[Vision2020] Freedom of expression

Joe Campbell philosopher.joe at gmail.com
Sun Dec 12 14:12:38 PST 2010

Just to be clear, I am not really offended by NSA's website. I find it
amusing. I'm also as straight, white, Christian, and male as you are,
so it isn't too surprising that I'm not offended, that I don't feel
threatened by people I know to be cowards and political opportunists.
My real claim is that the NSA website is OFFENSIVE, that it is hate

Here's a good enough definition that I found on the web: "Hate speech
is, outside the law, any communication which disparages a person or a
group on the basis of some characteristic such as race or sexual
orientation. In law, hate speech is any speech, gesture or conduct,
writing, or display which is forbidden because it may incite violence
or prejudicial action against or by a protected individual or group,
or because it disparages or intimidates a protected individual or

I'm using it in the non-legal sense, so I'm not asking that the law
step into the matter. Are you suggesting that the website is NOT hate
speech, that it is not even worthy of criticism?

On Sun, Dec 12, 2010 at 1:46 PM, Paul Rumelhart <godshatter at yahoo.com> wrote:
> And I'm not just talking about Freedom of Speech as codified in the Bill
> of Rights.  That's only there to keep our government from trampling on
> freedom of expression, which is a right we all have regardless of the
> Bill of Rights.
> If this discussion had nothing to do with freedom of expression, then
> the topics would change from "violent rhetoric" and "this offends me" to
> "secularism doesn't have to be the enemy of Christian thought" and
> "exactly what is secularism and why does it frighten them so".
> You see what I'm sayin'?
> Paul
> Tom Hansen wrote:
>> Paul Rumelhart stated:
>> "I think the freedom of an individual or group of individuals to express
>> themselves is sacrosanct.  The freedom to express your opinion should be
>> held dearly by everyone, if they want to live in a free society."
>> Nobody is arguing against NSA's right to speak or their right to post
>> comments on their website.
>> Nick Gier and Joe Campbell are merely argiung that the statements made by
>> NSA are inappropriate, analagous to those complaints made here on the Viz
>> (and a local blahg) against those of us who express our displeasure with a
>> certain local un-pastor.
>> New Saint Andrews College and its "management" are free to post whatever
>> commentary they like.  Just as each of us has the right to evaluate the
>> appropriateness of those comments.
>> Yasee what I'm sayin'?
>> Now, I may be going out on a limb here by suggesting that there are some
>> Viz subscribers that feel less than thrilled by comments I have made, and
>> they have every right to express their displeasure.  Many of them have.
>> And in the future many more will.
>> And yet life goes on.
>> Seeya round town, Moscow.
>> Tom Hansen
>> Moscow, Idaho
>> "The Pessimist complains about the wind, the Optimist expects it to change
>> and the Realist adjusts his sails."
>> - Unknown
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