[Vision2020] Rent Prices Was: Sen Schroeder

Fri Feb 20 12:15:29 PST 2009

Saundra,

Talk is cheap. Show me some examples of nice newer homes in Moscow that are in the price range of the average household income in Latah. I showed you all the listings I found. Please Saundra, if you disagree, provide us with a list of nice apartments in Moscow for under $550 a month. Otherwise your posting is just with a sour forked tongue. Your word and promise that there are apartments available that are decent and affordable for what the jobs pay in Moscow, doesn't get me an apartment. Where's the beef?

I have been to almost every apartment complex in Moscow. You can believe it or not. When I ran for student government and worked on campaigns for local offices, you cover a lot of ground. Also, being poor, I have had to check a lot of housing units. I have also done a lot of in home work with people on disability support, who live in apartments complexes in Moscow. Moscow is not that big, especially if you been a lot of years, so anyone with a little bit of effort can see most of what Moscow offers. There is also a list at the department of Housing and Urban Development, and the Department of Agriculture has a list of low income house, so it is not that difficult to find the affordable units. 

I am not trashing owners of properties. That is your gig Saudra. I am trashing the policies that some in Moscow promote that keep landlords and others from being able to charge reasonable rates. Most of the time, it is property taxes and lack of available developed zoning for housing that keeps prices high. 

I do agree there are slum lords out there. And it bothers me. But most slum lords are that way because they don't have the money to restore, repair, and properly maintain their properties, and raising rent forces their tenants into no housing or worse living conditions. 

If Saundra has a  list of nice affordable housing units in Moscow, please give them to me so I can move into them. 

I do not believe $700 a month for an apartment is affordable in Moscow. A minimum wage person ($6.50 an hour at 37.5 hrs week) makes only $900 a month after taxes. A couple makes $1800 both working with no kids, after rent, utilities, and phone, are paying 45-60% of their income on just housing. If they have kids, it is now impossible without cutting corners and doing without. State and federal regulations say affortable housing is only 30% of total income if they are to make enough to pay for other living expenses. 

Also keep in mind, that most apartment complexes require the family to make 3 times what the rent is to move in, plus deposit and first and last month's rents. 

So the couple has to make at least $2100 a month. And put down about $1800-2100 just to move in. So I disagree with your math. 

Best Regards,

Donovan

--- On Fri, 2/20/09, Saundra Lund <sslund_2007 at verizon.net> wrote:
From: Saundra Lund <sslund_2007 at verizon.net>
Subject: RE: Rent Prices Was: [Vision2020] Sen Schroeder
To: "'Chasuk'" <chasuk at gmail.com>, donovanjarnold2005 at yahoo.com
Cc: "'Ellen Roskovich'" <gussie443 at hotmail.com>, "'Andy Boyd'" <moscowrecycling at turbonet.com>, vision2020 at moscow.com
Date: Friday, February 20, 2009, 11:29 AM

I agree with Chas -- while there are **definitely** houses that rent for
$1200/month (i.e., I saw a *very* nice house in Fort Russell renting for
that in June & another *very* nice house behind the arboretum in the same
time frame) and more in Moscow, there are lots of decent apartments,
duplexes, and houses that rent for substantially less than that.  I feel
pretty comfortable saying that since I helped several people (students,
non-students, and faculty) find housing as recent as last spring, summer,
and even into the fall.

And, no, I don't have any special connections.  I was actually pleasantly
surprised at how much the rental market has loosened up since the last time
I helped folks find homes three or four years ago.

None of that means that there isn't still a need for truly affordable
housing in Moscow for our residents because there *definitely* is.  When you
do the math for a couple of young adults working two minimum wage jobs, you
can easily see the problem of paying $600-700/month rent for a nice two
bedroom apartment (WSG included), particularly when those minimum wage jobs
*don't* include health insurance.  If, for instance, you slip in the ice
some bad neighbor has failed to shovel for weeks and break your arm . . . 

Donovan wrote:
"I have been to almost every apartment complex in Moscow, and unless you
are
living in subsidized housing, you are paying at least $550 a month for a
large one bedroom or two small bedroom one bath, or you are living in
something small or nasty. Most of them are older apartments too, around for
my parents or when my sister was a Frosh at UI."

And, that's not true at all.  Perhaps, Donovan, you are somewhat out of
touch since you no longer live here and haven't lived here in awhile?
Clearly you've not seen nearly as much as you think you've seen, at
least
more recently.

You'd do a lot better, IMHO, trying to make your case if you didn't
make
crap up whole cloth up or use the worst examples (of which there are plenty)
to over-generalize.  Yes, there are some overpriced crappy rentals in
Moscow, but there are lots more, IMHO, reasonably priced decent rentals in
Moscow -- I've actually seen them with my own eyes, Donovan, and recently,
too.

If you want to go after slumlords, I'll be right there with you; what I
won't do is sit silently while you try to portray the rental market in
Moscow as something that it's not.  There's definitely lots of room for
improvement, but it's nowhere as grim as you want to portray, IMHO.

It is possible, you know, to advocate for change without trashing those who
don't deserve to be trashed.

Saundra Lund
Moscow, ID

The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good people to do
nothing.
~ Edmund Burke

***** Original material contained herein is Copyright 2009 through life plus
70 years, Saundra Lund.  Do not copy, forward, excerpt, or reproduce outside
the Vision 2020 forum without the express written permission of the
author.*****

-----Original Message-----
From: Chasuk [mailto:chasuk at gmail.com] 
Sent: Thursday, February 19, 2009 7:16 PM
To: donovanjarnold2005 at yahoo.com
Cc: Ellen Roskovich; Andy Boyd; vision2020 at moscow.com; Saundra Lund
Subject: Rent Prices Was: [Vision2020] Sen Schroeder

On Thu, Feb 19, 2009 at 18:08, Donovan Arnold
<donovanjarnold2005 at yahoo.com> wrote:

> I am sure we have heard more. And so they wonder why rent is $1200 a month
> in Moscow and $700 a month in the Treasure Valley,

Rent is $1200 a month in Moscow?  That certainly isn't an average, or
even the mean.  I've never paid more than $600 a month in Moscow, and
I've lived in some pretty nice apartments.  I'm renting a 4 bedroom
home now, and I don't pay $1200 a month, or anywhere near it.

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