[Vision2020] Handgun Clinic

Paul Rumelhart godshatter at yahoo.com
Sun Jun 24 14:38:23 PDT 2012 

I'd say the difference between safety and self defense is the difference 
between protecting yourself or others from your own actions and 
protecting yourself or others from other's actions.

You make it sound like they are teaching people to hunt intruders in 
their own home for fun and profit.  Think of the intruders!

Idaho doesn't have a stand-your-ground law, but you can protect yourself 
from someone breaking into your house and trying to commit a felony 
(justifiable homicide defense number 2): 
http://legislature.idaho.gov/idstat/Title18/T18CH40SECT18-4009.htm

Perhaps they need a class for would-be intruders that lets them know 
that it is sometimes hard to ascertain their intent when the home-owner 
awakens from a deep sleep to hear their window downstairs being broken 
and the sounds of footsteps, and that if they plan to hide packages 
under their tree or exchange coins for teeth that they might want to 
announce their intentions first. Perhaps even knock on their door 
instead of just breaking in. Some people are for some reason jumpy about 
strangers that have broken in to their own homes and might take their 
unannounced visit as a threat to themselves or their family.  Seems like 
common sense, but that seems to be in short supply these days.

On the other side of it, a course for self-defense sounds like a good 
idea.  They might even go into when you can or can't protect yourself 
and when you can assume that you are in danger and how you go about 
ascertaining that fact.  That might prove to be useful as well.  Does 
anyone know if this handgun clinic covered this material?

Paul

On 06/24/2012 01:27 PM, Tom Hansen wrote:
> OK.  I agree with Joe in that safety is the NUMBER ONE concern when it 
> comes to the use of weapons.
>
> As such, I fully support classes on weapons safety in/around Moscow . 
> . . not self-defense.  The most prevalent difference between safety 
> and self-defense is . . .
>
> The purpose of safety is to avoid/prevent injury either to yourself or 
> somebody else.
>
> The purpose of armed self-defense is to inflict injury upon a 
> perceived intruder.
>
> What's next?  Adoption of Florida's "Stand Your Ground" law?  I hope not!
>
> Seeya round town, Moscow.
>
> Tom Hansen
> Moscow, Idaho
>
> "If not us, who?
> If not now, when?"
>
> - Unknown
>
>
>
> On Jun 24, 2012, at 13:13, Joe Campbell <philosopher.joe at gmail.com 
> <mailto:philosopher.joe at gmail.com>> wrote:
>
>> Bad analogy. Cars like guns are dangerous. Should we teach people to 
>> drive safely? Yes. Regardless of one's views about the morality or 
>> immorality of driving. IF you're going to drive, know what you're 
>> doing and do it safely. Hard to debate that.
>>
>>
>>
>> On Jun 24, 2012, at 3:58 PM, Donovan Arnold 
>> <donovanjarnold2005 at yahoo.com <mailto:donovanjarnold2005 at yahoo.com>> 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> I think we should also teach people how to drive safely while 
>>> intoxicated. That way drunk drivers won't be so dangerous.
>>> Donovan J. Arnold
>>>
>>> *From:* Joe Campbell <philosopher.joe at gmail.com 
>>> <mailto:philosopher.joe at gmail.com>>
>>> *To:* Janesta <janesta at gmail.com <mailto:janesta at gmail.com>>
>>> *Cc:* Moscow Vision 2020 <vision2020 at moscow.com 
>>> <mailto:vision2020 at moscow.com>>
>>> *Sent:* Sunday, June 24, 2012 10:29 AM
>>> *Subject:* Re: [Vision2020] Handgun Clinic
>>>
>>> Thanks Janesta.
>>>
>>> I don't own a gun nor do I plan to either. But I've been taking gun 
>>> safety and shooting lessons with my son for a few months now. My son 
>>> overnighted as at a friend's house and ended up shooting guns with 
>>> my approval. So I thought it would be good if he knew what he was 
>>> doing and a friend offered to help.
>>>
>>> Actually I enjoy the sport of shooting now and not just because it 
>>> gives something for my son and I to do together. I doubt I'll ever 
>>> get a gun since statistics clearly indicate that you are far more 
>>> likely to be harmed by a gun than to be helped.
>>>
>>> But I agree with Janesta that if folks are going to have guns better 
>>> that they know how to use them. Nothing wrong with gun safety lessons.
>>>
>>> On the other hand, I agree with Tom and others that carrying guns 
>>> for safety reasons and the general paranoia associated with events 
>>> like this are a bit disturbing. Moscow is one of the safest 
>>> communities in the country.
>>>
>>> Joe
>>>
>>>
>>> On Jun 24, 2012, at 11:55 AM, Janesta <janesta at gmail.com 
>>> <mailto:janesta at gmail.com>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Vera stated in her column, Larry wanted to remind members of a 
>>>> handgun clinic. A "reminder" tells me this is not the original 
>>>> information, which I assume was given at an earlier date
>>>> Had The Inkster done her homework... say google Larry Cernik's 
>>>> name, her article would have been informative. Curious, I googled.
>>>> As Paul Harvey coined.. here is "The Rest of the Story"
>>>> *laughing*
>>>> Perhaps, not 100% the rest of the story, but, you all get my drift.
>>>> Larry Cernik is the Idaho state coordinator for Project Appleseed, 
>>>> a nationwide shooting and history program administered by the 
>>>> Revolutionary War Veterans Association.
>>>> Instructor link-
>>>> http://www.appleseedinfo.org/instructors_compare.html
>>>> Pricing link- $50.00 for a day session
>>>> http://www.appleseedinfo.org/pricing.html
>>>> Women in Appleseed-
>>>> http://www.appleseedinfo.org/ladyseed.php
>>>> http://www.appleseedinfo.org/women.html
>>>> It appears to me, more people are buying handguns for protection. 
>>>> Gun owners need to be educated on how to keep a gun safe in the 
>>>> home, and the use of a gun under emotional pressure, among other 
>>>> important issues. When having conversations with police officers in 
>>>> the past. Every one of them told me, if my life were at /*immediate 
>>>> risk*/, I should shoot to kill.  A shot in the arm or leg, will not 
>>>> stop a meth head (or the like) from continuing their quest to kill 
>>>> you. A wounded animal is a crazed animal.
>>>> Fish and Game offer gun safety classes, as do The Pink Pistols...
>>>> http://www.joehuffman.org/PalousePinkPistols.htm
>>>> Guns are not going away in the near future, I'd rather gun owners 
>>>> were educated, than not.
>>>> No, I don't own a gun, nor do I plan on purchasing one.
>>>> Janesta
>>>>
>>>> On Sun, Jun 24, 2012 at 7:35 AM, Tom Hansen <thansen at moscow.com 
>>>> <mailto:thansen at moscow.com>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>     "'This course is designed to bring you up to speed with the
>>>>     basic principles of employing a handgun in self-defense,'
>>>>     Cernik wrote."
>>>>
>>>>     Get EFFING real!  Armed self-defense in Moscow, Idaho???
>>>>
>>>>     Has paranoia toward our neighbors developed such a stranglehold
>>>>     here in Moscow that afternoon family conversation has
>>>>     degenerated to . . .
>>>>
>>>>     "Honey, I'm going to the mailbox to get the mail.  Cover me!"
>>>>
>>>>     Or is it that Doug Wilson and Christ Church have found
>>>>     themselves so deep in the fiscal red zone that a money-making
>>>>     bonanza such as a series of self-run, multiple-level,
>>>>     uncertified self-defense gun clinics was the easiest way out
>>>>     ("Participants had to register in advance for the Level 1 Basic
>>>>     Handgun Clinic, which cost $50 per person.").
>>>>
>>>>     I'm guessin' that the first couple hours of the Level 1
>>>>     "clinic" will consist of the boyz gatherin' 'round the beer
>>>>     cooler comparin' guns, seeking the answer to that age-old
>>>>     question, "Who has the biggest one?", much like the Trinity
>>>>     Fest and its self-indulgent truck rally that can only be best
>>>>     summed up in song . . .
>>>>
>>>>     http://www.TomandRodna.com/Songs/Hummer.mp3
>>>>     Seeya round town, Moscow.
>>>>
>>>>     Tom Hansen
>>>>     Moscow, Idaho
>>>>
>>>>     "If not us, who?
>>>>     If not now, when?"
>>>>
>>>>     - Unknown
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>     On Jun 23, 2012, at 8:28, Tom Hansen <thansen at moscow.com
>>>>     <mailto:thansen at moscow.com>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>     "This course is designed to bring you up to speed with the
>>>>>     basic principles of employing a handgun in self-defense,"
>>>>>     Cernik wrote
>>>>
>>>>     =======================================================
>>>>      List services made available by First Step Internet,
>>>>      serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.
>>>>     http://www.fsr.net/
>>>>              mailto:Vision2020 at moscow.com
>>>>     <mailto:Vision2020 at moscow.com>
>>>>     =======================================================
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> =======================================================
>>>> List services made available by First Step Internet,
>>>> serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.
>>>> http://www.fsr.net/
>>>> mailto:Vision2020 at moscow.com
>>>> =======================================================
>>>
>>> =======================================================
>>> List services made available by First Step Internet,
>>> serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.
>>> http://www.fsr.net/
>>>           mailto:Vision2020 at moscow.com <mailto:Vision2020 at moscow.com>
>>> =======================================================
>>>
>> =======================================================
>> List services made available by First Step Internet,
>> serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.
>> http://www.fsr.net
>> mailto:Vision2020 at moscow.com
>> =======================================================
>
>
> =======================================================
>   List services made available by First Step Internet,
>   serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.
>                 http://www.fsr.net
>            mailto:Vision2020 at moscow.com
> =======================================================


-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://mailman.fsr.com/pipermail/vision2020/attachments/20120624/884b37aa/attachment-0001.html>

More information about the Vision2020 mailing list