[Vision2020] No Need to Worry about Sweden, Roger
lfalen
lfalen at turbonet.com
Tue Mar 29 10:21:49 PDT 2011
Nick
It is a waste of time to try and argue with you. If you want economic facts read Walter Williams and Thomas Sowell. They can make the case much better than I can. Incidently there was a good interview with David Stockman in the April issue of Reason. He was quite critical of the spending under all of the last 8 presidents, including Reagan. With the federal debt headed into the stratosphere, we are headed to an economic collapse.
Roger
-----Original message-----
From: nickgier at roadrunner.com
Date: Mon, 28 Mar 2011 17:33:11 -0700
To: lfalen lfalen at turbonet.com
Subject: Re: No Need to Worry about Sweden, Roger
> Hi Roger,
>
> When you say we will agree to disagree, you usually mean that you simply don't have any economic facts or arguments.
>
> The societies that will survive well are ones that have a well regulated market economy (recent deregulation just about destroyed the world economy) and sufficient taxation that balances budgets, finances universal health coverage and education, and social services that provide for the disadvantaged. The U.S. does not do this, but most European welfare states do.
>
> Here is a preview of this week's column with the title "The Truth about Death and Taxes":
>
> For the past five years conservatives have governed Sweden, but the top income tax rate still remains at 60 percent. In 2009 taxes took 46.4 percent of the Swedish GDP. Free marketeers would declare such a country an economic basket case. But, according to the World Economic Forum rankings for 2010-11, Sweden is topped only by Switzerland for economic competitiveness while the U.S. stands in fourth place. High tax countries Germany (39.3 % of GDP), Finland (43.1%), the Netherlands (39.1%), and Denmark (48.2%) stand in 5th, 7th, 8th, and 9th place. The Economist reports that Finland is the most innovative country in the world and Denmark is the most business friendly.
>
> Riding high at 7.3 percent, Sweden currently has the largest increase in GDP growth in Europe and the second lowest budget deficit of a miniscule .8 percent. (Another significant figure is that 81 percent of the Swedish workforce is unionized.) Comparable U.S. figures are 2.8 percent growth and a 8.8 percent budget deficit. Contrary to common perceptions, the average budget deficit for the 16 countries on the Euro is only 4.5 percent. This includes high budget deficits in Greece and Ireland.
>
> Significantly enough, the countries that are in financial trouble are those with lower taxes per GDP and higher budget deficits (except for Spain and Iceland): the U.S. (24%; 8.8%), Ireland (29.3%; 13%), Spain (30.7%; 6.6%), Greece (32.6%; 8.1%), Portugal (36.7%; 8+%), and Iceland (36.7%; 6%). (These are 2009 and 2010 figures.) One obvious lesson to learn: sufficient tax revenue reduces deficits (duh!).
>
> Like other Europeans the Swedes appear to be satisfied with what their high taxes give them: universal medical care at half the cost of the U.S., unemployment benefits for 200 days at 80 percent of earnings, and the longest paid maternity/paternity leaves in the world. The Swedes have also welcomed over 70,000 Iraqis, who have been fed, clothed, housed, schooled, job trained, and taught Swedish. As a portion of population that would mean that equally compassionate Americans should have taken 1.6 million refugees from the war that George Bush started.
>
> Your for the Third Way,
>
> Nick
>
>
> ---- lfalen <lfalen at turbonet.com> wrote:
> > Nick
> > Will will have to agree to disagree. The only system that will survive is on that relies on a great deal of free market economics and controls its debt. I believe in taking care of those that can not take care of themselves, but is is morally wrong to steal from those who have worked hard and give it the able bodied who will not work.
> > Roger
> > -----Original message-----
> > From: nickgier at roadrunner.com
> > Date: Sat, 26 Mar 2011 09:04:22 -0700
> > To: Joe Campbell philosopher.joe at gmail.com, lfalen lfalen at turbonet.com
> > Subject: No Need to Worry about Sweden, Roger
> >
> > > Hi Roger,
> > >
> > > There is no need to be worried that Sweden will go the way of Ireland or Greece, which were run into the ground by center-right governments. The Greek conservative government hired Goldman Sachs to cleverly hide its debt. The Icelandic economy also collapsed under the leadership of politicians allied internationally with the GOP.
> > >
> > > Sweden is not getting the GOP message, because it is still a leading example of the Third Way between unfettered capitalism and Communism. Yes, some services will be trimmed in any tight budgets, but the Swedish government still takes up more than 50 percent of GDP and high progressive income taxes are still in place. But it is still the fastest growing economy in Europe, it still gives the longest paid maternity or paternity leaves in the world, and still provides health care to all of its citizens at half the cost of the U.S. And one more thing: it has allowed 70,000 Iraqis and many other refugees to settle and be supported by the state in every possible way.
> > >
> > > Long live the Third Way (because it is the only way that will eventually survive),
> > >
> > > Nick---- lfalen <lfalen at turbonet.com> wrote:
> > > > I have not been on the computer all week, but I think that Glenn answered your question.
> > > > In response ro Nick- I do not know it Nader is right or not.I have only listened to NPR occasionally. What I have caught is Fresh Air or All Things Considered. They both at the times I heard them seemed to be lightly left of center. Nader only mentioned Charlie Rose. I am sure there a lot of other hosts besides Rose. I have never heard him. In any event this is all irrelevant. It would not make any difference if they were equally balanced or were 100% to the right. They should not be geting any funding from the taxpayers. In case you don't realize it we are in a money crunch. Let spend only on those thing that are essential and can not be done adequately by the private sector. I want to see our veterans taken care of for just one of many that we should be spending on. Your ideal Nation of Sweden is geting the message and cutting back on services before they wind up like Greece and Ireland. I hope they succeed, that is the ancestral home of the Falen's. They come from!
Ostergo!
> > > > tlund.
> > > > You may know where that is.
> > > > Roger
> > > > -----Original message-----
> > > > From: Joe Campbell philosopher.joe at gmail.com
> > > > Date: Mon, 21 Mar 2011 11:27:38 -0700
> > > > To: lfalen lfalen at turbonet.com
> > > > Subject: Re: [Vision2020] No government support for NPR et al?
> > > >
> > > > > State one left wing point of view that NPR broadcasts, Roger. Just one.
> > > > >
> > > > > They broadcast news. You are so used to listening to the lies on Fox that
> > > > > you confuse them for "points of view."
> > > > >
> > > > > On Mon, Mar 21, 2011 at 10:17 AM, lfalen <lfalen at turbonet.com> wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > > If NPR wants to broadcast left wing points of view and supporters are
> > > > > > willing to fund it, more power to them.
> > > > > > Roger
> > > > > > -----Original message-----
> > > > > > From: "Robert Dickow" dickow at turbonet.com
> > > > > > Date: Sat, 19 Mar 2011 02:18:10 -0700
> > > > > > To: vision2020 at moscow.com
> > > > > > Subject: [Vision2020] No government support for NPR et al?
> > > > > >
> > > > > > > I hear that the conservative congressmen have proposed withdrawing
> > > > > > > government funding for NPR. Apparently a newscaster or fund drive person
> > > > > > or
> > > > > > > somebody made some disparaging remarks about the Tea Party. Fie! Fie!
> > > > > > Now,
> > > > > > > denying public broadcasting all those scarce taxpayer dollars sounds like
> > > > > > a
> > > > > > > reasonable and just response to such offenses if you're a conservative
> > > > > > > Republican sympathetic with the Tea Party movement, right? Uh huh.sure.
> > > > > > How
> > > > > > > dumb can anybody be?! NPR won't suddenly go belly up and go off the air,
> > > > > > > slinking off into the shadows with its tail between its legs. Private
> > > > > > > donors-- those dwindling middle class stalwarts-- will valiantly step up
> > > > > > to
> > > > > > > the plate in ever greater numbers. So what will actually happen, then, is
> > > > > > > that NPR will be unfettered and free to unleash all their rabid commie
> > > > > > pinko
> > > > > > > liberal gun-hating womens libber staffers to say all the rabid commie
> > > > > > pinko
> > > > > > > tea-barfing they've always wanted to say but didn't because they felt
> > > > > > > compelled to be balanced in their commie pinko tree-hugging opinions and
> > > > > > > bleeding-heart liberal union thug biased news reporting. Clearly, this
> > > > > > > government measure will not serve the common good. And I may be forced to
> > > > > > > mix even more metaphors in the future.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Bob Dickow, troublemaker
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > =======================================================
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> > > > > > =======================================================
> > > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > > =======================================================
> > > > List services made available by First Step Internet,
> > > > serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.
> > > > http://www.fsr.net
> > > > mailto:Vision2020 at moscow.com
> > > > =======================================================
> > >
>
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