[Vision2020] Should he have stayed in his truck?

Paul Rumelhart godshatter at yahoo.com
Mon Jul 22 18:04:01 PDT 2013


He compares a long list of charges the six teens are facing vs. a charge 
that was waived for Zimmerman.  What am I supposed to infer from that?

Paul


On 07/22/2013 05:55 PM, Sunil Ramalingam wrote:
> Lord knows I disagree with Tom plenty. However, I think you're the 
> only person who thinks Tom made that inference.
>
> Sunil
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Date: Mon, 22 Jul 2013 16:35:49 -0700
> From: godshatter at yahoo.com
> To: philosopher.joe at gmail.com
> CC: vision2020 at moscow.com
> Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Should he have stayed in his truck?
>
> I don't know what 13- and 14-year-olds deserve.  I'll have to think 
> about this for a while. I was just responding to Tom's inferences that 
> these kids were getting the short end of the stick while Zimmerman, 
> because people think of him as white I guess, got a waived sentence.  
> So I was curious what lesser sentences they deserved.
>
> I don't believe that there is any one age where a child magically 
> becomes an adult.  It's a continuum.  I would also be very surprised 
> if I found out that a adults brain crystallizes at a set age and never 
> changes after that. Anything beyond that I'll have to think about a bit.
>
> Oh, I'm not a neuroscience denier, by the way.  I'm sure that a 
> teenagers brain is different than a middle-aged man's brain.  I just 
> don't know what you want me to do with that information.  How should I 
> change my current tactics of treating 17-year-olds as adults when I 
> meet them?  What should I do differently, knowing that their brain 
> functioning is not fully developed in the regions that govern impulse 
> control? Should we as a society not punish teenagers for doing things 
> we are sure they understand are wrong?
>
> Paul
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> *From:* Joe Campbell <philosopher.joe at gmail.com>
> *To:* Paul Rumelhart <godshatter at yahoo.com>
> *Cc:* Moscow Cares <moscowcares at moscow.com>; "vision2020 at moscow.com 
> Vision2020" <vision2020 at moscow.com>
> *Sent:* Monday, July 22, 2013 3:36 PM
> *Subject:* Re: [Vision2020] Should he have stayed in his truck?
>
> Paul,
>
> What do you think 13- and 14-year-olds deserve? Of course, you ignore 
> climate science, so it doesn't surprise me that you ignored the 
> information I posted recently about brain development and age too. But 
> what do YOU think and for what reason? What is YOUR theory of moral 
> responsibility? When do people become eligible for guilt and 
> punishment? At what age and under what conditions are individuals to 
> be held fully accountable for their actions? And what is YOUR 
> justification for holding the view about moral responsibility that you 
> hold? Immaterial soul? Magic? Anything you damn well feel like believing?
>
> I'm not trying to be disrespectful. But I have an answer to these 
> questions. In fact, this is one of my primary research interests, so I 
> could talk about it all day. I'd like to hear what you have to say.
>
> Best, Joe
>
>
> On Mon, Jul 22, 2013 at 2:37 PM, Paul Rumelhart <godshatter at yahoo.com 
> <mailto:godshatter at yahoo.com>> wrote:
>
>     Do you think they deserve any less?
>
>     Paul
>
>
>     ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>     *From:* Moscow Cares <moscowcares at moscow.com
>     <mailto:moscowcares at moscow.com>>
>     *To:* Joe Campbell <philosopher.joe at gmail.com
>     <mailto:philosopher.joe at gmail.com>>
>     *Cc:* "vision2020 at moscow.com <mailto:vision2020 at moscow.com>
>     Vision2020" <vision2020 at moscow.com <mailto:vision2020 at moscow.com>>
>     *Sent:* Monday, July 22, 2013 2:35 PM
>     *Subject:* Re: [Vision2020] Should he have stayed in his truck?
>
>     And those 13- and 14-year-olds (in the beginning years of their
>     teens) who assaulted Mahaney, . . . two sentenced to probation . .
>     . three plead guilty to felonious assault . . . the sixth pending
>     trial; all six of whom may be facing homicide charges if an
>     autopsy reflects that the assault may have been contributory to
>     Mahaney's death.
>
>     Nope.  No waiver there.
>
>     Seeya 'round town, Moscow, because . . .
>
>     "Moscow Cares" (the most fun you can have with your pants on)
>     http://www.MoscowCares.com <http://www.moscowcares.com/>
>     Tom Hansen
>     Moscow, Idaho
>
>     "There's room at the top they are telling you still
>     But first you must learn how to smile as you kill
>     If you want to be like the folks on the hill."
>
>     - John Lennon
>
>
>     On Jul 22, 2013, at 2:11 PM, Joe Campbell
>     <philosopher.joe at gmail.com <mailto:philosopher.joe at gmail.com>> wrote:
>
>         Barely out of his teens? Again relevant for him but not Martin!?!
>
>         On Jul 22, 2013, at 1:54 PM, Wayne Price <bear at moscow.com
>         <mailto:bear at moscow.com>> wrote:
>
>             1st charge, "when he was  barely out of his teens" :   waived
>             2nd set of charges (Civil charge):  mutual restraining orders
>             3rd charge: dismissed
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>             On Jul 22, 2013, at 1:47 PM, Joe Campbell wrote:
>
>                 Here's some more information about Zimmerman. Domestic
>                 violence? Fighting with a police officer? How come no
>                 one called him a "thug"?
>
>                 http://usnews.nbcnews.com/_news/2012/03/27/10894561-zimmerman-accused-of-domestic-violence-fighting-with-a-police-officer?lite
>
>
>                 On Mon, Jul 22, 2013 at 12:04 PM, Wayne Price
>                 <bear at moscow.com <mailto:bear at moscow.com>> wrote:
>
>
>                       Zimmerman helps family in car wreck
>                       <http://www.cnn.com/2013/07/22/us/florida-zimmerman-vehicle/index.html?hpt=hp_t1>
>
>
>                     *  (CNN)* -- Four days after he was acquitted of
>                     murder, George Zimmerman stepped out of seclusion
>                     to help a family get out of an overturned    
>                     vehicle in Florida, authorities said Monday.
>                     Zimmerman and another man helped four people get
>                     out of an SUV that had overturned Wednesday
>                     evening in Sanford -- the same community where the
>                     former neighborhood watch volunteer fatally shot
>                     unarmed teenager Trayvon Martin in 2012 --
>                     Seminole County Sheriff's Office spokeswoman
>                     Heather Smith said.
>                     Authorities were called after the SUV went off the
>                     road and rolled over in the area of Interstate 4
>                     and State Road 46. By the time a deputy arrived,
>                     Zimmerman and another man already had helped the
>                     two adults and two children out of the vehicle,
>                     Smith said.
>                     Zimmerman did not witness the crash, and he left
>                     after making contact with the deputy, Smith said.
>                     No injuries were reported.
>                     Zimmerman has been out of the public eye since a
>                     jury found him not guilty of second degree murder
>                     on July 13. His parents told ABC News last week
>                     that their family has received an "enormous amount
>                     of death threats."
>                     He fatally shot Martin in the Sanford neighborhood
>                     where Zimmerman and Martin's father lived in
>                     February 2012. Zimmerman, a Hispanic man, had a
>                     confrontation with the African-American teen after
>                     calling police to report a suspicious person, and
>                     he said he shot Martin in self-defense.
>                     The case became a flashpoint in debates over
>                     racial profiling, and thousands attended vigils
>                     across the country over the weekend, decrying the
>                     verdict.
>
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