[Vision2020] Firm seeks to undo megaloads ruling

Tue Sep 24 22:57:18 PDT 2013

OK - point taken.  Thanks.  I also agree with Paul of not wanting 'our government deciding what legal items we 
are allowed or not allowed to move along a public road based solely on 
their intended purpose.'

-Scott

Date: Tue, 24 Sep 2013 18:13:17 -0700
Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Firm seeks to undo megaloads ruling
From: keim153 at gmail.com
To: scooterd408 at hotmail.com
CC: ngier at uidaho.edu; thansen at moscow.com; vision2020 at moscow.com

I don't think it effects Nicks point at all, Scott.  If the road was appropriate for these trucks they wouldn't have to go to so much extra effort to make it work.  Just because the square peg is small enough to fit in the round hole, doesn't mean it is a match.

On Tue, Sep 24, 2013 at 6:05 PM, Scott Dredge <scooterd408 at hotmail.com> wrote:

Nick,

One Megaload has already been shipped through Highway 12 so doesn't that torpedo your point about the route not being apporpriate?  It's interesting to me that the argument continues to shift from Tom being incoherent and all over the map as usual, to Rose's point about Treaty Rights which is what is presently stalling out the move, and now to yours about the road not being appropriately 'high and wide'.

If any others want to pile on with their ancillary reasons for blocking the Megaload shipments, now would be a good time to add to the growing list.

-Scott

From: ngier at uidaho.edu

To: thansen at moscow.com; scooterd408 at hotmail.com
CC: vision2020 at moscow.com; ngier006 at gmail.com

Subject: RE: [Vision2020] Firm seeks to undo megaloads ruling
Date: Wed, 25 Sep 2013 00:00:46 +0000

I
 didn't see this go through.  Forgive me if this is re-post

Hi Wayne:

As
 an anti-megaload advocate, I do not deny that Highway 12 is a
commercial
 road.  To argue otherwise is absurd.

What
 I do say is that it is not an appropriate "high and wide (!!!!)"

industrial
 corridor as the designated route, for example, that goes
from
 Houston to the Canadian border.  That's where these loads should
be
 hauled.

Nick

From: vision2020-bounces at moscow.com <vision2020-bounces at moscow.com> on behalf of Tom Hansen <thansen at moscow.com>

Sent: Tuesday, September 24, 2013 4:57 PM

To: Scott Dredge

Cc: viz

Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Firm seeks to undo megaloads ruling

Glad you're interested, Mr. Dredge.

Here is Judge Winmill's decision in its entirety.  Happy reading!

http://www.nomegaloads.com/091313_Judge_Winmill_Ruling.htm

Seeya 'round town, Moscow, because . . .

"Moscow Cares" (the most fun you can have with your pants on)
http://www.MoscowCares.com

Tom Hansen
Moscow, Idaho

"There's room at the top they are telling you still 
But first you must learn how to smile as you kill 
If you want to be like the folks on the hill."

- John Lennon

On Sep 24, 2013, at 4:29 PM, Scott Dredge <scooterd408 at hotmail.com> wrote:

I didn't read the ruling but the snipets from the judge that were printed in the press were well reasoned in my opinion.  I have no issue with the ruling.  The whole 'Treaty Rights' deal is your pet peeve and if it has teeth, then run with it. 
 It has little to do with screwing up Tom's beautiful Highway 12 which unarguably already screws up the natural beauty of the region.  It's almost a shame that there weren't more Toms around back in the day to stop the highway from being built in the first
 place rather than just now trying to stop it from being temporarily used for its intended purpose.

-Scott

From: donaldrose at cpcinternet.com

To: scooterd408 at hotmail.com; 
godshatter at yahoo.com; bear at moscow.com

CC: vision2020 at moscow.com

Subject: RE: [Vision2020] Firm seeks to undo megaloads ruling

Date: Tue, 24 Sep 2013 16:13:47 -0700

Have any of you read
U.S. District Judge B. Lynn Winmill ruled in favor of the Nez Perce Tribe and Idaho Rivers United, granting
 an injunction to stop future Omega Morgan megaload shipments on U.S. Highway 12. ?  Do any of you understand the term “Treaty Rights” ? Are you aware of the terms of the 1855 Treaty?  Best inform yourselves a bit more or folks might think that you are
 all blatting on about things you have no specialist knowledge, background or training on. 

Rose Huskey

From:
vision2020-bounces at moscow.com [mailto:vision2020-bounces at moscow.com]
On Behalf Of Scott Dredge

Sent: Tuesday, September 24, 2013 2:19 PM

To: Paul Rumelhart; Wayne Price

Cc: viz

Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Firm seeks to undo megaloads ruling

I just think the whole brouhaha is politics as usual.  Using Hansen's illogic about a the 'once-beautiful passage (simply cited on a map as US Highway 12) from Lewiston, Idaho
 to Lolo, Montana', anyone could make the case that Highway 12 itself already has ruined this 'once-beautiful passage'.  I think all precautions should be put in place to safely move the Megaloads down Highway 12 with minimal disruption to those living and
 traveling along that corridor, but once they've moved on through there wouldn't be anything different from now.  The one Megaload that has already gone through hasn't changed anything about that stretch of highway so that pretty much neuters the argument that
 the Megaloads will ruin things.  The delays will be forgotten, trees are renewable, and road and power line damage can be fixed.  Anything affecting the scenic view (or lack thereof) years from now will be caused by something other than the Megaloads which
 are simply passing through for a relatively very brief period of time.

-Scott

Date: Tue, 24 Sep 2013 13:48:26 -0700

From: godshatter at yahoo.com

Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Firm seeks to undo megaloads ruling

To: bear at moscow.com; 
scooterd408 at hotmail.com

CC: vision2020 at moscow.com

>From my perspective, I understand and sympathize with arguments involving the possible problems with moving a large megaload through the area (delays, cutting trees, possible damage
 to the road).  What I object to are the political arguments involving the purpose for these megaloads.  I really don't want our government deciding what legal items we are allowed or not allowed to move along a public road based solely on their intended purpose. 
 The roads should be like the phone lines.  No restrictions on what goes down them unless an actual law is broken.  Pursuant to the permitting process and so forth, of course.

I do think what you are saying about "if they control it then they should pay for it" makes sense.  There are also some State/Federal issue I'm not particularly comfortable with here, too.

Paul

From: Wayne Price <bear at moscow.com>

To: Scott Dredge <scooterd408 at hotmail.com>

Cc: Moscow Vision 2020 <vision2020 at moscow.com>

Sent: Tuesday, September 24, 2013 12:49 PM

Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Firm seeks to undo megaloads ruling

Scott,

I have also driven Hwy 12, and there is NOTHING changed along that route, but I have taken steps by contacting my state representatives, and strongly urge them that since a federal judge
 in Boise has determined that both the Nez Perce Tribe and the US Forest Service now has the final say so over what travels on what was previously a state controlled highway, there should be NO state funds put into that highway. IF the Nez Perce and the Forest
 Service control that highway, let them pay for the maintenance and upkeep. This is also a red-flag warning to any other state that if one of their highways is designated a 

Roads were built and maintained for commerce. IF the nay-sayers want a road that looks and function like the route traveled  by  Lewis and Clark, so be it, but I don't want my state
 transportation dollars supporting it. Those funds, if approved by the state legislature, can come out of and be administered by the state historical preservations office.

Wayne

On Sep 24, 2013, at 12:05 PM, Scott Dredge wrote:

When you write about 'our children and our children's children', is that specifically your children or other' children?

One Megaload has already crossed. Have you been through Highway 12 since that time and noticed any change to the scenic environment?  If not, when was the last time you travelled Highway
 12 Megaload route?

-Scott

On Sep 24, 2013, at 2:55 AM, "Moscow Cares" <moscowcares at moscow.com> wrote:

Years from now, when our children and our children's children, journey across that once-beautiful passage (simply cited on a map as US Highway 12) from Lewiston, Idaho to Lolo, Montana,
 i do not want their first two words to be, "Remember when . . . "

Courtesy of today's (September 24, 2013) Lewiston Tribune.

---------------------------------

Firm seeks to undo megaloads ruling

If judge won't halt suspension, company will appeal

A General Electric subsidiary said a federal judge made several legal errors when he barred megaloads from using U.S. Highway 12 and has asked him to reconsider.

If the request is denied, attorneys for Resource Conservation Company International said they will appeal the ruling by U.S. District Judge B. Lynn Winmill that closed the highway to
 its contracted shipper Omega Morgan and its plans to haul massive water purification equipment to Canadian oil fields via the highway.

On Sept. 12, Winmill ruled against RCCI and the U.S. Forest Service and issued a preliminary injunction ordering the agency to block the loads. The injunction was requested by the Nez
 Perce Tribe and the environmental group Idaho Rivers United. On Sept. 17, Regional Forester Faye Kruger of Missoula, Mont., issued an order barring megaloads from using the portion of the highway that crosses the forest.

In his ruling, Winmill said the agency's failure to stop the shipments violated several federal laws, including the Wild and Scenic Rivers Act as well as the Clearwater National Forest
 Plan. That ruling was based, in part, on a phone conversation between Forest Service Chief Tom Tidwell and Nez Perce Tribal Chairman Silas Whitman in which Tidwell reportedly refused Whitman's request to block the loads.

The legal request from the company alleges Winmill was wrong to consider Tidwell's refusal as a final agency action because Forest Service officials were in the process of conducting
 a study on megaload impacts to the Middle Fork of the Clearwater/Lochsa Wild and Scenic River Corridor and had also begun formal consultations with the tribe.

The company also disagreed with Winmill's finding that the agency's discretionary decision not to previously take enforcement action against Omega-Morgan was an "extreme abdication of
 statutory responsibility" and the company claims the judge based his decision to order the closure on an issue not raised during court briefings but raised in oral arguments, leaving them too little time to respond.

Attorneys for the company also took issue with Winmill saying it stood to lose $5 million if it couldn't use the highway. They said the company actually could be out $85 million. Because
 the company's plans to use the highway predate a February decision by Winmill saying the Forest Service has authority to regulate megaload traffic, they said the judge's characterization of their decision to use the highway as a calculated risk was in error.

"RCCI respectfully requests that the court, on an expedited basis, reconsider its order, deny plaintiffs' request for injunctive relief, and direct the Forest Service to rescind its
 September 17, 2013 closure order accordingly. Should the court decline to reconsider its order, or should it reconsider its order only to conclude that the injunction should remain, RCCI alternatively requests that the court grant RCCI's request to stay the
 injunction pending an appeal," according to court documents.

The company shipped a megaload over the highway in early August, which spawned four nights of protests by tribal members and environmentalists. Another RCCI oversized load awaits shipment
 at the Port of Wilma and the company has said it intends to use the highway to ship six more loads to Canada.

---------------------------------

A year or so ago a bunch of us "anti-megaloaders" gathered at the residence of Borg Hendricks and Lin Laughy.  At one point during the festivities, Lin explained how this all got started
 a few years ago . . .

He explained that, having heard about the potential of ever-increasing (in size and number) loads being transported up US-12 from the Lewiston Port into Montana and up to Canada, he
 and Borg discussed this and how adeversely it would impact the Scenic Byway of Highway 12.  Apparently the discussion became a bit heated, and as they quizically looked at each other, Borg said to Lin (or Lin said to Borg) . . . "Hey, ya think maybe . . .
 ?"

And so it began.

Well, Lin and Borg, as a passage in the song "High Hopes" goes . . .

"High Hopes"

"Just what makes that little old ant

Think he'll move that rubber tree plant

Anyone knows an ant, can't

Move a rubber tree plant

But he's got high hopes

He's got high hopes

He's got high apple pie

In the sky hopes

So any time you're gettin' low

'Stead of lettin' go, just remember that ant

Oops, there goes another rubber tree plant

Oops, there goes another rubber tree plant

Oops, there goes another rubber tree plant."

Seeya 'round town, Moscow, because . . .

"Moscow Cares" (the most fun you can have with your pants on)

http://www.MoscowCares.com

Tom Hansen

Moscow, Idaho

"This is the 'Mouse that Roared,' 'David and Goliath' and 'Avatar' all rolled into one.  We must remember that the thousands of citizens involved in this effort to protect their personal and family safety, their businesses and their
 lifestyles are confronting some of the largest international corporations in the world."

~ Linwood Laughy 

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List services made available by First Step Internet,

serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.

              http://www.fsr.net

         mailto:Vision2020 at moscow.com

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=======================================================

List services made available by First Step Internet,

serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.

              http://www.fsr.net

          mailto:Vision2020 at moscow.com

=======================================================

=======================================================

List services made available by First Step Internet,

serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.

              http://www.fsr.net

         mailto:Vision2020 at moscow.com

=======================================================

=======================================================

 List services made available by First Step Internet,

 serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.

               http://www.fsr.net

          mailto:Vision2020 at moscow.com

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