<br>to Fort Irwin under then Colonel Wesley Clark (Chief, Operations Group, Fort<br>Irwin, Calif) (remembering it now, Arnold??). The discussion expanded to<br>include places I had served and friends I had known. Throughout this<br>discussion Arnold was providing his "colorful" commentary about how I was a<br>couch potato and how friends of mine couldn't be any better. I mentioned<br>John Wiggins and Dale Roderick and mentioned that they were both killed in<br>Vietnam. Arnold responded with words to the affect that they were probably<br>the two biggest couch potatoes in the Army.<br><br>So, you see, keely. Arnold
hasn't chaned one iota in the past couple years.<br> A skunk may change its stripes, but the smell long endures.<br><br>Seeya round town, Moscow.<br><br>t hansen<br>Moscow, Idaho<br><br><br> >From: "keely emerinemix"<br> >To: donovanjarnold2005@yahoo.com, thansen@moscow.com<br> >CC: vision2020@moscow.com<br> >Subject: [Vision2020] government checks? please!<br> >Date: Wed, 17 May 2006 04:57:21 -0700<br> ><br> >I've learned that answering him is like feeding stray cats, but I take<br> >exception to Donovans saying that Tom Hansen has never had a job that<br> >didn't result in a government paycheck.<br> ><br> >Tom is a veteran. He served his country and served it well, as evidenced<br> >by his long tenure and his honorable discharge. He gave what he had and<br> >earned every paycheck he got, and it offends me greatly to suggest that he<br> >and other veterans simply relied on "government checks." The government,<br> >and all
of us, relied on them. Simple as that.<br> ><br> >I'm glad you're getting your education, Donovan, and doing it the hard <br>way,<br> >but judging from your take on voting and service to the country, you seem<br> >not to have learned very much at all.<br> ><br> >keely<br><br><br>_____________________________________________________<br> List services made available by First Step Internet,<br> serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.<br> http://www.fsr.net<br> mailto:Vision2020@moscow.com<br>ŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻ<br><br><br>__________________________________________________<br>Do You Yahoo!?<br>Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around<br>http://mail.yahoo.com<br><br>---------------------------------<br>Blab-away for as little as 1˘/min. Make PC-to-Phone Calls using Yahoo! <br>Messenger with Voice.<br><br><br>_____________________________________________________<br>
List services made available by First Step Internet,<br> serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.<br> http://www.fsr.net<br> mailto:Vision2020@moscow.com<br>ŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻ<br><br>_________________________________________________________________<br>FREE pop-up blocking with the new MSN Toolbar get it now! <br>http://toolbar.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200415ave/direct/01/<br><br>_____________________________________________________<br> List services made available by First Step Internet, <br> serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994. <br> http://www.fsr.net <br> mailto:Vision2020@moscow.com<br>ŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻ<br></idahotom></idahotom></donovanjarnold2005></blockquote><br><p>
<hr size=1>Blab-away for as little as 1˘/min. Make <a href="http://us.rd.yahoo.com/mail_us/taglines/postman2/*http://us.rd.yahoo.com/evt=39663/*http://voice.yahoo.com"> PC-to-Phone Calls</a> using Yahoo! Messenger with Voice.