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<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>oops, obviously I meant west. What do they call
that lodestone on a pivot thingy again?</FONT></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE
style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV>
<DIV
style="BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: black"><B>From:</B>
<A title=jampot@adelphia.net href="mailto:jampot@adelphia.net">g. crabtree</A>
</DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A title=deco@moscow.com
href="mailto:deco@moscow.com">Art Deco</A> ; <A title=vision2020@moscow.com
href="mailto:vision2020@moscow.com">Vision 2020</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Saturday, March 04, 2006 2:18
PM</DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> Re: [Vision2020] Goodnight
Goody, Goodnight Ridge</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Wayne, You are very much mischaracterizing what I
write. I know for an absolute fact that Moscow has the ability to attract and
grow business. What I fear is that our current city government and our
political party by any other name will interfere to the point that they wont
bother. If it becomes to much of a hassle to do business
here it will follow the path of least resistance and do its thing a
couple of miles to the east, in Whitman county. Your examples are fine as far
as they go, I could add at least a dozen more without straining myself but it
takes quite a few little enterprises such as these to equal a more major
commercial development such as a SWM or the proposed Lowe's & its
attendant stores. Development I would strongly prefer to see in Latah
county.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>G. Crabtree</FONT></DIV></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE
style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV>
<DIV
style="BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: black"><B>From:</B>
<A title=deco@moscow.com href="mailto:deco@moscow.com">Art Deco</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A title=vision2020@moscow.com
href="mailto:vision2020@moscow.com">Vision 2020</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Saturday, March 04, 2006 10:54
AM</DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> Re: [Vision2020] Goodnight
Goody, Goodnight Ridge</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=4>Gary, </FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=4></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=4>Perhaps you are just a trifle pessimistic about Moscow's
ability to grow, to attract and/or to help
businesses succeed.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=4></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=4>If it is permitted, let me write about two local success
stories.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=4></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=4></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT color=#0000ff size=6><STRONG>Rudy's</STRONG></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=4></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=4>Dan and Gretchen Ruark had a vision about opening a
small cafe offering high quality super-delicious hamburgers, related items,
and fast, sincerely friendly service. They planned carefully.
They invested their time and money, not without risk in a location in a mall
which at that time was having occupancy problems. They worked hard,
long hours. They were not adverse to changing and experimenting with
various ideas to enhance the attractiveness of their products and
atmosphere.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=4></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=4>I don't know for sure if they are making a decent income,
but they have what appears to be an enthusiastic, very satisfied customer
base. When we think of fast food to eat in or to go which is
substantial, nutritious, and does not taste like cardboard, we stop at
Rudy's. We have never been disappointed.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=4></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=4>I admire what they have done. I
recommend Rudy's constantly to others. They provide a positive,
reasonably priced product in a convenient and pleasant location. They
are, to me, a sterling example of what a locally owned business can and
should be. </FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=4></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=4></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><STRONG><FONT color=#0000ff size=6>VGH (Video Game
Headquarters)</FONT></STRONG></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=4></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=4>Todd and Tonia Green also had a vision. The result
of their vision was at first a small store in the PEM selling mostly game
hardware and software. They now are much, much more.
They sell a wide variety of the latest game hardware and
software. But now they also build computers and computer systems for
businesses and home users. They sell computer software and hardware
components. They service/repair a great variety of different computer
hardware and components at very reasonable prices.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=4></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=4>They started out in a small space and moved to a larger
one as their business grew. They have recently expanded again. I
sit at this moment using a computer which they custom built for me. It
is an especially complex computer. They built it for me at a
price which was competitive with that of those companies that build high
quality PCs. They service what they have sold me. I am very
satisfied with all the business that I have transacted
with them.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=4></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=4>Like Rudy's, VGH provides positive, reasonably priced
products and services in a convenient and pleasant location. They
are, to me, another sterling example of what a locally owned business can
and should be. </FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=4></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=4>Many other examples could be added to this list:
Paradise Creek Cycle, Book People, Wild Women Traders, etc. Perhaps
other posters will tell about their favorite success stories.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=4>There have sadly been some failures also. Many of
these failures, in my opinion, could have been prevented with a little more
business acumen, better customer service, and better planning in sync with
the needs and temperament of the community.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=4></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=4>I have been in the past critical of some of the
direction, the lack of certain direction, and the faintness of the
efforts of the LEDC. I think things are looking much better there
now. Phil Nesbit, our recently departed advocate, for
example, recently made some very useful suggestions for areas for the
LEDC to pursue. I think there is a new open-mindedness at the
LEDC and less of a What's-In-It-For-Me attitude.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=4></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=4>There is a whole set of questions about what kind of
businesses to attempt to attract to this area and questions about community
values. I sincerely hope that <STRONG><FONT color=#0000ff>we are
hostile</FONT></STRONG> to some kinds of businesses: private prisons,
rendering plants, large open pit mining operations, etc. There are
still many kinds of businesses that would be welcomed enthusiastically into
the community. Many businesses would love to locate here for the
quality of life we <STRONG><FONT color=#ff0000 size=6>now</FONT></STRONG>
enjoy. [Note the subtext in the preceding sentence.] We need to
identify and to recruit/help build those businesses.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=4></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=4>There is another set of problems with Moscow community and
economic development: the policies, staffing, and the internal
cultural of the City of Moscow government that has developed over a long
period of years. I hope that the present city council has the insight
and courage to start to address those problems and to promote positive
change.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=4></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=4>Hence Gary, I don't share your pessimism.
</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=4></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=4>Desirable businesses seldom object to reasonable
regulation. When I was active in the field of economic development,
desirable businesses wanted to move to areas with strong,
effective planning and zoning because that in the long run is an
important factor in determining and maintaining a city's, county's, and
an areas quality of life. Besides prosperity, quality of life
considerations are important to many business owners. Desirable
relocating business are many times looking to escape from areas whose
quality of life has deteriorated due to anemic planning and zoning and
ill-planned, under-regulation.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=4><BR>Art Deco (Wayne A. Fox)<BR><A
href="mailto:deco@moscow.com">deco@moscow.com</A><BR></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=4></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=4></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=4></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=4></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=4></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message -----
<DIV style="BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; font-color: black"><B>From:</B> <A
title=jampot@adelphia.net href="mailto:jampot@adelphia.net">g. crabtree</A>
</DIV>
<DIV><B>To:</B> <A title=jeanlivingston@turbonet.com
href="mailto:jeanlivingston@turbonet.com">Bruce and Jean Livingston</A> ; <A
title=donovanjarnold2005@yahoo.com
href="mailto:donovanjarnold2005@yahoo.com">Donovan Arnold</A> ; <A
title=vision2020@moscow.com href="mailto:vision2020@moscow.com">Vision
2020</A> </DIV>
<DIV><B>Sent:</B> Saturday, March 04, 2006 9:12 AM</DIV>
<DIV><B>Subject:</B> Re: [Vision2020] Goodnight Goody, Goodnight
Ridge</DIV></DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Bruce, Regarding your "third category opponent"
argument. Just exactly how does a community attract business development?
The current city government couldn't attract iron filings if it were a
lodestone nor would it be inclined to from what I can see. I am most
certainly not an economic expert but I would think that what attracts
development is a ready market and a relatively clear path. How does jamming
a stick in the eye of one business, in the form of regulatory road
blocks, make another want to try its luck? It would seem to me
that our current MCA laden leadership will simply drive all future
economic development across the border into Whitman county and the city of
Moscow will languish in exactly the same way that, until
recently, Pullman has. Until a more "laissez faire" policy becomes the
order of the day I fear Moscow's future prospects seem bleak. As a
planer or a consumer, sitting around wishing that a Target, a Best Buy, A
Costco, or whatever dream store you imagine should take the place of a Super
Wal-Mart will magically drop into your community, simply because
you badly want it to be so, will not result in your desired
outcome. Step out of the way and let 'er rip.The outcome can't be any worse
than having our community dry up and blow away from lack of
growth.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Regards,</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Gary</FONT></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE
style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV>
<DIV
style="BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: black"><B>From:</B>
<A title=jeanlivingston@turbonet.com
href="mailto:jeanlivingston@turbonet.com">Bruce and Jean Livingston</A>
</DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A
title=donovanjarnold2005@yahoo.com
href="mailto:donovanjarnold2005@yahoo.com">Donovan Arnold</A> ; <A
title=vision2020@moscow.com href="mailto:vision2020@moscow.com">Vision
2020</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Saturday, March 04, 2006 6:24
AM</DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> Re: [Vision2020] Goodnight
Goody, Goodnight Ridge</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>ssez</FONT><BR></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial>I imagine someone telling Dave he can't expand
Paradise Ridge CDs, and I don't like it. </FONT><FONT face=Arial>But
the obvious analogy to Wal-Mart that you are trying to make is not a clean
one, in my opinion, Donovan, though I do agree with some of what you
write. </FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial>First, I wouldn't be the least bit concerned about
people telling me where they thought I should shop. I kept buying
grapes, even though the Farm Workers were trying to organize a
boycott. I listen to the reasons for not shopping at Wal-Mart, and I
agree with some of them, but I still shop at Wal-Mart on rare
occasions. I try to patronize other places, and I always try
Tri-State or Spence's, first, because I think it is important to patronize
local businesses to help assure that more money stays in the
community. But I admit it, my razor blades come from Wal-Mart when I
don't have a Costco run in the offing.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial>People may still shop at Wal-Mart, as they
could at any other store that is operating here. I don't
begrudge others the opportunity to shop at Wal-Mart, and I agree with the
free market advocates and the need for business opportunities in our
community, and so I agree with the right to expand when it comports with
good planning and the law. </FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial>But if Dave were in the mood to expand Paradise
Ridge, by buying up one of his neighbors on Third Street in the heart of
downtown, where retail sales are the dominant and preferred activity
according to our zoning code and comprehensive plan, anybody arguing
against that expansion would have worthless arguments, and the expansion
would be approved. That is where your analogy falls apart, unless
you were contemplating plunking the CD store in an area where it was not
allowed -- in which case I would likely not support that location
despite my affection for the business.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial>I think that what many fail to recognize is that
there are too kinds of Wal-Mart opponents out there in our community right
now: those who abhor Wal-Mart and would deny its entry
anywhere, and those who question the planning that went into this
particular expansion effort. I am on record as being in the latter
category. If I can find the reasons that I submitted to the P&Z
public hearing, I will forward them to the list. </FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial>Briefly, I believe that the proposed extensive
commercial motor business designation of the Thompson property is poor
planning. Such developments should have occurred between downtown
and the state line, as the comprehensive plan dictated, had not the lack
of vision by prior councils allowed most of that property along A street
to become apartments, contrary to the comprehensive plan. Such a
plan would still allow us to shop and draw us through downtown, making it
more likely that our lovely downtown is a convenient stop along the
way. There is still opportunity for expanded commercial development
in the area from behind the mall to the state line, as was proposed
at the same council meeting last June when the Thompson project
first surfaced. Equally and maybe more important given
greater availability, there is a much more obvious existing site than the
Thompson property for such extensive commercial developments at the north
and south ends of town along Highway 95, a far better traffic
corridor. The Thompson property ought, in my opinion, to be
primarily residential (as it was designated in the comp plan until a bad
planning decision by the prior council last June) and not destroy the
ambience of the existing owners to the east and across the street on
Ridge. Finally, we ought to be saving the west end of the Thompson
property for future expansion of higher paying businesses than a shopping
center; we ought to allow Alturas that room to expand, while fostering a
pro-business attitude and encouraging businesses that pay at least
living wages to locate here.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial>Now at the risk of being a little windy here, and if
you are not already snoozing, there is a third category of Wal-Mart
opponent, in my opinion and of which I am also a member, and it relates to
limited opportunities for shopping in Moscow, the almighty mantra of
"market choice." I mentioned this on the list a while back and it
engendered little discussion. I expected to hear a rebuttal from
Jeff Harkins who is the most fervent free marketer on the list and
my compatriot on the LEDC, and he said he was working on it,
but I seem to have missed it. </FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial>The "more market choice" category that I just
mentioned might at first blush appear to support letting anyone
expand and enter, and see what happens, the classic laissez faire free
market approach. But what I am contemplating is something
different. </FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial>It seems to me that we are a very small community
with a relatively limited amount of disposable income to spend in (and
therefore support) the local stores of all types. Wal-Mart offers
one kind of shopping venue, and a Super Wal-Mart would admittedly
offer more (if perhaps of the same lower quality) and
the most significant addition might be food. There is already a
Wal-Mart here. There are four grocery stores, the Co-op on the high
end, Winco on the low end (offering similar pricing to Wal-Mart from what
I understand) and Rosauer's and Safeway in between. There will soon
be a Super Wal-Mart a mere ten miles away in Pullman. </FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial>The market choice that I am talking about is more
choices for us. Why a Wal-Mart which we already have? Why not
something else, so our consumer choices are enhanced more than by the
expansion of the existing low-end product line at Wal-Mart? Why not
have our city and economic development and business supporters work on
attracting an alternative to Wal-Mart, so that our limited choices are not
so likely to become primarily Wal-Mart? Why not work harder to
attract something more interesting and beneficial to consumer
choice? Why let Wal-Mart pre-empt the market and fill it up in the
predatory fashion that it appears to be following with two supercenters
within 10 miles? Why are we only talking about the choices that
the entrepreneurs choose to offer and not the choices that we consumers
would like to see? We could work toward educating other
entrepreneurs and attracting them instead, and if we put in place rules
that applied to all and some chose to play where Wal-Mart didn't, why
wouldn't we be better off by having more varied choices?</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial>Perhaps most significant to my "more consumer
choices" angle, why let a 200,000 square foot store come in and soak up
the available dollars in this very small community and make it less likely
for other more varied folks to enter our market? Why isn't 100,000
square feet enough in this little community? A size cap would allow
us more choices. I have a good friend on the Chamber Board
(who would probably prefer to remain nameless) and he likes to talk about
how students often have the most disposable dollars to spend, despite
their low income, and that we ought to be able to market Moscow and
interest someone other than Wal-Mart to enter our community. If we
are to have big boxes in our community, why not be pro-active and get us
more real choice for Moscow's consumers, rather than more of
the Wal-Mart we already have? </FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial>Several of my MCA Board buddies who oppose
Wal-Mart and big boxes in general characterize this as the "pig in silk
pajamas" argument, because I do believe that large stores ought to be
allowed, but play nice and look nice, whereas these others oppose them on
general principles. I don't want large stores to just
make the "great big sucking noise" Ross Perot once described, though he
was talking about jobs going to Mexico and I am talking about more of our
dollars going to Bentonville Arkansas. If we are to have out-of-town
chains, I would much prefer to have a Costco that pays living wages
than a Wal-Mart that does not, even if lots of those dollars spent go to
Seattle. </FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial>Lest someone misconstrue this, I don't believe we
can choose one retailer over the other on the whim of the
Council. We need rules that are applied fairly to all retailers
and then we need to apply the rules fairly, but I do believe we can
encourage better and more varied consumer choices through thoughtful
legislating and pro-active and creative economic development
efforts.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial>Putting a halt to an ill-conceived project buys us
the time to do things better the next time, to have a good plan in
place, and to be ready for things instead of just reacting to the
next request on a developer's wish list.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial>Bruce Livingston</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial></FONT> </DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message -----
<DIV style="BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; font-color: black"><B>From:</B> <A
title=jampot@adelphia.net href="mailto:jampot@adelphia.net">g. crabtree</A>
</DIV>
<DIV><B>To:</B> <A title=jeanlivingston@turbonet.com
href="mailto:jeanlivingston@turbonet.com">Bruce and Jean Livingston</A> ; <A
title=donovanjarnold2005@yahoo.com
href="mailto:donovanjarnold2005@yahoo.com">Donovan Arnold</A> ; <A
title=vision2020@moscow.com href="mailto:vision2020@moscow.com">Vision
2020</A> </DIV>
<DIV><B>Sent:</B> Saturday, March 04, 2006 9:12 AM</DIV>
<DIV><B>Subject:</B> Re: [Vision2020] Goodnight Goody, Goodnight
Ridge</DIV></DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Bruce, Regarding your "third category opponent"
argument. Just exactly how does a community attract business development?
The current city government couldn't attract iron filings if it were a
lodestone nor would it be inclined to from what I can see. I am most
certainly not an economic expert but I would think that what attracts
development is a ready market and a relatively clear path. How does jamming
a stick in the eye of one business, in the form of regulatory road
blocks, make another want to try its luck? It would seem to me
that our current MCA laden leadership will simply drive all future
economic development across the border into Whitman county and the city of
Moscow will languish in exactly the same way that, until
recently, Pullman has. Until a more "laissez faire" policy becomes the
order of the day I fear Moscow's future prospects seem bleak. As a
planer or a consumer, sitting around wishing that a Target, a Best Buy, A
Costco, or whatever dream store you imagine should take the place of a Super
Wal-Mart will magically drop into your community, simply because
you badly want it to be so, will not result in your desired
outcome. Step out of the way and let 'er rip.The outcome can't be any worse
than having our community dry up and blow away from lack of
growth.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Regards,</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Gary</FONT></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE
style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV>
<DIV
style="BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: black"><B>From:</B>
<A title=jeanlivingston@turbonet.com
href="mailto:jeanlivingston@turbonet.com">Bruce and Jean Livingston</A>
</DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A
title=donovanjarnold2005@yahoo.com
href="mailto:donovanjarnold2005@yahoo.com">Donovan Arnold</A> ; <A
title=vision2020@moscow.com href="mailto:vision2020@moscow.com">Vision
2020</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Saturday, March 04, 2006 6:24
AM</DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> Re: [Vision2020] Goodnight
Goody, Goodnight Ridge</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>ssez</FONT><BR></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial>I imagine someone telling Dave he can't expand
Paradise Ridge CDs, and I don't like it. </FONT><FONT face=Arial>But
the obvious analogy to Wal-Mart that you are trying to make is not a clean
one, in my opinion, Donovan, though I do agree with some of what you
write. </FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial>First, I wouldn't be the least bit concerned about
people telling me where they thought I should shop. I kept buying
grapes, even though the Farm Workers were trying to organize a
boycott. I listen to the reasons for not shopping at Wal-Mart, and I
agree with some of them, but I still shop at Wal-Mart on rare
occasions. I try to patronize other places, and I always try
Tri-State or Spence's, first, because I think it is important to patronize
local businesses to help assure that more money stays in the
community. But I admit it, my razor blades come from Wal-Mart when I
don't have a Costco run in the offing.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial>People may still shop at Wal-Mart, as they
could at any other store that is operating here. I don't
begrudge others the opportunity to shop at Wal-Mart, and I agree with the
free market advocates and the need for business opportunities in our
community, and so I agree with the right to expand when it comports with
good planning and the law. </FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial>But if Dave were in the mood to expand Paradise
Ridge, by buying up one of his neighbors on Third Street in the heart of
downtown, where retail sales are the dominant and preferred activity
according to our zoning code and comprehensive plan, anybody arguing
against that expansion would have worthless arguments, and the expansion
would be approved. That is where your analogy falls apart, unless
you were contemplating plunking the CD store in an area where it was not
allowed -- in which case I would likely not support that location
despite my affection for the business.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial>I think that what many fail to recognize is that
there are too kinds of Wal-Mart opponents out there in our community right
now: those who abhor Wal-Mart and would deny its entry
anywhere, and those who question the planning that went into this
particular expansion effort. I am on record as being in the latter
category. If I can find the reasons that I submitted to the P&Z
public hearing, I will forward them to the list. </FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial>Briefly, I believe that the proposed extensive
commercial motor business designation of the Thompson property is poor
planning. Such developments should have occurred between downtown
and the state line, as the comprehensive plan dictated, had not the lack
of vision by prior councils allowed most of that property along A street
to become apartments, contrary to the comprehensive plan. Such a
plan would still allow us to shop and draw us through downtown, making it
more likely that our lovely downtown is a convenient stop along the
way. There is still opportunity for expanded commercial development
in the area from behind the mall to the state line, as was proposed
at the same council meeting last June when the Thompson project
first surfaced. Equally and maybe more important given
greater availability, there is a much more obvious existing site than the
Thompson property for such extensive commercial developments at the north
and south ends of town along Highway 95, a far better traffic
corridor. The Thompson property ought, in my opinion, to be
primarily residential (as it was designated in the comp plan until a bad
planning decision by the prior council last June) and not destroy the
ambience of the existing owners to the east and across the street on
Ridge. Finally, we ought to be saving the west end of the Thompson
property for future expansion of higher paying businesses than a shopping
center; we ought to allow Alturas that room to expand, while fostering a
pro-business attitude and encouraging businesses that pay at least
living wages to locate here.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial>Now at the risk of being a little windy here, and if
you are not already snoozing, there is a third category of Wal-Mart
opponent, in my opinion and of which I am also a member, and it relates to
limited opportunities for shopping in Moscow, the almighty mantra of
"market choice." I mentioned this on the list a while back and it
engendered little discussion. I expected to hear a rebuttal from
Jeff Harkins who is the most fervent free marketer on the list and
my compatriot on the LEDC, and he said he was working on it,
but I seem to have missed it. </FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial>The "more market choice" category that I just
mentioned might at first blush appear to support letting anyone
expand and enter, and see what happens, the classic laissez faire free
market approach. But what I am contemplating is something
different. </FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial>It seems to me that we are a very small community
with a relatively limited amount of disposable income to spend in (and
therefore support) the local stores of all types. Wal-Mart offers
one kind of shopping venue, and a Super Wal-Mart would admittedly
offer more (if perhaps of the same lower quality) and
the most significant addition might be food. There is already a
Wal-Mart here. There are four grocery stores, the Co-op on the high
end, Winco on the low end (offering similar pricing to Wal-Mart from what
I understand) and Rosauer's and Safeway in between. There will soon
be a Super Wal-Mart a mere ten miles away in Pullman. </FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial>The market choice that I am talking about is more
choices for us. Why a Wal-Mart which we already have? Why not
something else, so our consumer choices are enhanced more than by the
expansion of the existing low-end product line at Wal-Mart? Why not
have our city and economic development and business supporters work on
attracting an alternative to Wal-Mart, so that our limited choices are not
so likely to become primarily Wal-Mart? Why not work harder to
attract something more interesting and beneficial to consumer
choice? Why let Wal-Mart pre-empt the market and fill it up in the
predatory fashion that it appears to be following with two supercenters
within 10 miles? Why are we only talking about the choices that
the entrepreneurs choose to offer and not the choices that we consumers
would like to see? We could work toward educating other
entrepreneurs and attracting them instead, and if we put in place rules
that applied to all and some chose to play where Wal-Mart didn't, why
wouldn't we be better off by having more varied choices?</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial>Perhaps most significant to my "more consumer
choices" angle, why let a 200,000 square foot store come in and soak up
the available dollars in this very small community and make it less likely
for other more varied folks to enter our market? Why isn't 100,000
square feet enough in this little community? A size cap would allow
us more choices. I have a good friend on the Chamber Board
(who would probably prefer to remain nameless) and he likes to talk about
how students often have the most disposable dollars to spend, despite
their low income, and that we ought to be able to market Moscow and
interest someone other than Wal-Mart to enter our community. If we
are to have big boxes in our community, why not be pro-active and get us
more real choice for Moscow's consumers, rather than more of
the Wal-Mart we already have? </FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial>Several of my MCA Board buddies who oppose
Wal-Mart and big boxes in general characterize this as the "pig in silk
pajamas" argument, because I do believe that large stores ought to be
allowed, but play nice and look nice, whereas these others oppose them on
general principles. I don't want large stores to just
make the "great big sucking noise" Ross Perot once described, though he
was talking about jobs going to Mexico and I am talking about more of our
dollars going to Bentonville Arkansas. If we are to have out-of-town
chains, I would much prefer to have a Costco that pays living wages
than a Wal-Mart that does not, even if lots of those dollars spent go to
Seattle. </FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial>Lest someone misconstrue this, I don't believe we
can choose one retailer over the other on the whim of the
Council. We need rules that are applied fairly to all retailers
and then we need to apply the rules fairly, but I do believe we can
encourage better and more varied consumer choices through thoughtful
legislating and pro-active and creative economic development
efforts.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial>Putting a halt to an ill-conceived project buys us
the time to do things better the next time, to have a good plan in
place, and to be ready for things instead of just reacting to the
next request on a developer's wish list.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial>Bruce Livingston</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial></FONT> </DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE
style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV>
<DIV
style="BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: black"><B>From:</B>
<A title=donovanjarnold2005@yahoo.com
href="mailto:donovanjarnold2005@yahoo.com">Donovan Arnold</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A
title=jeanlivingston@turbonet.com
href="mailto:jeanlivingston@turbonet.com">Bruce and Jean Livingston</A>
; <A title=vision2020@moscow.com
href="mailto:vision2020@moscow.com">Vision 2020</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Friday, March 03, 2006 11:08
PM</DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> Re: [Vision2020] Goodnight
Goody, Goodnight Ridge</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial></FONT><FONT face=Arial></FONT><FONT
face=Arial></FONT><FONT face=Arial></FONT><FONT face=Arial></FONT><FONT
face=Arial></FONT><FONT face=Arial></FONT><FONT
face=Arial></FONT><BR></DIV>"I am flabbergasted to hear Sam Goody
compared favorably by anyone to <BR>Paradise Ridge. I find that Paradise
Ridge is extremely competitive <BR>price-wise with Hasting's, not to
mention Sam Goody."-Bruce Livingston<BR><BR>Apparently, enough people
are in agreement with you, since SM is going out of business and
Paradise Ridge is still here. Isn't free enterprise great? <BR><BR>Now
image Bruce, is someone wanted to stop Paradise Ridge from expanding to
provide you with better products and service but others that did not
shop there were disagreement with you, opposed the expansion, and
telling you to go to Sam Goody
instead.<BR><BR>_DJA<BR><BR><BR><B><I>Bruce and Jean Livingston
<jeanlivingston@turbonet.com></I></B> wrote:
<BLOCKQUOTE class=replbq
style="PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: rgb(16,16,255) 2px solid">I
am flabbergasted to hear Sam Goody compared favorably by anyone to
<BR>Paradise Ridge. I find that Paradise Ridge is extremely
competitive <BR>price-wise with Hasting's, not to mention Sam Goody.
And the one thing that <BR>you get from Paradise Ridge that you do not
get anywhere else, at least to <BR>the level that you receive from
Dave at Paradise Ridge, is SERVICE. If he <BR>doesn't have it, he
finds it, and the ordering process with Paradise Ridge <BR>is far
easier than any other store in town.<BR><BR>Bruce
Livingston<BR><BR>----- Original Message ----- <BR>From: "Art Deco"
<DECO @moscow.com=""><BR>To: "Vision 2020" <VISION2020
@moscow.com=""><BR>Sent: Friday, March 03, 2006 11:02 AM<BR>Subject:
Re: [Vision2020] Goodnight Goody, Goodnight Ridge<BR><BR><BR>>
Music Lovers, Economists, and Absolute Monists,<BR>><BR>> The
following words appeared in the letter below written by Jay Feldman
<BR>> and<BR>> posted by Tom Hansen:<BR>><BR>> "Ross tells
us there is just such a store in Moscow, Paradise Ridge <BR>>
Records,<BR>> but he is unwilling to patronize it because its
prices are higher than the<BR>> defunct Goody."<BR>><BR>> I
believe the assumption in this quote is wrong. My experience has
been<BR>> that Sam Goody had the highest CD prices on the Palouse
by a considerable<BR>> margin except for advertised specials, some
of the prices of these <BR>> specials<BR>> were still higher
than Paradise Ridge CDs' prices.<BR>><BR>> For example, I
recently bought Moonlight Serenade by Carly Simon (a<BR>>
collection of really old tunes for really old people like myself, done
<BR>> quite<BR>> tastefully). The album comes with a disc which
is a CD on one side and a<BR>> DVD on the other. It was priced at
$19.98 at Sam Goody and $16.98<BR>> elsewhere. When I shopped at
Paradise Ridge CDs, I found their prices<BR>> competitive -- many
were below list. Discussions with others lead me to<BR>> believe
that they found prices highest by far at Sam Goody
also.<BR>><BR>> Sam Goody at the PEM is closing in part because
of corporate problems, <BR>> part<BR>> of which may be related
to their pricing strategies. The local Sam Goody<BR>> also had
other problems, some not fit for discussion on this
list.<BR>><BR>><BR>> For those keeping track:<BR>><BR>>
There are seven, soon to be eight vacancies at the
PEM:<BR>><BR>> 1. Army Recruiters<BR>> 2. Marine
Recruiters<BR>> 3. Optometrist Office<BR>> 4. Chocolaut<BR>>
5. Flower Shop<BR>> 6. Subway<BR>> 7. Market Place Gifts<BR>>
8. Sam Goody<BR>><BR>> There are persistent rumors that one
quite large retailer is seriously<BR>> considering
leaving.<BR>><BR>> Questions:<BR>><BR>> 1. Where is the
PEM in its life cycle?<BR>> 2. Did the redecoration at the PEM with
the oodles of light fixtures <BR>> that<BR>> makes one think
that they are in the midst of an extensive, well organized<BR>>
invasion of flying saucers help or hinder the effort to attract
more<BR>> customers?<BR>> 3. Did the stinginess/anti-community
attitude of the PEM management in<BR>> eliminating the bus stop
help or hinder the volume of business?<BR>> 4. If the vacancies at
the PEM are an indication in some way of <BR>> problems<BR>> of
some kind with the local economy, how does this reflect on plans for
<BR>> the<BR>> big jesus shopping mall planned for just over the
state line?<BR>> 5. Does the PEM vacancy rate have anything to do
with the WalMart or <BR>> the<BR>> two proposed WalMart Super
Centers?<BR>> 6. What, if anything, could the PEM management do to
increase the <BR>> general<BR>> volume of
business?<BR>><BR>> Of course, question 3 above is quite biasly
stated; however, I think some<BR>> community reflection on these
questions would be helpful in examining and<BR>> shaping some
community values.<BR>><BR>><BR>> Quite sadly, a downtown
store which we patronized very happily, is soon to<BR>> go out of
business. Although they carried a really excellent line of<BR>>
products, gave excellent customer service, were very product <BR>>
knowledgeable,<BR>> and had an extremely liberal return policy,
they are being squeezed by the<BR>> internet. This is what happens:
People come in and look at the<BR>> merchandise, get detailed
information, ask technical questions, examine<BR>> closely /try on
the products, then they order the products over the<BR>>
internet.<BR>><BR>> For many items we buy locally, we do just
the opposite. We research using<BR>> the internet, then buy or
special order the products locally. Local<BR>> merchants contribute
and support many diverse community activities --<BR>> internet
etailers do not. Etailers generally do not collect Idaho sales
<BR>> tax<BR>> either.<BR>><BR>> Are any list members are
concerned about the health of several local<BR>> business who face
heavy competition from the internet?<BR>><BR>><BR>> Art Deco
(Wayne A. Fox)<BR>> deco@moscow.com<BR>><BR>><BR>><BR>>
----- Original Message ----- <BR>> From: "Tom Hansen" <THANSEN
@moscow.com=""><BR>> To: "Moscow Vision 2020" <VISION2020
@moscow.com=""><BR>> Sent: Friday, March 03, 2006 6:57 AM<BR>>
Subject: [Vision2020] Goodnight Goody, Goodnight
Ridge<BR>><BR>><BR>>> >From today's (March 3, 2006) UI
Argonaut with a special thanks to Jay<BR>>>
Feldman.<BR>>><BR>>>
----------------------------------------------------------------<BR>>><BR>>>
Goodnight Goody, goodnight Ridge<BR>>><BR>>> Dear
Editor,<BR>>><BR>>> Am I the only one that noticed the
irony in the placement of the column<BR>>> "Death of a pop
supercenter" next to the anti-Superwalmart editorial?<BR>>> The
writer, Jon Ross, laments that Sam Goody is going out of
business<BR>>> nationwide (including Moscow) while he dreams of
an indie-esque record <BR>>> store<BR>>> in Moscow to
replace it. Oddly though, Ross tells us there is just such
a<BR>>> store in Moscow, Paradise Ridge Records, but he is
unwilling to patronize <BR>>> it<BR>>> because its prices
are higher than the defunct Goody.<BR>>><BR>>> Well, as
consumers, we can't have it both ways. We can't have
quality<BR>>> independent stores that pay more into the local
tax base, offer <BR>>> personalized<BR>>> service, a
greater selection, a professional staff that is paid a
living<BR>>> wage, along with, as the writer expects, "cheap
music." Yet, we expect to<BR>>> because Wal-Mart has responded
to our deep desire for the lowest price by<BR>>> setting us on a
race to the bottom where every store must match its <BR>>>
prices<BR>>> regardless of what that store might offer its
patrons and its community.<BR>>><BR>>> Unfortunately, in
America, price has become the sole factor in deciding<BR>>>
which stores we frequent. As the world's largest retailer, Wal-Mart
can<BR>>> offer the lowest prices possible but at a high cost to
communities like<BR>>> Moscow. Shoppers have come to assume the
Wal-Mart price is the proper <BR>>> market<BR>>> price and
the Wal-Mart price thus is the price we should expect to
pay.<BR>>> Because of such a mentality, shoppers - including
Ross, at his own <BR>>> admission<BR>>> - will not pay
more than this false standard. As a result, when forced to<BR>>>
compete with a Super Wal-Mart, small independent stores, like many
in<BR>>> Moscow, go out of business and small towns are left
with the impersonal,<BR>>> poor selection, tax-base draining,
Super Wal-Marts, just the position <BR>>> Ross<BR>>>
laments.<BR>>><BR>>> Certainly paying a bit extra is
difficult for many, and luckily we have <BR>>> the<BR>>>
independent chain WinCo to provide us with groceries that beat any
Super<BR>>> Wal-Mart's prices and an existing Wal-Mart for those
who wish to shop <BR>>> there.<BR>>> What we don't need is
a Wal-Mart Supercenter that will reinforce this<BR>>> "lowest
price at any cost" mentality.<BR>>><BR>>> Ross laments not
having a quality, all-music store in Moscow, when in <BR>>>
fact<BR>>> we do have one. Ross needs to do what so many of us
need to do, overcome <BR>>> our<BR>>> addiction to low
price and support the local businesses whose tax <BR>>>
revenues<BR>>> support us.<BR>>><BR>>> Jay P.
Feldman<BR>>> Department of philosophy<BR>>><BR>>>
---------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>>><BR>>>
Seeya round town, Moscow.<BR>>><BR>>> Tom
Hansen<BR>>> Moscow, Idaho<BR>>><BR>>><BR>>>
**************************************************************<BR>>><BR>>>
"A bad cause will ever be supported by bad means and bad
men."<BR>>><BR>>> - Thomas Paine (English Writer,
1737-1809)<BR>>><BR>>>
**************************************************************<BR>>><BR>>><BR>>><BR>>>
_____________________________________________________<BR>>> List
services made available by First Step Internet,<BR>>> serving
the communities of the Palouse since 1994.<BR>>>
http://www.fsr.net<BR>>>
mailto:Vision2020@moscow.com<BR>>>
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