[Vision2020] Crabtree once again defends racism (was blah, blah, blah)

Sunil Ramalingam sunilramalingam at hotmail.com
Thu Jan 29 07:10:41 PST 2009


"It is an unambiguous fact that the media was 
rooting a little extra for McNabb and if you watched any of the reporting and 
commentary at the time you couldn't miss it."

I disagree with this; I don't think the media was rooting any more for him than they were for Peyton Manning back then, or than they do for Roethlisberger or Warner now.

Maybe I'm wrong and you can substantiate your claim, but I don't see it as an 'unambiguous fact.'

Sunil

From: jampot at roadrunner.com
To: philosopher.joe at gmail.com
Date: Thu, 29 Jan 2009 06:23:39 -0800
CC: vision2020 at moscow.com
Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Crabtree once again defends racism (was blah, blah,	blah)










"I, and most sensible people?" looks as though 
we're off to a great start.
 
It would seem that you are not very well informed 
with regard to the Donovan McNabb/Rush Limbaugh incident. From the ESPN web 
site:
 
George Bodenheimer, president of ESPN and ABC Sports, issued the following 
response: (to Limbaugh's resignation)

"We accept his resignation and regret the circumstances surrounding this. We 
believe that he took the appropriate action to resolve this matter 
expeditiously."
The comments referenced by Limbaugh came during Sunday's pregame show when 
the conservative talk show host offered the opinion that McNabb wasn't as good 
as the media perceived him to be.
"I think what we've had here is a little social concern in the NFL. The media 
has been very desirous that a black quarterback do well,'' Limbaugh said. "There 
is a little hope invested in McNabb, and he got a lot of credit for the 
performance of this team that he didn't deserve. The defense carried this 
team."
It is an unambiguous fact that the media was 
rooting a little extra for McNabb and if you watched any of the reporting and 
commentary at the time you couldn't miss it. It is hardly racist to acknowledge 
this reality. Jump ahead five years and substitute BHO for DM. It isn't racist 
to point out the obvious.
In the first two games of the 2003 
season McNabb's performance was sub par. To offer up the opinion that he 
was currently over rated was just that, an opinion on his performance, not his 
color. McNabb went on to have a pretty good year so consequentially 
Limbaugh's comments may have been premature, or poorly informed, or 
flat out wrong but they were opinions on a quarterback and not 
racism.
Let's review. Rush did not say that McNabb "was not subject to criticism because he was 
black." Rush was not "FIRED" (note to jc: all caps and 
repetition do not constitute truth) from ESPN. That being cleared up, it really 
isn't at all hard to characterize your misinterpretation of the incident as 
liberal bias.
For the record, I do not think that it's racist to 
disagree with people of color. I don't think that it's racist to not get all 
tingly in my lower extremities when a person of color gets elected to high 
office and I most assuredly don't think it's racist to offer up the same 
criticism to a person of color that I would to any other public figure 
where it's warranted. In fact, I do think that it's more then a little 
condescending and, quite frankly, racist not to.
Now, All that having been said, I don't think YOU'RE 
a belligerent, racist, liar but, you sure do sound like one. Oh, and by the 
way, you have on several previous occasions called me a bigot when the subject 
was race, making the first two sentences along with the general theme of 
your post prevarications.
 
g

  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: 
  Joe 
  Campbell 
  To: g. crabtree 
  Cc: Saundra Lund ; <vision2020 at moscow.com> 
  Sent: Wednesday, January 28, 2009 5:58 
  PM
  Subject: Re: Crabtree once again defends 
  racism (was blah, blah, blah)
  

  I'm not trying to pick a fight. Nor did I call you a racist. I just find 
  it curious that you keep putting your stamp of approval next to comments that 
  I and most sensible people consider to be racist. First there was your defense 
  of No Weatherman and then your recent defense of comments by Rush. 
  

  The recent Rush comments, by the way, were similar to comments he made 
  about Donovan McNabb - that DM was not subject to criticism because he was 
  black. Those comments, if you remember, got Rush FIRED from espn. You don't 
  have a problem with the comments but enough people did that he was 
FIRED.
  

  It is hard to pass off my disgust for Rush's recent comments as some kind 
  of liberal bias in light of this history, these facts. And it is equally hard 
  to make sense of your support for Rush's comments in light of this history, 
  these facts.
  

  Lastly, I like how you brush off my suggestion that you characterize all 
  liberals as holding the same stupid view but you do it again below! I never 
  said anything negative about Soul, or Williams, or Steele. I never said 
  anything about any of them. I don't even know who some of them are!
  

  But somewhere, somewhen, some stupid liberal made some stupid comment 
  about one of them and the rest of us have to pay - because we're all the 
  same.
  

  And somehow this all explains why a comment made by Rush, which would 
  have gotten him fired were he still on espn, isn't as racist as common sense 
  suggests.
  

  Look, maybe you're not a racist, Gary. But you sure sound like 
  one.

Joe Campbell
  
On Jan 28, 2009, at 7:43 AM, "g. crabtree" <jampot at roadrunner.com> 
  wrote:


  
  
    
    First line, irrelevant babble, no response 
    required.
     
    Second, same as first. Yawn.
     
    Third. Like calling someone a nazi when your 
    argument is floundering, hurl out the "racist" appellation when you're 
    desperate to make some sort of a point and nothing else is sticking. If you 
    would like to continue down this woeful road, why not explain for me and the 
    rest of the readership what, exactly, is racist about not being impressed 
    (or distressed) by our new leaders fathers skin color? How does it 
    make BHO's policy's divinely inspired while the ideas put forth by 
    Thomas Soul, Walter Williams, and Michael Steele something to be disregarded 
    as irrelevant and beneath contempt? And finally, what the hell do your pals 
    pockets have to do with anything? Are they packed full of moon beams and 
    fairy dust?
     
    g
    
      ----- Original Message ----- 
      From: 
      Joe Campbell 
      To: Saundra Lund 
      Cc: g. crabtree ; <vision2020 at moscow.com> 
      
      Sent: Tuesday, January 27, 2009 6:54 
      PM
      Subject: Re: [Vision2020] 
      Contradictory Crabtree (was RE: Say What?)
      

      Sandra, no sense in letting the facts get in the way of the radical 
      right rhetoric. Those who disagree are all communists, God-haters.
      

      On the other hand, we're all a team, accepting all of  the same 
      views. How else could the Bush ideology win, unless it was black 
      (liberalism, communism, atheism) against white (truth, justice, and the 
      American way)? 
      

      And Tom's original post about Rush's racist comments - which Crabtree 
      supported without a blink, just like he supported the racist rants of No 
      Weatherman - is smoothly swept under the rug. What's a little racism when 
      what is at stake is God Himself? Or the pockets of my friends? 
      
Joe Campbell
      
On Jan 27, 2009, at 4:33 PM, "Saundra Lund" <sslund_2007 at verizon.net> 
      wrote:


      
      
        
        
        Yet again, 
        what an enormous crock, but that’s what many of us have come to expect 
        from you in this forum  J
        
        And, how 
        wrong you are, as usual.  As everyone who knows me knows, Obama 
        wasn’t “my” candidate, let alone any kind of deity to me.  I did, 
        however, vote for the candidate out of the choices we wound up with who 
        I thought would do the best job, a decision a clear majority agreed 
        with.  So take your sour grapes and go make some more whine – 
        continue to be part of the problem rather than part of a solution . . . 
        that’s what you’re good at.
        
        It’s not 
        surprising at all to me – nor should it be to any of us here -- that you 
        don’t bother to even try to correct what you say I got wrong in 
        summarizing the positions you’ve taken here.  It would be pretty 
        difficult for you, what with the V2020 archives being open for all  
        J
        
        
        
        Saundra 
        Lund
        Moscow, 
        ID
        
        The 
        only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good people to do 
        nothing.
        ~ 
        Edmund Burke
        
        ***** 
        Original material contained herein is Copyright 2009 through life plus 
        70 years, Saundra Lund.  Do not copy, forward, excerpt, or 
        reproduce outside the Vision 2020 forum without the express written 
        permission of the author.*****
        
        
        
        From: g. crabtree 
        [mailto:jampot at roadrunner.com] 
        
Sent: Tuesday, January 27, 2009 7:42 AM
To: Saundra 
        Lund; vision2020 at moscow.com
Subject: 
        Re: [Vision2020] Contradictory Crabtree (was RE: Say 
        What?)
        
        
        
        Ms. 
        Lund,
        
        
        
          I'm 
        not sure exactly how pointing out that I will support your new god when 
        (if) I see him doing good for the country and oppose him when he's not 
        qualifies as whining but, I guess it's in the ear of the termagant. 
        I defer to your mastery as eight continuous years of effort 
        have, without a doubt, left you well practiced on the 
        matter.
        
        
        
          I 
        find it highly amusing and not a small bit refreshing that you feel 
        comfortable enough in your creative writing style to forge ahead without 
        feeling even the slightest need to anchor yourself to anything 
        resembling a fact. The errors in your brief communication are many, and 
        I'm just sure that you'll forgive me if (what with life being short and 
        all) I don't bother to enumerate them. Lets face it, as one of The 
        Chosen Ones most fervent followers it's clear that you have gotten 
        beyond the need for accuracy and reason where it comes to your cute 
        little school girl affaire d'coeur with your freshly minted 
        deity. My only request would be that if you are going to do the other 
        members of this little electronic community the service of pointing 
        out that evil "Crabtree's" position on any given topic that you provide 
        a cite so that the others can make a reasonable distinction between my 
        actual stand on any given matter and what is a fantasy fueled 
        by your freshly found religious fervor.
        
        
        
        My most heart 
        felt thanks in advance,
        
        g
        
          
          ----- 
          Original Message ----- 
          
          From: Saundra Lund 
          
          
          To: vision2020 at moscow.com 
          
          
          Sent: Sunday, 
          January 25, 2009 9:31 PM
          
          Subject: 
          [Vision2020] Contradictory Crabtree (was RE: Say 
          What?)
          
          
          LOL – let 
          the whining begin!
          
          Gary 
          Crabtree wrote:
          “As I said 
          previously, if there is an issue that "our" president should come up 
          with that I think makes America a better, safer, or less 
          restrictive place to live, I'll support 
him.”
          
          Note the 
          quotation marks Crabtree uses – he’s clearly wanting to continue with 
          the divisiveness that doomed the election for the 
          GOP.
          
          Of course, 
          he contradicts himself here:
          “If BHO 
          plans on making good on his campaign promises with regard to abortion, 
          education, taxes, health care, the second amendment, the global 
          warming hoax, and the war on terror, then I suspect a huge 
          portion of the 53 million American's who didn't vote for him (once) 
          hope he fails miserably, myself included.”
          
          So, 
          Crabtree only wants a less restrictive place to live if it suits his 
          notion of a “less restrictive place to live” – he’s against 
          reproductive rights, even for rape victims.  Let’s keep them thar 
          women broodmares!  Remember, he’s a staunch supporter of 
          misogynistic “conscience laws” that enable pharmacists to refuse to 
          dispense contraceptives, emergency or otherwise, which would certainly 
          make America a much more restrictive place for women to live.  
          The broken health care system folks like Crabtree want to cling to has 
          made America a much more restrictive place to live for many regular 
          hardworking Americans – he’s seemingly proud of the fact that we are 
          the only industrialized nation where people lose their homes due to 
          unconscionable health care costs.  The Second Amendment our 
          founding fathers gave us isn’t good enough for Crabtree and his ilk – 
          they want a Second Amendment on Steroids.  He’s content that the 
          War on Terror has lead to the terrorization of US citizens through the 
          erosion of our guaranteed civil liberties and put us on a path to a 
          police state – that sure seems like a much more restrictive place to 
          live to me, and that’s without even getting into the shame of torture 
          and denial of due process to suspects.  He’s pleased with a tax 
          system that unfairly burdens the least among us while providing 
          nothing but loopholes ripe for exploitation by the greedy amongst us, 
          especially those who benefit from the special interest lobbying they 
          fund.    Education – his solution is I don’t know what, 
          but it would likely look similar – and have results similar to – the 
          deregulation that’s caused the financial crisis that came crashing 
          down around Bush’s ears.  God only knows what nonsense fills his 
          head about global warming – it would appear his understanding of 
          science is limited to the right-wing whack jobs who flunked 
          science.
          
          Fortunately, 
          the election was a resounding rejection of those like Crabtree who 
          want keep doing things that don’t work.  And, I’m sure we have 
          his sore loser whining to look forward to for the next four 
          years.  After all, this was a legitimate win for Obama, which 
          must make the win that much more difficult to swallow  
          J
          
          
          
          Saundra 
          Lund
          Moscow, 
          ID
          
          The 
          only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good people to do 
          nothing.
          ~ 
          Edmund Burke
          
          ***** 
          Original material contained herein is Copyright 2008 through life plus 
          70 years, Saundra Lund.  Do not copy, forward, excerpt, or 
          reproduce outside the Vision 2020 forum without the express written 
          permission of the author.*****
          
          
          
          From: vision2020-bounces at moscow.com 
          [mailto:vision2020-bounces at moscow.com] 
          On Behalf Of g. crabtree
Sent: Sunday, January 25, 
          2009 12:38 PM
To: Chasuk
Cc: vision2020 at moscow.com
Subject: 
          Re: [Vision2020] Say What?
          
          
          I guess 
          that it all depends on which side of the Kool-Aid jug you sit on. I 
          can't believe that you can say with a straight face that what you 
          might find on drudge or the freep is as over the top as some of the 
          mindless, howling at the moon, wackiness found at kos or 
          huffington.
          
          
          
          As I said 
          previously, if there is an issue that "our" president should come up 
          with that I think makes America a better, safer, or less restrictive 
          place to live, I'll support him. On everything else I'll fight him to 
          the best of my ability and hope for his catastrophic failure. 
          Since I am unaware of a single issue with which I am in agreement 
          major policy wise, I don't think that there will be much to support. 
          If every mega leftist measure your hero puts forward is an abject 
          failure it will hopefully discredit the ultra liberal wing of the 
          democrat party and hasten the rise of a truly conservative candidate. 
          All to the greater glory of our republic, in my 
          opinion.
          
          
          
          g
          
          ----- 
          Original Message ----- 
          
          From: 
          "Chasuk" <chasuk at gmail.com>
          
          To: "g. 
          crabtree" <jampot at roadrunner.com>
          
          Cc: 
          <vision2020 at moscow.com>; "Tom 
          Hansen" <thansen at moscow.com>
          
          Sent: 
          Sunday, January 25, 2009 11:43 AM
          
          Subject: 
          Re: [Vision2020] Say What?
          
          
          > On 
          Sun, Jan 25, 2009 at 06:51, g. crabtree <jampot at roadrunner.com> 
          wrote:
> 
>> Remember how your side wished President GW 
          the best? Sort of like that but
>> without the shrillness and 
          childish demonstrations.
> 
> Sorry, I read a lot of blogs 
          and new sites, across the political
> spectrum -- including 
          http://drudgereport.com,
> 
          http://www.freerepublic.com, and 
          http://worldnetdaily.com -- 
          and
> "shrill" and "childish" are words that much more 
          accurately describe
> the conservative side of things.  
          Other accurate words would be
> inarticulate and 
          ungrammatical.
> 
> And how about wishing that Obama 
          simply fail to successfully implement
> those policies and 
          agendas with which you disagree?  As far as
> conservatives 
          go, you are the voice of reason on this forum, Gary.
> You 
          really don't strike me as subscribing to the
> 
          cut-off-the-nose-to-spite-the-face 
          philosophy.
>
          
          
          
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