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<DIV><FONT size=4>Joan, Kai,</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=4></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=4>For a <EM>camera obscura</EM> discussion about the
shroud: <A
href="http://www.petech.ac.za/shroud/nature.htm">http://www.petech.ac.za/shroud/nature.htm</A></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=4></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=4><BR>Art Deco (Wayne A. Fox)<BR><A
href="mailto:deco@moscow.com">deco@moscow.com</A><BR></FONT></DIV>
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<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV>
<DIV
style="BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: black"><B>From:</B>
<A title=auntiestablishment@hotmail.com
href="mailto:auntiestablishment@hotmail.com">Joan Opyr</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A title=editor@lataheagle.com
href="mailto:editor@lataheagle.com">Kai Eiselein</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Cc:</B> <A title=vision2020@moscow.com
href="mailto:vision2020@moscow.com">Vision2020 Moscow</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Friday, March 25, 2005 1:32
PM</DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> Re: [Vision2020] The Shroud of
Hype</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV>Hi Kai,</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>Thanks for the photography clarifications. Do you need a convex
lens for a camera obscura, though? The image on the shroud is not
especially clear; it's the image on negatives of pictures of the shroud that
are clear. And would it not be possible to fix a dead body in such a way
that it didn't sway? I hate to be gross, but one needn't suspend a body
from a rope -- one could, well, nail it in place. (Man, I hate saying
this so close to Easter. I'll be accused of being anti-Christian
again.)</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>Anyhow, the Forbes piece isn't the only critique of Nate's
methodology. Photographers 'round the country have been talking about
the long history of sun prints, and etc., for the past week. Oh, and you
might want to take a look at some of the Shroud/Camera Obscura websites
regarding method. They account for the washing of the shroud post
image-burning and the fixative issue. Not that I have a horse in this
race because I don't. I also like the "it's a real but stolen
burial shroud" theory. Why? Because that would be
<STRONG>REALLY</STRONG> gross and thus quite in keeping with the habits and
proclivities of those who actually dealt in the medieval relics
trade. The toe-bones of saints? And vials of blood?
Where do you think they got those? Uh-huh. No corpse was safe from
their predations.</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>All the best,</DIV>
<DIV>Joan/Auntie </DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>PS: I will be playing some REM on the radio show this weekend.
I hope that will satisfy your debased musical tastes.</DIV>
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<DIV style="FONT: 10pt Arial">----- Original Message -----</DIV>
<DIV
style="BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt Arial; COLOR: black"><B>From:</B> Kai
Eiselein</DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt Arial"><B>Sent:</B> Friday, March 25, 2005 8:44
AM</DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt Arial"><B>To:</B> vision2020@moscow.com</DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt Arial"><B>Subject:</B> [Vision2020] The Shroud of
Hype</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>Well, I stand corrected on the possibility that bleaching
could have been<BR>the method, Joan. My apology.<BR><BR>However, the theory
that a camera obscura could have been used to make the<BR>image has several
flaws.<BR>1: A solution of silver nitrate would soak clear through the
cloth, and<BR>would be identifiable by testing, as would a fixing solution.
The images on<BR>the cloth, according to the Forbes article, can be removed
with adhesive<BR>tape. The image would go deeper than the surface.<BR>2: If,
at the time the shroud was made, there was no distortion free glass,<BR>I
highly doubt that a decent convex lens could have been made to
gain<BR>reasonable sharpness of the image. The photos of the shroud that
I've seen<BR>show it to be reasonably so.<BR>3: The movement from a hanging
corpse would blur the image, as would the<BR>slightest draft of air on the
shroud itself. The exposure time would have<BR>been incredibly long, too
long to keep from blurring.<BR>4: A rope to hang the corpse would have shown
at least as a shadow on the<BR>shroud.<BR>5: The image would show
degradation for a couple of reasons. First, I doubt<BR>there would have been
a fixing agent that would last long enough in that day<BR>and age. Second, I
doubt people would have understood how to archive it so<BR>that it wouldn't
have faded. There are images with us today that have<BR>survived 100 years
or so, but the archiving was much better. I have B/W<BR>images that are half
that age that show degradation due to improper fixing,<BR>mishandling and
improper archiving. To expect an image to last for several<BR>times that
long is a stretch, I think.<BR>Just as an aside, I've been involved with
photography nearly my entire life.<BR>Both of my grandfathers were
lithographers, so I spent many happy hours<BR>messing around in a darkroom.
I've been shooting professionaly since I was<BR>about 15 or 16 years old,
and I shoot thousands of images a year.<BR>I'm currently archiving my
families photos, some of which date to the Civil<BR>War. My camera
collection dates back to the early 1900s.<BR>OK, I'm done puffing out my
chest now. I just love photography and can talk<BR>about it
endlessly.<BR><BR><BR><BR><BR><BR>Kai T. Eiselein<BR>Editor<BR>Latah
Eagle<BR>521 S. Jackson St.<BR>Moscow, ID 83843<BR>(208) 882-0666 Fax (208)
882-0130<BR>editor@lataheagle.com<BR><BR><BR>_____________________________________________________<BR>List
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