[Vision2020] Hmmm . . .

Nicholas Gier ngier006 at gmail.com
Wed Feb 20 14:43:44 PST 2013 

Hi "G":

I read recently about a guy who did just what you advise and shot an
intruder.  It turned out that it was his uninvited brother.

Ooooops!

Nick

On Wed, Feb 20, 2013 at 2:33 PM, Gary Crabtree <moscowlocksmith at gmail.com>wrote:

> The problem does not seem at all insurmountable.
>
> Problem, person(s) force entry to ones home without invitation.
>
> Solution. Point weapon in general direction of intruder and request
> (insist) they leave.
>
> Outcome. They comply or they do not.
>
> Compliance equals positive resolution to problem.
>
> Noncompliance results in negative outcome for intruder.
>
> The real problem stems from not having the proper tools to affect the
> desired outcome.
>
> g
>
> On Wed, Feb 20, 2013 at 10:47 AM, Art Deco <art.deco.studios at gmail.com>wrote:
>
>> The problem of dealing with intruders involves sometimes a dangerous lack
>> of information.
>>
>> Is the intruder armed?
>>
>> Is there more than one?
>>
>> What are the intentions of of the intruder?
>>
>> Who is the intruder?  Is she/he someone known?  What is the relevant
>> history of the intruder?
>>
>> Are there effective/non-lethal ways of neutralizing the intruder?
>>
>> How can those intruded upon calculate the the risk to themselves, and
>> decide upon the action to be taken?
>>
>>
>> w.
>>
>>
>> On Wed, Feb 20, 2013 at 12:00 PM, Joe Campbell <philosopher.joe at gmail.com
>> > wrote:
>>
>>> These are empirically claims. Could be that pulling out a gun increases
>>> your risk. It depends on a lot of factors.
>>>
>>> The big question is: does the potential for help outweigh the risk of
>>> harm?
>>>
>>> And I hate to tell you that in a region with a low incidence of gun
>>> violence, the answer is 'No.' Paul's weapons are more likely to cause him
>>> harm than they are to protect him.
>>>
>>> On Feb 20, 2013, at 8:05 AM, Gary Crabtree <moscowlocksmith at gmail.com>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>> Once "he" becomes aware of said gun it becomes a powerful deterrent to
>>> staying in your house much less helping himself to your belongings or
>>> continued good health.
>>>
>>> g
>>>
>>>  On Wed, Feb 20, 2013 at 6:56 AM, Joe Campbell <
>>> philosopher.joe at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> This is what listening to pop music can do to you!
>>>>
>>>> Paul: If he's in your house, then the gun was not a deterrent.
>>>>
>>>> On Feb 20, 2013, at 6:12 AM, Sunil Ramalingam <
>>>> sunilramalingam at hotmail.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>  But not in a judgmental way. I'm too busy singing to put anybody down.
>>>>
>>>> sr
>>>>
>>>> ------------------------------
>>>> From: jampot at roadrunner.com
>>>> To: sunilramalingam at hotmail.com
>>>> CC: vision2020 at moscow.com
>>>> Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Hmmm . . .
>>>> Date: Wed, 20 Feb 2013 06:02:11 -0800
>>>>
>>>> Now you're just monkeeing around.
>>>>
>>>> g
>>>>
>>>>  *From:* Sunil Ramalingam <sunilramalingam at hotmail.com>
>>>> *Sent:* Tuesday, February 19, 2013 11:07 PM
>>>> *Cc:* vision 2020 <vision2020 at moscow.com>
>>>> *Subject:* Re: [Vision2020] Hmmm . . .
>>>>
>>>> The premise of your post was that he was breaking into homes when
>>>> people were there. Now you're inventing his motive to kill you. No, if he
>>>> saw your face, he'd be a believer, not a killer.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Sunil
>>>>
>>>>  ------------------------------
>>>> Date: Tue, 19 Feb 2013 22:56:57 -0800
>>>> From: godshatter at yahoo.com
>>>> To: sunilramalingam at hotmail.com
>>>> CC: vision2020 at moscow.com
>>>> Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Hmmm . . .
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> It didn't say he was.  If he did, though, I'd want to be able to
>>>> protect myself if he ran across me in a home he thought was empty and he
>>>> got it through his head that I had to die because I'd seen his face.  Or
>>>> maybe he's desperate, and now he's willing to try hitting a house that is
>>>> occupied but looks like he could rob it regardless.
>>>>
>>>> It's a tool of preparedness.  I'd rather not assume that he's harmless
>>>> if he's breaking into houses and robbing them.  If my assumption is wrong,
>>>> I could die.  I'd rather not throw away my chance at survival because
>>>> "OMG!  Guns are bad!"
>>>>
>>>> It doesn't mean, by the way, that I'd just shoot this guy for breaking
>>>> into my house.  But a loaded weapon is a good deterrent, and if it turns
>>>> out my life is at stake, I'd rather have a gun than a shoe I could throw at
>>>> him, or whatever I happened to have at hand.
>>>>
>>>> This isn't rocket science.  Be prepared.  It's the good old Boy Scout
>>>> motto.   I also have a smoke detector and a fire extinguisher.
>>>>
>>>> Don't let the "guns are killing our kids!" narrative drive your views.
>>>>
>>>> Paul
>>>>
>>>> On 02/19/2013 10:43 PM, Sunil Ramalingam wrote:
>>>>
>>>>  Paul,
>>>>
>>>> Where does it say he's breaking into homes when people are in? I had a
>>>> lot of burglary cases, and my mistakenly charged clients were usually
>>>> alleged to have entered homes when no one was there. Lots easier to leave
>>>> with stuff that way, said the authorities.
>>>>
>>>> Sunil
>>>>
>>>>  ------------------------------
>>>> Date: Tue, 19 Feb 2013 19:02:25 -0800
>>>> From: godshatter at yahoo.com
>>>> To: thansen at moscow.com
>>>> CC: vision2020 at moscow.com
>>>> Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Hmmm . . .
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> What's paranoid about locking up when you're out and being ready to
>>>> defend yourself when you're at home when there is a known burglar in the
>>>> area?  Being prepared is not the same thing as being paranoid.  If someone
>>>> is crazy enough to break into your home while you are there, you can go
>>>> ahead and classify that as a situation fraught with danger, in which case
>>>> having some means to protect yourself might be called for.  There are
>>>> plenty of reasonable scenarios where a would-be burglar happens upon a
>>>> member of the household when he thought the place was empty that could end
>>>> up very badly for the person he stumbled upon.  If the burglar knew you
>>>> were at home and invaded the home anyway, then you've definitely got a
>>>> problem if you are happily unarmed.
>>>>
>>>> Better to have that gun when you need it than not.  If guns frighten
>>>> you, which I find hard to believe because of your military background, then
>>>> at least pick up a good aluminum baseball bat.
>>>>
>>>> Do you think I'm paranoid because I keep a set of jumper cables in my
>>>> trunk in case my battery dies and I need a jump from a kind stranger?  Are
>>>> you one of those people that joyously flit from situation to situation
>>>> relying on the gods to keep you out of trouble?
>>>>
>>>> Paul
>>>>
>>>> On 02/19/2013 01:18 PM, Tom Hansen wrote:
>>>>
>>>> <ATT00001>
>>>>
>>>> Paranoia . . . self-destroya.
>>>>
>>>> Seeya round town, Moscow, because . . .
>>>>
>>>> "Moscow Cares"
>>>> http://www.MoscowCares.com
>>>>
>>>>  Tom "Proud to be a Filthy Liberal Scum" Hansen
>>>> Moscow, Idaho
>>>>
>>>> "There's room at the top they are telling you still
>>>> But first you must learn how to smile as you kill
>>>> If you want to be like the folks on the hill."
>>>>
>>>> - John Lennon
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
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>>>>
>>>>
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>>>>
>>>>
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>>>>  serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.
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>>>> =======================================================
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>>>>
>>>>
>>>> ------------------------------
>>>>
>>>> =======================================================
>>>>  List services made available by First Step Internet,
>>>>  serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.
>>>>                http://www.fsr.net
>>>>           mailto:Vision2020 at moscow.com <Vision2020 at moscow.com>
>>>> =======================================================
>>>>
>>>> =======================================================
>>>> List services made available by First Step Internet,
>>>> serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.
>>>>                http://www.fsr.net
>>>>          mailto:Vision2020 at moscow.com <Vision2020 at moscow.com>
>>>> =======================================================
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> =======================================================
>>>>  List services made available by First Step Internet,
>>>>  serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.
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>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> =======================================================
>>>  List services made available by First Step Internet,
>>>  serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.
>>>                http://www.fsr.net
>>>           mailto:Vision2020 at moscow.com
>>> =======================================================
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Art Deco (Wayne A. Fox)
>> art.deco.studios at gmail.com
>>
>>
>>
>> =======================================================
>>  List services made available by First Step Internet,
>>  serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.
>>                http://www.fsr.net
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>> =======================================================
>>
>
>
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>  serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.
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