[Vision2020] Teabaggers
Joe Campbell
philosopher.joe at gmail.com
Sat Mar 13 09:03:19 PST 2010
Dale: I'll just let folks read this and decide for themselves who is
pro-slavery. Lies and distortions are never good in public discourse.
Joe
On Mar 13, 2010, at 10:13 AM, Donovan Arnold <donovanjarnold2008 at yahoo.com
> wrote:
> Professor Campbell,
>
> Your Statements are as pro-slavery as any other I have heard from
> Wilson or anyone else on the V. Slavery as an institution was and
> always will be wrong.
>
> And now you are adding qualifiers to your previous statement that it
> is always wrong to own a slave.
>
> Sounds rather hypocritical to me that you can add qualifications but
> anyone else who does is pro-slavery.
>
> Your modified statement, "it is ALWAYS wrong to buy and KEEP
> slaves?", Is based on your ignorance, Professor Campbell, because
> most states that had legal slavery also made it illegal to buy and
> free them in the same state and most people could not afford to buy
> a family of slaves and set them free without them working some of
> that $200,000 (in today's dollars) off.
>
> So now you can add the qualifier "It is wrong to buy slaves and keep
> them if the law doesn't allow it."
>
> How about if the slave cannot support themselves if you release
> them? Would you add a qualifier for that one, too, Prof. Campbell?
>
> How about if the person is blind, sick, or a minor? Would you add a
> qualifier for people to keep them in the status of slave?
>
> If you are going to judge people in the 1600s-1800s as less than
> yourself, you should at least know all the circumstances they were
> in and the options that individuals had and didn't have at the time.
>
> Your Friend,
>
> Donovan Arnold
>
>
>
>
> --- On Fri, 3/12/10, Joe Campbell <philosopher.joe at gmail.com> wrote:
>
> From: Joe Campbell <philosopher.joe at gmail.com>
> Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Teabaggers
> To: "Donovan Arnold" <donovanjarnold2008 at yahoo.com>
> Cc: "Moscow Vision 2020" <vision2020 at moscow.com>
> Date: Friday, March 12, 2010, 5:24 PM
>
> What is pro-slavery about saying it is ALWAYS wrong to buy and KEEP
> slaves? You need to get away from the Wilson crap rhetoric. You are
> starting to believe your own lies! Joe
>
>
>
> On Mar 12, 2010, at 11:08 AM, Donovan Arnold <donovanjarnold2008 at yahoo.com
> > wrote:
>
>> Dr. Joe Campbell,
>>
>> Why are you Pro-Slavery? I don't understand. Don't you know slavery
>> is wrong.
>> I would think someone with a PhD would know that owning another
>> person is a grave ill against Humanity.
>>
>> It strikes me as a great concern that a Professor at a major
>> University would be defending the institution of Slavery.
>>
>> I understand your obsession and ability to relate to the past, but
>> slavery is not something I think you should embrace in any form,
>> shape or manner, much less want to bring back into modern society.
>>
>> I pray you will reconsider your pro-slavery, and pro-segregationist
>> attitude, for the good your own life, and your students at
>> Washington State University.
>>
>> Your Friend,
>>
>> Donovan Arnold
>>
>>
>>
>> --- On Fri, 3/12/10, Joe Campbell <philosopher.joe at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
> From: Joe Campbell <philosopher.joe at gmail.com>
> Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Teabaggers
> To: "Donovan Arnold" <donovanjarnold2008 at yahoo.com>
> Cc: "Moscow Vision 2020" <vision2020 at moscow.com>
> Date: Friday, March 12, 2010, 5:24 PM
>
> What is pro-slavery about saying it is ALWAYS wrong to buy and KEEP
> slaves? You need to get away from the Wilson crap rhetoric. You are
> starting to believe your own lies! Joe
>
>
>
> On Mar 12, 2010, at 11:08 AM, Donovan Arnold <donovanjarnold2008 at yahoo.com
> > wrote:
>
>> Dr. Joe Campbell,
>>
>> Why are you Pro-Slavery? I don't understand. Don't you know slavery
>> is wrong.
>> I would think someone with a PhD would know that owning another
>> person is a grave ill against Humanity.
>>
>> It strikes me as a great concern that a Professor at a major
>> University would be defending the institution of Slavery.
>>
>> I understand your obsession and ability to relate to the past, but
>> slavery is not something I think you should embrace in any form,
>> shape or manner, much less want to bring back into modern society.
>>
>> I pray you will reconsider your pro-slavery, and pro-segregationist
>> attitude, for the good your own life, and your students at
>> Washington State University.
>>
>> Your Friend,
>>
>> Donovan Arnold
>>
>> --- On Fri, 3/12/10, Joe Campbell <philosopher.joe at gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>> From: Joe Campbell <philosopher.joe at gmail.com>
>> Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Teabaggers
>> To: "Donovan Arnold" <donovanjarnold2008 at yahoo.com>
>> Cc: "Moscow Vision 2020" <vision2020 at moscow.com>
>> Date: Friday, March 12, 2010, 3:46 PM
>>
>> Nothing sounds mote bigoted than a defense if slavery!
>>
>>
>>
>> On Mar 12, 2010, at 9:53 AM, Donovan Arnold <donovanjarnold2008 at yahoo.com
>> > wrote:
>>
>>> "Arnie believes that the Democrats were pro-segregation and the
>>> Republicans
>>> were anti-Vietnam back in the 60s and 70s." --Sgt. Hamster
>>>
>>>
>>> I suppose the following Democrats and laws were figments of my
>>> imagination or perhaps The Hamster believes the KKK was not a
>>> racist movement.
>>>
>>> Jim Crow Laws
>>> Senator Robert Byrd
>>> Hugo Black
>>> Senator Strom Thurmond
>>> Gov. George Corley Wallace, Jr.
>>> Senator Ernest Hollings
>>> Richard Russell, Jr.
>>> James Eastland
>>> John Stenni
>>> Jesse Helms
>>>
>>> Recently, Democrats have been better at not being bigoted toward
>>> Blacks, Gays, Women, and minorities. But that is only a general
>>> rule, not applicable in every case.
>>>
>>> Nixon and Ford ended the Vietnam War, both Republicans. JFK and
>>> Johnson escalated it. So indeed, the parties have switched
>>> positions since the 1960s. In fact, many people switched political
>>> parties after the Civil Rights Act of 1964 passed.
>>>
>>> Your Friend,
>>>
>>> Donovan Arnold
>>>
>>>
>>> --- On Thu, 3/11/10, Tom Hansen <thansen at moscow.com> wrote:
>>>
>>> From: Tom Hansen <thansen at moscow.com>
>>> Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Teabaggers
>>> To: "Wayne Price" <bear at moscow.com>, "Moscow Vision 2020" <vision2020 at moscow.com
>>> >
>>> Date: Thursday, March 11, 2010, 10:06 PM
>>>
>>> Wayne -
>>>
>>> To put Arnie into appropriate perspective, here is one of his
>>> similarly
>>> profound quotes:
>>>
>>> "Both parties are completely different than they were in the 1960s
>>> and
>>> 1970s when Democrats were pro-segregation and Republicans were
>>> anti-war."
>>>
>>> - Donovan Arnold (March 5, 2010)
>>>
>>> http://mailman.fsr.com/pipermail/vision2020/2010-March/068911.html
>>>
>>> That's right, Wayne.
>>>
>>> Arnie believes that the Democrats were pro-segregation and the
>>> Republicans
>>> were anti-Vietnam back in the 60s and 70s.
>>>
>>> It's as if President Johnson's Civil Rights Act of 1964 and
>>> President
>>> Nixon's 1968 campaign promise that we would be out of Vietnam by
>>> the end
>>> of 1969 (followed five years later with his "Withdrawal With Honor"
>>> concept of 1974) never happened.
>>>
>>> Tom Hansen
>>> Moscow, Idaho
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> > Clearly Dr Donovan, you are correct and the Mount Vernon Society
>>> ( The
>>> > folks that OWN Mt. Vernon) are wrong. How could I have been so
>>> silly
>>> > to trust what they said and not you?
>>> >
>>> > http://www.mountvernon.org/learn/meet_george/index.cfm/ss/101/
>>> >
>>> >
>>> > "George Washington was born into a world in which slavery was
>>> > accepted. He became a slave owner when his father died in 1743.
>>> At the
>>> > age of eleven, he inherited ten slaves and 500 acres of land.
>>> When he
>>> > began farming Mount Vernon eleven years later, at the age of 22,
>>> he
>>> > had a work force of about 36 slaves. With his marriage to Martha
>>> > Custis in 1759, 20 of her slaves came to Mount Vernon. After their
>>> > marriage, Washington purchased even more slaves. The slave
>>> population
>>> > also increased because the slaves were marrying and raising
>>> their own
>>> > families. By 1799, when George Washington died, there were 316
>>> slaves
>>> > living on the estate."
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >
>>> > On Mar 11, 2010, at 1:28 PM, Donovan Arnold wrote:
>>> >
>>> >> Rev. Keely, nobody is defending slavery. Let me say it twice so
>>> even
>>> >> you understand, NOBODY is defending slavery. I was just
>>> explaining
>>> >> inaccuracies in his (Mr. Price's) posts about Thomas Jefferson
>>> >> sleeping with his slaves and George Washington being a large
>>> slave
>>> >> owner. They are factually incorrect statements.
>>> >>
>>> >>
>>> >> I forgot, accuracy of the facts was not a concern for you, just
>>> >> unfounded misguided displays of fake catty emotional outrage,
>>> Keely
>>> >> when slandering people on both the local and national level,
>>> living
>>> >> and dead.
>>> >>
>>> >> Your Friend,
>>> >>
>>> >> Donovan Arnold
>>> >>
>>> >> --- On Thu, 3/11/10, keely emerinemix <kjajmix1 at msn.com> wrote:
>>> >>
>>> >> From: keely emerinemix <kjajmix1 at msn.com>
>>> >> Subject: RE: [Vision2020] Teabaggers
>>> >> To: donovanjarnold2008 at yahoo.com, garrettmc at verizon.net, "Chris
>>> >> Price" <bear at moscow.com>
>>> >> Cc: vision2020 at moscow.com
>>> >> Date: Thursday, March 11, 2010, 3:37 PM
>>> >>
>>> >> This eloquent defense of slave-owning American Presidents is
>>> >> something less than heartening. It's almost as if we've heard
>>> >> similar arguments before from local folks interested in
>>> convincing
>>> >> us that, you know, on the whole, slavery wasn't, like, THAT bad,
>>> >> really.
>>> >>
>>> >> That George and Thomas are numbered among anti-slavery
>>> >> abolitionists, as appears to be the contention here, is as
>>> ludicrous
>>> >> as it is offensive. They may not have been the absolutely worst
>>> >> slaveholders ever, but I don't think either man's biographies are
>>> >> testimonies to their egalitarian, Christian, progressive morals.
>>> >>
>>> >> Keely
>>> >> www.keely-prevailingwinds.com
>>> >>
>>> >>
>>> >>
>>> >>
>>> >> Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 06:48:58 -0800
>>> >> From: donovanjarnold2008 at yahoo.com
>>> >> To: garrettmc at verizon.net; bear at moscow.com
>>> >> CC: vision2020 at moscow.com
>>> >> Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Teabaggers
>>> >>
>>> >> Wayne,
>>> >>
>>> >> The tea was tipped overboard not because most people drank it,
>>> but
>>> >> because it denied revenue to the British. The average colonists
>>> >> didn't want to be independent from the British, but they were not
>>> >> happy under them either.
>>> >>
>>> >> The British government prevented western expansion which
>>> seriously
>>> >> hindered the expansion of the economy and the well being of many
>>> >> western colonists and farmers.
>>> >>
>>> >> Thomas Jefferson bought slaves and freed them when they paid
>>> their
>>> >> price of purchase off. Many anti-slavery people did this.
>>> >>
>>> >> Thomas Jefferson did not sleep with his slaves, DNA tests from
>>> his
>>> >> know relatives prove this. His brother did sleep with Sally
>>> >> Hemmings, who was the half sister of his wife who passed away and
>>> >> looked a great deal like her. He cared for her greatly and she
>>> lived
>>> >> in his house because she was his wife's sister and didn't want
>>> her
>>> >> living as a common slave.
>>> >> George Washington had willed his slaves to be freed upon the
>>> death
>>> >> of his wife. Although she freed them earlier because she felt
>>> >> uncomfortable with all the slaves asking if she was dead yet (a
>>> >> little humor, but true). Little do people know, but George
>>> >> Washington did not own many slaves, his wife owned most them, she
>>> >> obtained from her previous husband, Daniel Parke Custis a wealthy
>>> >> plantation farmer, upon his death.
>>> >>
>>> >> Your Friend,
>>> >>
>>> >> Donovan Arnold
>>> >>
>>> >>
>>> >> --- On Thu, 3/11/10, Wayne Price <bear at moscow.com> wrote:
>>> >>
>>> >> From: Wayne Price <bear at moscow.com>
>>> >> Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Teabaggers
>>> >> To: "Garrett Clevenger" <garrettmc at verizon.net>
>>> >> Cc: vision2020 at moscow.com
>>> >> Date: Thursday, March 11, 2010, 12:52 AM
>>> >>
>>> >> Garrett,
>>> >>
>>> >> While the Tea Bag movement has hijacked the name, I'm not so sure
>>> >> they even realize what the 1770's movements were all about!
>>> >> The average colonist was happy being British!
>>> >>
>>> >> At that time in the colonies, TEA was not the drink of the
>>> average
>>> >> (read that as NOT wealthy) colonist. Rather they drank cider,
>>> >> because they could make
>>> >> it locally, and could afford it. Ever wonder why real tea
>>> chests of
>>> >> the period have a locks on them? Because it was expensive and the
>>> >> rich didn't want the servants to
>>> >> steal it! The original so called "patriots" were nothing more
>>> than
>>> >> a bunch of folks with money trying to avoid taxes. Sound
>>> familiar?
>>> >>
>>> >>
>>> >> Same deal with the folks that shot at government troops on
>>> their way
>>> >> to and from Lexington and Concord to bring the GOVERNMENT owned
>>> arms
>>> >> and powder back
>>> >> to Boston, so the colonists/traitors/early american terrorists
>>> >> couldn't use it. Can you imagine today if that happened? Makes me
>>> >> wonder what would happen if the
>>> >> average citizens marched on the local National Guard armories so
>>> >> that they could prevent the government from using the arms! Think
>>> >> they would be considered
>>> >> "patriots"?
>>> >>
>>> >>
>>> >> I have to laugh when I see the fractured history that George
>>> >> Nethercutt is trying to sell on TV..... Did the boy never read a
>>> >> history book! I laughed when I saw one about
>>> >> George Washington being anti-slavery! One of the richest slave
>>> >> OWNERS in Virginia at the time! And then there is that scion of
>>> >> colonial america Thomas Jefferson,
>>> >> he not only owned slaves, but would bed them too! Or was that
>>> just
>>> >> for the benefit of the slaves?
>>> >>
>>> >>
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>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------
>>> >>
>>> >>
>>> >> On Mar 10, 2010, at 3:24 PM, Garrett Clevenger wrote:
>>> >>
>>> >> Thanks, Joe, you summed up well what I've been thinking.
>>> >>
>>> >> It is rather presumptious of the teabaggers to think their "tea
>>> >> party movement" is anything close to the real deal back when the
>>> >> colonies were fighting for independence.
>>> >>
>>> >> The contemporary tea partiers are more like carpetbaggers in that
>>> >> regard, so it seems "teabagger" is a rather appropriate term.
>>> >>
>>> >> I have no idea what the sexual definition of teabagger is and
>>> don't
>>> >> really care to so when I say "teabagger" I'm describing "tea
>>> party"
>>> >> people who are exploiting the patriotism of the Boston Tea Party.
>>> >>
>>> >> But are we really surprised that people who carry guns in the
>>> open
>>> >> to rallies and shout down those who disagree with them would be
>>> >> anything less than arrogant?
>>> >>
>>> >> Teabaggers, indeed.
>>> >>
>>> >> Garrett Clevenger
>>> >> =======================================================
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>>> >> http://www.fsr.net
>>> >> mailto:Vision2020 at moscow.com
>>> >> =======================================================
>>> >>
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>>> >>
>>> >>
>>> >> Your E-mail and More On-the-Go. Get Windows Live Hotmail Free.
>>> Sign
>>> >> up now.
>>> >>
>>> >>
>>> >
>>> > =======================================================
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>>> > =======================================================
>>>
>>>
>>> "The Pessimist complains about the wind, the Optimist expects it
>>> to change
>>> and the Realist adjusts his sails."
>>>
>>> - Unknown
>>>
>>>
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>>
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>
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