[Vision2020] Wayne Krauss

[Darrell Keim]

Joe:

It was a pleasure to meet you, too!  I regret I was too busy to chat.  I
imagine a real conversation would've been fun and stimulating.  I agree
with most of your comments below.  Specifically, the use of a monkey in the
analogy was poor.  To much emotional baggage attached.  A semi-humorous
comparison (Whats next legislating all cars must be comfortable for tall
people?) could've made the same point without the unnecessary linguistic
baggage.

On Wed, Feb 27, 2013 at 5:22 PM, Joe Campbell <philosopher.joe at gmail.com>wrote:

> Darrell,
>
> Nice finally meeting you the other day!
>
> I appreciate your attempt to clear the air, but you still haven't
> acknowledged that what Wayne said was offensive. It just was. I know Wayne
> and he's a great guy, in my opinion. I'm sure he MEANT to say something
> more like what you've said below. I've offended people before too. But when
> I have I've tried to apologize. Wayne should apologize -- especially since
> he's not going to get the vote from the radical right! He doesn't even
> endorse the 2nd Amendment, right? He needs the moderate vote.
>
> He should  apologize for making an insensitive remark. I would not want
> someone comparing, say, my sister to a monkey, and if I was trying to fight
> for the rights of my sister and someone made this analogy, I would be
> offended. Even if I was mistaken in my attempt to fight for my sister's
> rights, I wouldn't want to see her compared to a monkey.
>
> Best, Joe
>
> PS Notice how the conversation shifted from one about the offensive nature
> of the remark to some legal/philosophical issue. I'm a philosopher but in
> this case, that is not the issue. It is the offensive nature of the remark,
> its dismissive character, its failure to understand the difficult struggles
> that others endure.
>
> On Wed, Feb 27, 2013 at 11:04 AM, Darrell Keim <keim153 at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> I happened to sit next to Wayne yesterday when someone asked him to
>> explain his remarks.  He elaborated that his point was that we shouldn't
>> need to have special protections for different groups.  We should hold
>> ourselves to the standard of treating all people equally, which our
>> Constitution already guarantees.
>>
>> While his quote in the paper makes him sound like an idiot (reporters
>> have a way of doing this-context is SO important), I agree with the
>> sentiment he attempted to express.  Why can't we work with the simple rule
>> already expressed in our countries founding document: treat others with
>> basic dignity and decency.  The guy is not nearly the troglodyte he is
>> being made out to be.
>>
>> On Wed, Feb 27, 2013 at 10:49 AM, Art Deco <art.deco.studios at gmail.com>wrote:
>>
>>> Aside from its gross insensitivity and ignorance the remarks provide a
>>> revelation about Krauss's personal feelings and the lack of comment
>>> implying consent by the other semi-conscious officials present, this is
>>> part of a longer saga.
>>>
>>> There is hardly a month that has gone by since he took office and made a
>>> fool of himself starting with his participation and remarks in the Hawkins
>>> scandal, that Wayne Krauss hasn't provided ample evidence of the long
>>> circulating characterization of him that as the former manager of the
>>> Goodyear store he was hit in the head too hard and too many times with a
>>> tire iron.
>>>
>>> w.
>>>
>>>
>>> On Wed, Feb 27, 2013 at 1:31 PM, Saundra Lund <v2020 at ssl1.fastmail.fm>wrote:
>>>
>>>> What a horse’s rear end Krauss continues to show himself to be.
>>>> Disgusting.****
>>>>
>>>> ** **
>>>>
>>>> Here’s the article Roger Hayes referred to:****
>>>>
>>>> ** **
>>>> Antidiscrimination ordinance vetted by committee****
>>>>
>>>> *By Brandon Macz, Daily News staff writer | Posted: Tuesday, February
>>>> 26, 2013 12:00 am *****
>>>>
>>>> Considering an ordinance to make housing and job discrimination based
>>>> on sexual orientation or gender identity a criminal offense in Moscow,
>>>> Councilor Wayne Krauss asked City Attorney Randy Fife where demands for
>>>> more protections would end.****
>>>>
>>>> *Krauss asked rhetorically whether someone bringing monkeys into a
>>>> business and being refused service would require a discrimination ordinance
>>>> for monkey owners. *
>>>>
>>>> Fife laid out for the Administrative Committee on Monday details of his
>>>> draft ordinance. Under the ordinance, an employer would not be allowed to
>>>> refuse to hire or fire a person for their sexual orientation or gender
>>>> identity, or to deny an employee advancement or training on that same
>>>> basis. It would also prevent businesses from refusing to serve a person
>>>> based on their sexual orientation or gender identity.****
>>>>
>>>> On the housing side, refusal to sell, buy or rent property or to
>>>> repair, maintain or improve it would also be prohibited if it were the
>>>> result of such discrimination, Fife said.****
>>>>
>>>> Exceptions include religious entities, other governments and agencies,
>>>> boarding houses, private clubs or institutions and two-family dwellings,
>>>> such as duplexes, where the property owner or a relative lives in one of
>>>> the units.****
>>>>
>>>> Krauss was curious about whether businesses, such as restaurants, which
>>>> often display signs indicating their right to refuse service to anyone,
>>>> could refuse to serve someone based on their sexual orientation or gender
>>>> identity without disclosing that as the reason. Fife said if someone felt
>>>> that was the reason for denial of service, they could file a complaint
>>>> under the ordinance.****
>>>>
>>>> "I hate any kind of bullying whatsoever, and discrimination is a form
>>>> of bullying, in my mind," Krauss said.****
>>>>
>>>> Krauss said he didn't like the idea of the city being forced to react
>>>> to a continuous list of discriminatory grievances.****
>>>>
>>>> "The question is, where does it stop?" Krauss said. "Why doesn't the
>>>> 14th Amendment cover the whole darn thing?"****
>>>>
>>>> The amendment says "No State shall deny to any person within its
>>>> jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws."****
>>>>
>>>> Fife said he prepared the draft after reviewing laws already on the
>>>> books in Sandpoint, Boise and Salt Lake City and said he favored Boise's.
>>>> The proposed ordinance would fill a gap in the federal and state human
>>>> rights acts.****
>>>>
>>>> Anyone believing themselves to be discriminated against because of
>>>> their sexual orientation or gender identity would file a report with the
>>>> Moscow Police Department, Fife said, which would conduct an investigation
>>>> and file a report with the city prosecutor to validate whether the claim
>>>> constitutes an offense under the ordinance.****
>>>>
>>>> If so, mediation would be attempted between the two parties by the city
>>>> attorney with the offender facing a misdemeanor if a resolution can't be
>>>> met. If the defendant takes remediation steps, the penalty could be reduced
>>>> to an infraction. Should both parties settle, the charge would be dismissed.
>>>> ****
>>>>
>>>> "You want compliance, not punishment. That's the goal," Fife said,
>>>> adding the criminal process might do better in a separate council
>>>> resolution.****
>>>>
>>>> Fife said pushes on the municipal level could force the issue in the
>>>> Idaho Legislature, which has historically never passed an amendment to its
>>>> human rights act covering sexual orientation and gender identity out of
>>>> committee.****
>>>>
>>>> "That's not going to happen, so we'll continue to legislate morality,"
>>>> Krauss said.****
>>>>
>>>> The draft ordinance will be reviewed by the city's Fair and Affordable
>>>> Housing and Human Rights commissions before returning to the Administrative
>>>> Committee to forward the draft to the full council.****
>>>>
>>>> *More Well No. 9 problems*****
>>>>
>>>> Public Works Director Les MacDonald reported the recently reinstalled
>>>> Well No. 9 pump and motor have to be removed again after testing Friday
>>>> knocked out power to the well house. Once power was restored, a ground
>>>> fault was detected, which means something is short-circuiting the
>>>> electricity being channeled through the pump and motor, he said.****
>>>>
>>>> "It means we're in a different situation than before," MacDonald said.*
>>>> ***
>>>>
>>>> The pump was shut down in June when it stopped functioning and the
>>>> motor was sent to be repaired by Alstra Technologies in Tempe, Ariz. It was
>>>> reinstalled in late September, but was shut down again when the electric
>>>> current became too high and caused the protection unit to shut it down. The
>>>> motor was returned to Alstra and the pump was analyzed by a Spokane company
>>>> before both were tested by another manufacturer in Arizona.****
>>>>
>>>> The pump and motor were reinstalled in two weeks ago, but further
>>>> testing in Moscow showed the electric current was still too high and a
>>>> "whale song" noise occurred when it was reconnected to the system,
>>>> MacDonald said. Following Friday's outage, he said removal of the pump and
>>>> motor by crane began Monday and should be completed today. He added an
>>>> outside consultant may need to be brought in to determine the city's next
>>>> move. Well No. 9 can produce up to 40 percent of the city's water.****
>>>> ------------------------------
>>>>
>>>> *Brandon Macz* can be reached at (208) 882-5561, ext. 238, or by email
>>>> to bmacz at dnews.com.****
>>>>
>>>> ** **
>>>>
>>>> And, here’s the letter to the editor Roger also referred to:****
>>>>
>>>> ** **
>>>>
>>>> *Basic human rights*
>>>>
>>>> *Posted: Wednesday, February 27, 2013 12:00 am *****
>>>>
>>>> Moscow City Councilor Wayne Krauss has implied that refusing service to
>>>> monkey owners in a business setting is the same as denying fair housing and
>>>> job rights to residents based on their sexual orientation or gender
>>>> identity.****
>>>>
>>>> As reported by Brandon Macz in "Antidiscrimination ordinance vetted," (
>>>> *Daily News*, Feb. 26): "Krauss asked rhetorically whether someone
>>>> bringing monkeys into a business and being refused service would require a
>>>> discrimination ordinance for monkey owners."****
>>>>
>>>> You must be logged in with the proper services to print this article. *
>>>> ***
>>>>
>>>> Think about what he is really saying.****
>>>>
>>>> Also, according to Macz, Krauss questions "legislating morality." Yet
>>>> Krauss is forcing his own "morality" on public legislation, denying basic
>>>> human rights to a sector of the population that he is being paid to serve.
>>>> ****
>>>>
>>>> Please, Krauss, apologize for what you said and rethink your stance.***
>>>> *
>>>>
>>>> *Lisa Kliger*****
>>>>
>>>> Moscow****
>>>>
>>>> ** **
>>>>
>>>> ** **
>>>>
>>>> *From:* vision2020-bounces at moscow.com [mailto:
>>>> vision2020-bounces at moscow.com] *On Behalf Of *Rosemary Huskey
>>>>
>>>> *Sent:* Wednesday, February 27, 2013 8:50 AM
>>>> *To:* rhayes at frontier.com; 'Moscow Vision 2020'
>>>> *Subject:* Re: [Vision2020] Wayne Krauss****
>>>>
>>>> ** **
>>>>
>>>> I am gobsmacked about Wayne Krauss’ remarks.  Where did he make them?
>>>> Thank you for letting 2020 readers know.****
>>>>
>>>> Rose Huskey****
>>>>
>>>> ** **
>>>>
>>>> *From:* vision2020-bounces at moscow.com [
>>>> mailto:vision2020-bounces at moscow.com <vision2020-bounces at moscow.com>] *On
>>>> Behalf Of *rhayes at frontier.com
>>>> *Sent:* Wednesday, February 27, 2013 8:47 AM
>>>> *To:* vision2020 at moscow.com
>>>> *Subject:* [Vision2020] Wayne Krauss****
>>>>
>>>> ** **
>>>>
>>>> And yesterday Wayne Krauss was quoted that offering equal protection
>>>> to all citizens including that of sexual identity and orientation to
>>>> bringing monkeys to a restaurant and demanding service. ****
>>>>
>>>> In this case crackpot... and a sad reflection on our city council. ****
>>>>
>>>>  ****
>>>>
>>>> For those with short memories:
>>>>
>>>> On a scale of 0 to 10 where 10 is the easiest to be hornswoggled
>>>> Carscalen
>>>> and Krauss are clearly 10s based on how Hawkins and Mr. Slime Steed
>>>> (acting
>>>> in the conflicting roles of city council person and *defacto* agent of
>>>> his
>>>> longtime associates Hawkins) hornswoggled the council into the
>>>> sweetheart
>>>> deal with the now never to be Hawkins mall against the fundamental
>>>> interests of Idaho citizens.
>>>>
>>>> How do you choose a GOP leader? From the crackpots or the corrupt?
>>>>
>>>> w.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>  ****
>>>>
>>>>    ****
>>>>
>>>> =======================================================
>>>>  List services made available by First Step Internet,
>>>>  serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.
>>>>                http://www.fsr.net
>>>>           mailto:Vision2020 at moscow.com
>>>> =======================================================
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> Art Deco (Wayne A. Fox)
>>> art.deco.studios at gmail.com
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> =======================================================
>>>  List services made available by First Step Internet,
>>>  serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.
>>>                http://www.fsr.net
>>>           mailto:Vision2020 at moscow.com
>>> =======================================================
>>>
>>
>>
>> =======================================================
>>  List services made available by First Step Internet,
>>  serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.
>>                http://www.fsr.net
>>           mailto:Vision2020 at moscow.com
>> =======================================================
>>
>
>
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