[Vision2020] Tell Us, Mr. Borden . . .

[Paul Rumelhart]

I think Jay's attempt to put this in context is worthwhile.  The police 
did go out of their way, leading up to the pepper spraying incident, to 
get the student's to peacefully disperse.  They made it clear that force 
was to be used.  This is much different than the normal 30-second clip 
that makes it look it like they simply pepper-sprayed them just for the 
sheer joy of it.  If the students hadn't been surrounding the police in 
a lame attempt to keep them contained in order to force them to let the 
others go, the police wouldn't have done what they did.  For instance, 
if they had lined up in two rows along the edge of the sidewalk, then I 
don't think that anything would have happened.  There are consequences 
for trying to stop a police officer from making an arrest in the line of 
duty.

Having said that, though, I think the police officers went too far.  It 
was clear by how easy the police officer stepped over the line of 
protesters that they were never in any real danger of being contained.  
They could have left at any time.  They could also have moved the 
protesters bodily out of the way like they ended up doing to many of 
them, anyway, especially after reinforcements arrived to help.  It was 
possible for them to have taken the students they had arrested earlier 
on to the station in a way that didn't involve assault with a chemical 
weapon.  The protesters did most things right.  They didn't resist 
arrest, they didn't throw anything, they didn't try to push the police 
around.  They were being pretty stupid when they decided to surround the 
police, though.  I'd qualify that as a threatening action.  They thought 
they had found a way to keep their buddies from being arrested.  
However, if you are going to go the civil disobedience route, you should 
expect to get arrested.  That's how it works.

Like most things in life, this was more complex than it looks on the 
surface.  It wasn't a bunch of innocent protesters sitting idly around 
getting pepper sprayed for no reason, nor was pepper spraying the 
protesters the only sane alternative. There were plenty of actions both 
sides could have taken to have avoided this confrontation.

Paul

On 12/07/2011 03:32 PM, Tom Hansen wrote:
> Here's one (15 minutes) you missed, Mr. Borden.  I am sure that you 
> simply overlooked it, right?
>
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K8Uj1cV97XQ
>
> "When Occupy Davis protesters began to be arrested, students banded 
> together, chanting the police to release the captives and for more 
> students to come support. Later on, the protesters sat down in linked 
> arms, entrapping the police along with the captive. After trying to 
> negotiate, rather than stepping over the students, the police pepper 
> sprayed the students point blank in the face. Many sources reports 
> that there are around 10 protesters, that is not true. The police only 
> chose to spray these front individuals sitting near the roads. There 
> were countless more peaceful protesters surrounding them on all sides! 
> So there were not only 10! This video was shot right before, during, 
> and after the pepper spraying and forceful removal of the protesters. 
> I stood in disbelief as I watched the violence. Skip to 4:05 to where 
> the police talks to the student one more time before bringing out the 
> canister of pepper spray."
>
> ----------------------
>
> We should be happy the protestors were not carrying guns, a common 
> activity at Tea Party gatherings, huh?
>
> Seeya round town, Moscow.
>
> Tom Hansen
> Moscow, Idaho
>
> "If not us, who?
> If not now, when?"
>
> - Unknown
>
> On Dec 7, 2011, at 2:59 PM, Moscow Cares <moscowcares at moscow.com 
> <mailto:moscowcares at moscow.com>> wrote:
>
>> Jay Borden stated . . .
>>
>> "I, however, am simply presenting the viewpoint that (right or wrong on
>> the part of the officers), there is MORE TO THE STORY than just that
>> initial 30-second viral video."
>>
>> And just what is the "MORE TO THE STORY" that justifies pepper 
>> spraying students . . . sitting cross-legged on the ground . . . 
>> covering their faces?
>>
>> Seeya round town, Moscow.
>>
>> Tom Hansen
>> Moscow, Idaho
>>
>> "If not us, who?
>> If not now, when?"
>>
>> - Unknown
>>
>>
>
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