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<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>I have suggested that Safeway won't survivie with
or without a Wal-Mart and had a friend tell me why she won't shop there...its
the card! When they first got the 'card' she tried to get some cherries locally
that were marked 99 cents she thought until she got to the checker and was
informed that price was only good if she had a 'card'. She walked out and has
not been back and so have her children. I am well aware that many don't
mind the stores keeping track of what they purchase and when but I do and know
many others do also. It was a poor business decision and they will pay the
marketplace price for it as well as Rite Aid and others. This friend is older
and lived in Troy in the 1940's so I asked her if Troy ever had a clothing store
and she said yes. When she moved there someone did but they got older and didn't
stay in business and the persons family did not take it over so it has been a
long time. I have heard that the new Wal-mart will hurt the small cities but I
don't think it will more so than now because otherwise a 'short trip' to the
store turns into hours from far enough out. Yes, those on the way home from work
in the bigger cities will stop before they get that far but that has to be
happening now doesn't it? Also, I recently had a problem with a tire and went to
Les Shwab because I have their tires. A young man stopped me in the parking lot
asked the problem and I went in and filled out a yellow form. Within less that
10 min he came in and said it had been a stem and it was fixed and to have a
nice day! I want you to know that I am not likely to give up that service.
Especially being an 'older' woman, alone and poor I need help and I am smart
enough to know it. I do not know what service Wal-mart offers but I do not see
me changing that part of my shopping. </FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>I want you to know that I am not saying that two
new stores won't make changes I am just saying that it all levels out and some
survive and some don't...been that way a long time. </FONT></DIV>
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<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV>
<DIV
style="BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: black"><B>From:</B>
<A title=joekc@adelphia.net
href="mailto:joekc@adelphia.net">joekc@adelphia.net</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A title=pkraut@moscow.com
href="mailto:pkraut@moscow.com">Pat Kraut</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Cc:</B> <A title=vision2020@moscow.com
href="mailto:vision2020@moscow.com">vision2020</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Tuesday, January 31, 2006 8:17
AM</DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> Re: [Vision2020] One more
WalMart thing . . .</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV>
<P>Thanks for your comments, Pat. </P>
<P>I agree that stores need to diversify in order to stay in business. This is
one reason that Hodgins is still around and still able to provide local folks
with a wonderful selection of toys, ones that are not available at Wal-Mart. I
won't deny that there is an important message for local business owners to
learn. But can the diversity that Hodgins currently offers compete with a
Super Wal-Mart, which (I suspect) will have a pharmacy and a drug store in
addition to a toy store? Must Safeway diversify and sell more than mere food
and household supplies to stay in business? In the case of Safeway, we loose
more than a local store since they regularly stock items on their shelves
which are produced by local companies, items that the Super Wal-Mart will not
stock. So there is a great deal of our local economy that will change with the
additon of two Super Wal-Marts. </P>
<P>I wonder why you think that blame in all this lies with the unions,
especially given Wal-Marts union-busting stance. </P>
<P>One more thing. I am not a fatalist. I am not certain that "we are not
going to be able to completely stop Wal-mart or other stores from following
their example of business." Ultimately we need to remind people about their
true values as opposed to the ones that they reflect given the current
business trends of stores like Wal-Mart. I'm not suggesting that it will be
easy to bring on this kind of awareness. But it is not
impossible.<BR>--<BR>Joe Campbell<BR><BR>---- Pat Kraut <PKRAUT
moscow.com="#DEFAULT">wrote:<BR><BR>=============<BR>I have seen so many 'one
item' stores close since moving to Moscow it would be hard to miss the point.
A baby store that only sells baby stuff, a women's store that only sell high
priced items, a 'teeny bopper' store that only has clothes that fit a 15 year
old, a toy store that only sells high priced toys that and so on and so on. If
a store does not sell a variety of items it won't make it in small cities.
Especially if, as in the case of KB they sell only toys at a price that is
twice what they are in Lewiston or Spokane. The first week I lived here the
people I met were delighted that I knew how to get around in Spokane so they
could go shopping up there and not stay downtown. I could get to the Northtown
mall and they were thrilled and I became very popular. That was 1961 and
nothing has changed except that lots of trips are made to Lewiston now and
they didn't then. The best kind of stores are ones that sell lots of items at
a price most people can afford and Sam Walton built a business based on that
premise. He was full of new ideas and made it work for him...just like others
before him who figured out how to do it for themselves and make a fortune. It
is the American dream. It is what freedom means...being able to make choices
at all levels. Even at the level of making obscene amounts of money. Do we
need to do some checks? yes obviously, but we are not going to be able to
completely stop Wal-mart or other stores from following their example of
business. Unions have made it difficult to do business in the USA for sometime
now and they are going to have to be reigned in also...look at autos. It is
one of the problems we have and Congress is too busy looking at other things
to really address the need...but it will be fixed in the marketplace just as
other things have been in the past.<BR>----- Original Message -----<BR>From:
joekc@adelphia.net<BR>To: Jeff Harkins<BR>Cc: vision2020@moscow.com<BR>Sent:
Monday, January 30, 2006 7:46 PM<BR>Subject: Re: [Vision2020] One more WalMart
thing . . .<BR><BR><BR>Jeff,<BR><BR>Thanks, very much, for the explanation of
KB Toys demise. Apologies to J. Ford who hinted at a similar point that I
failed to investigate further. (I did a quick search for KB on the web, and
find a website, thought that they were still in business.) I don't remember
Gary saying anything even close to the explanation below, but either way the
details are helpful.<BR><BR>A few points though. The Moscow store was closed
well before the Spokane store. I find it hard to believe that local market
factors had nothing to do with this. But this is a minor point.<BR><BR>A
somewhat more substantive point is that toy stores like KB Toys, as well as
grocery stores like Albertsons, are having a difficult time staying in
business given the success of Super Wal-Marts. Jeff, you know a lot about
economics but you know nothing about toys if you think that the selection at
Wal-Mart and the selection at KB Toys is the same. It just isn't. Trust me.
I've spent a lot of time in the last few years in each (I shoped at Wal-Mart
regularly up until 2 months ago). Just taking hot wheels cars, for instance,
KB had a much better selection.<BR><BR>Further, my claim was not that "good
businesses were being driven out by bad businesses." My point was that the
so-called 'free market' does not always lead to an increase in consumer
choice. It was a rebutal of an old article of economic faith uttered
continuously by Donovan but, I believe, also by yourself and
Gary.<BR><BR>Let's skip the KB example since there are facts about that case
of which I am clearly ignorant. Let's, instead, borrow a piece of economic
analysis offered by Gary in a previous post. There he claimed that KB Toys and
its ilk were being pushed out by a move toward computer games and other
electronic toys as well as the increase of web-based toy stores. It just so
happens that (a) I don't like computer games and I don't want my son to play
them (I'll save you the explanation) and (b) I don't like to order things
on-line (I'll save you the explanation here, too). Sure, I'm old-fashioned but
my point is the the so-called free market has not lead to a greater number of
choices for the consumer. We are forced now by 'consumer demand' to purchase
new and different toys in stores or older models on-line. There is only an
appearance of an increase of choice provided that you happen to like what the
majority of people like. If your tastes and inclinations go against the
majority, too bad for you.<BR><BR>Again, Gary might say something about my
selfish motivations but he is (again) missing the point. I ask you, people of
Moscow: Do you live here because Moscow is like every place else or because it
is different? Do you think of yourself as someone who thinks just like
everyone else or someone who thinks outside the box? If the answer to both is
the latter, do what you can to CHOOSE now to ensure that Moscow remains unique
before low-cost and convenience turns it into Anytown, USA.<BR>--<BR>Joe
Campbell<BR><BR>---- Jeff Harkins wrote:<BR><BR>=============<BR>Before I
invest the time necessary to unravel the<BR>comments by Mr. Schou, I need to
divest myself<BR>from the claim by Ms. Opyr that I asked for an<BR>example of
a good business driven out by a bad<BR>(or whatever). I made no such request.
I did<BR>respond to the query raised by Gary (which I<BR>considered an
appropriate question, given the<BR>claim by J Campbell that good businesses
were<BR>being driven out by bad businesses - the thread<BR>is clear - J
Campbell offered up the example)<BR><BR>I provided evidence supporting a
position that KB<BR>Toys left Moscow, entered into E-commerce as a<BR>result
of being convicted of charges of price<BR>manipulation, which appears to have
resulted in<BR>their declaration of bankruptcy. If there was a<BR>Wal-Mart
connection, it doesn't appear to be part of the public record.<BR><BR>Ms. Opyr
appears to be careless in her reading<BR>and quick to indict. It would make
V2020 more<BR>useful as a public forum if you would be more careful in your
posts.<BR><BR>I am unsure of the value of knowing Ms. Opyr's<BR>consumption
habits. Personal consumption habits<BR>are ...... personal. Oddly enough, I
found a<BR>very different toy selection at Wal-Mart than she<BR>described.
While shopping for toys for nieces<BR>and nephews this Christmas season, I
noted that<BR>most all the retailers in the area carried pretty<BR>much the
same toys (my guess is that their<BR>inventory is driven by what they perceive
their<BR>market demand is - ah - what the kids want!) The<BR>real challenge
was to find a retailer that<BR>actually had the item in stock (not
sold<BR>out). Some of the items were found in the malls,<BR>some at Walmart -
alas - some could only be found in Spokane.<BR><BR>But, as to the availability
of KB Toys, their<BR>products are still available through their E-Commerce
site.<BR><BR>Finally, I took no personal position on whether<BR>KB was a good
business or a bad business - we all<BR>have our personal and subjective
standards for<BR>such qualitative judgments. I did make the claim<BR>that KB
Toys was not a superior business and I<BR>did provide additional information
so that those<BR>interested would have more info about the factors<BR>leading
to KB's decision to close the Moscow Mall store.<BR><BR>Now, to the Schou
matter .... till then.<BR><BR><BR>At 03:43 PM 1/30/2006, you
wrote:<BR>>Dear Visionaries:<BR>><BR>>Jeff Harkins and Gary Crabtree
asked a few days<BR>>ago for examples of good businesses
driven<BR>>out<BR>>by bad. Joe Campbell attempted to supply
them<BR>>with just such an example in the demise of<BR>>KayBee Toys. The
problem here, however, is not<BR>>with Joe's answer but with Harkins'
and<BR>>Crabtree's question, which is a classic example<BR>>of petititio
elenchi, i.e., begging the<BR>>question.<BR>><BR>>The underlying
assumption in Harkins/Crabtree's<BR>>reasoning is that the "good" or
"superior"<BR>><BR>>business is always the one that survives.
But<BR>>that reasoning depends on how you define<BR>>superior. KayBee
Toys, which offered a<BR>>demonstrably superior selection of goods
than<BR>>WalMart,<BR>>went out of business. Is WalMart therefore
the<BR>>better store? Define better. WalMart<BR>>offers
five<BR>>aisles of cheap, plastic, Chinese-made toys,<BR>>none of which
I'd care to purchase. Like<BR>>Joe, I prefer<BR>>to buy my kids' toys at
Hodgins<BR>>Drugs. Why? Quality and selection. It's also possible<BR>>at
Hodgins<BR>>to buy the occasional union-made toy. Flip the<BR>>toy and
read the box. If it's made in a<BR>>country<BR>>noted for its poor labor
practices, tell your<BR>>kids, "Sorry, but I suspect that
someone<BR>>your age<BR>>manufactured this doll in an overseas
sweatshop." Move on to the next item.<BR>><BR>>(There, Dale -- more
evidence for your blog that I'm a communist.)<BR>><BR>>In
Harkins/Crabtree's view, it would seem that<BR>>cheaper is always better.
Perhaps<BR>>convenience<BR>>also plays some role (KayBee Toys didn't
sell<BR>>toothpaste or underwear) but weren't we
also<BR>><BR>>talking about expansion of choice? How does<BR>>WalMart
(or a WalMart Supercenter) represent<BR>>a<BR>>genuine expansion of
choice? What WalMart<BR>>offers is an inferior selection of toys,
most<BR>>of poor<BR>>quality, but it offers them at cheap prices
and<BR>>conveniently locates them between the<BR>>furnace<BR>>filters
and the dog food. My expanded choice<BR>>seems to be mere convenience and
the chance<BR>>to<BR>>buy something crappy and disposable for
my<BR>>kids. It's the bargain that isn't a bargain
--<BR>>it's<BR>>penny-wise and pound-foolish.<BR>><BR>>We have a
WalMart already. We need WalMart<BR>>Supercenters in both Moscow and
Pullman why?<BR>>Because Winco, Rosauers, Safeway, the
Co-Op,<BR>>Dissmore's, the Pullman Safeway, Tri-State,<BR>>Hodgins, Les
Schwab, Bruneel, Sears,<BR>>Deranleau's, Bookpeople, Hastings,
Gottschalk's, the<BR>>Bon,<BR>>Ross Dress for Less, RiteAid,
JoAnn's,<BR>>HyperSpud, Paradise Creek Bicycles, Paradise
Ridge<BR>>Records, Goodwill, Shopko, the Internet, and<BR>>Moscow's
existing WalMart aren't offering us<BR>>enough choice? Or because they're
not offering us enough cheap crap?<BR>><BR>>Joan Opyr/Auntie
Establishment<BR>>www.joanopyr.com<BR>><BR>><BR>>---------------------------------------------<BR>>This
message was sent by First Step
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