[Vision2020] Vandal sports
Wayne Price
bear at moscow.com
Thu May 3 13:59:57 PDT 2012
Yes, but what about:
With South Alabama, Charlotte and Georgia State looking to join the
ranks soon, here is a list of the ten largest Div. I schools not
playing football:
1. Cal State-Fullerton (37,130 students, former I-A school)
2. Cal State-Long Beach (36,870, former I-A school)
3. Virginia Commonwealth (31,907)
4. George Mason (29,889, has a club team)
5. IUPU-Indianapolis (29,765)
6. Wisconsin-Milwaukee (29,205, has a club team)
7. Boston University (27,427, former I-AA school)
8. Cal-Irvine (25,220)
9. Texas-Arlington (24,825, former I-AA school)
10. George Washington (24,531, former I-A school)
AND Duke and UTSA!
On May 3, 2012, at 10:55 AM, Love America wrote:
> Donovan,
> One of the misperceptions you have about student athletes is that
> they somehow or another are inferior to non-athletes. This might be
> true at BSU (I had to take that shot), but if you look at overall
> GPA's and graduation rates, those on athletic scholarships at Idaho
> outperform the overall student body by a substantial margin. Once
> those on athletic scholarships graduate they tend to land better
> jobs and be better donors back to the UI. Football is by far the
> biggest generator of revenue for the UI and, as it has been often
> quoted, it is impossible to convince 13,000 people (UI) or 116,000
> people (Michigan) on a Saturday to spend 4 hours of their lives
> watching a academic debate/event of any kind. I personally have
> flown from Fairbanks to Moscow to watch 4 football games while my
> son (marching band) has been at the U of I. My son attends the UI
> because of the Lionel Hampton School of Music. Marching band, pep
> band other musical opportunities that exist there in large part
> because of football; without football marching band would not exist
> (and in my personal case I would bleed out a lot less money because
> he would probably attend school here in Alaska). As for your
> argument that shrinking, or even eliminating athletics would lead to
> greater enrollment of minorities, I would firmly state that you are
> wrong. We all like to paint the UI as the Northwest's version of
> Harvard, but let’s get real for a moment and admit that the UI only
> still exists because of it land-grant status, and now large alumni
> base that fights for our college, the Boise controlled legislature
> would have long ago moved the campus to Boise; Albion State Normal
> School is proof that without sports, a large alumni base, and land
> grant status colleges die in Idaho.
>
> On Thu, May 3, 2012 at 6:53 AM, Donovan Arnold <donovanjarnold2005 at yahoo.com
> > wrote:
> I don't think it does, Sunil. I just think football is the biggest
> generator of revenue. UI administrators might also point to
> donations and sales of UI products as revenues from football.
> Athletic scholarships help as well, but even a full scholarship
> covers only 20% of a student's tab, as the State of Idaho and
> federal government the 80%.
>
> Donovan Arnold
>
> From: Sunil Ramalingam <sunilramalingam at hotmail.com>
> To: vision 2020 <vision2020 at moscow.com>
> Sent: Thursday, May 3, 2012 8:12 AM
>
> Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Vandal sports
>
> Does UI football really generate revenue? Does revenue exceed the
> money the school/state puts into it?
>
> Sunil
>
> From: areaman at moscow.com
> To: vision2020 at moscow.com
> Date: Thu, 3 May 2012 05:58:37 -0700
> Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Vandal sports
>
> Donovan,
>
> You may have missed it in Chris’ first sentence:
>
> “football revenue”
>
> DC
>
> From: vision2020-bounces at moscow.com [mailto:vision2020-bounces at moscow.com
> ] On Behalf Of Donovan Arnold
> Sent: Thursday, May 03, 2012 2:36 AM
> To: Love America
> Cc: vision2020 at moscow.com
> Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Vandal sports
>
> Chris,
>
> I am not sure why diversity and opportunities would suffer at UI by
> returning to the Big Sky, nor did your response state why. I am 100%
> for Title IX, always have been.
>
> My understanding, however, whenever I looked into the situation
> while at UI, was that UI athletics always cost the UI more in
> revenues than it ever brought in and football only helped to offset
> those huge expenses. If this is so, I would surmise the shrinking of
> UI athletics would reduce costs to the UI overall and allow more
> minority students an opportunity to attend UI than athletics.
> Further, it would be minority students attending college for their
> academic achievements and talents rather than their ability to
> throw, catch, hit, or kick a ball. Many of those students would then
> be more likely to go on as graduate students which generate
> additional revenues for the UI assisting professors with their
> research.
>
> So I see reducing athletics and returning to Big Sky as an
> opportunity to win and reduce costs, while at the same time
> promoting diversity and academic opportunities.
>
> Donovan J. Arnold
>
> From: Love America <skialaska0 at gmail.com>
> To: donovanjarnold2005 at yahoo.com
> Cc: vision2020 at moscow.com
> Sent: Wednesday, May 2, 2012 7:51 PM
> Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Vandal sports
>
> Donovan,
> If Idaho were to go back to the Big Sky, UI would have to cut
> women's programs plain and simple. Whether you like it or not,
> football revenue and Title IX compliance are why women's programs
> are doing so well at UI. I suspect soccer would go first, followed
> by women's golf. Men's and women's swimming would be cut next and
> probably some track scholarships are lost. Heck, I wish the
> Vandals have had better success at WAC football, but at least the
> pain on the gridiron (with a couple of great years in the midst) has
> allowed hundreds of athletes to attend the UI who would not have had
> a chance if the UI was still in the Big Sky. Those scholarships
> have helped with diversity, have added to the richness of the
> university, and have introduced 100's of fine people to Moscow that
> would have not been there. I love winning like anyone else, but I
> know that in the end having these opportunities for these fine
> students outweigh the win/loss record of any football team.
> Thanks
> Chris
> On Wed, May 2, 2012 at 1:15 PM, Donovan Arnold <donovanjarnold2005 at yahoo.com
> > wrote:
> Leaving the Big Sky was a big mistake, and we need to put money into
> women's programs. Lady Vandals KICK ASS! Have always been a league
> above the rest. They were 3rd in the nation in Rodeo when I was
> there. Not many know that.
>
> Donovan J. Arnold
>
> From: Tom Hansen <thansen at moscow.com>
> To: Carl Westberg <idahovandal1 at live.com>
> Cc: "<vision2020 at moscow.com>" <vision2020 at moscow.com>
> Sent: Wednesday, May 2, 2012 12:35 PM
>
> Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Vandal sports
>
> As much of a die-hard Vandal as I am and as much of what remaining
> in Division 1A may mean to the UI Athletic Program, the boys of Bozo
> State, coupled with the loss of UI's "Flagship" moniker, have taught
> me one valuable lesson . . .
>
> It simply is NOT that important!
>
> Boise State is a prime example of what can happen if your priorities
> are messed up. Boise State has been a four-year college since the
> 60s. Although their football program has become a national Division
> 1A contender, their academic program remains at tier 3 along with a
> majority of northwest community colleges . . . not one PhD program
> and very few masters programs, while the University of Idaho has
> evolved into a nationally competitive tier 1 source of higher
> education and possesses a wide variety of many graduate programs.
>
> Seeya round town, Moscow.
>
> Tom Hansen
> Moscow, Idaho
> (UI '96, Information Systems)
>
> "If not us, who?
> If not now, when?"
>
> - Unknown
>
>
>
> On May 2, 2012, at 11:08, Carl Westberg <idahovandal1 at live.com> wrote:
>
> > I've brought this subject up before, but recent conference
> shuffling events really seem to have put U of Idaho athletics in a
> very hard place. No Division 1 conference seems to want the
> Vandals. I just saw a Facebook poll asking which of three options
> respondents would prefer given the circumstances. 1. Try playing
> as a D-1 independent, which would probably mean about three home
> games a year while hoping for an eventual conference invitation.
> 2. Play, again, in the Sun Belt (teams in Louisiana, Tennessee...)
> to stay D-1. If the Sun Belt wanted Idaho. 3. Swallow pride and
> return to 1-AA and the Big Sky. So far in the Facebook poll, the
> Big Sky leads comfortably. Any thoughts? Or is it even a concern
> outside of the hard core fans?
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