[Vision2020] Vision2020 Digest, Vol 34, Issue 55

Tue Apr 7 12:48:05 PDT 2009

I can't speak for Ralph or anyone else but someone actually said to me last night that "I'm not one of those Liberals who are afraid to ever go to war." "Wars have always been good for the economy but since there's less casualties with today's tech. and all the liberal propaganda and wining it's countered the positive effects."

This is total crap.  First of all, labelling devices and buzzwords used to categorize how "All" people must think about "All" issues on one side should be done away with.  Let's talk about each issue and forget Left or Right, B.S.

There's a time and place for war and under false pretenses against the wrong enemy should be abhorred by any partisanship.

Just my opinion, but I'll freely admit I don't know nuttin' bout' nuttin'.  That's why I actually read what everyone here has to say.

Don

> From: vision2020-request at moscow.com
> Subject: Vision2020 Digest, Vol 34, Issue 55
> To: vision2020 at moscow.com
> Date: Tue, 7 Apr 2009 10:45:17 -0700
> 
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> When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
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> Today's Topics:
> 
> 1. Re: Six gay men shot to death in Iraq (Donovan Arnold)
> 
> 
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
> 
> Message: 1
> Date: Tue, 7 Apr 2009 10:45:15 -0700 (PDT)
> From: Donovan Arnold <donovanjarnold2005 at yahoo.com>
> Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Six gay men shot to death in Iraq
> To: Paul Rumelhart <godshatter at yahoo.com>
> Cc: vision2020 at moscow.com
> Message-ID: <378080.7073.qm at web38106.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
> 
> Paul,
> ?
> Yes, I am a little fat green troll, living under your bed munching on the?deedle deedles you don't vacuum up. 
> ?
> Either that, or you just misunderstand what I am saying to you and are not focusing on the bigger issue here but?instead onBush's unjust war and the six murders. 
> ?
> My point is, societies that beat their woman, legalize rape of their woman, set woman on fire, and mass murder gays, should not be funded by the US, supported by the US, and the US should make serious efforts to stop the behavior, not?justify it, excuse it, and ignore it. 
> ?
> My second point is, that you are so opposed to any war, of any kind, at any time, in any place, that you would most likely even oppose war against Hitler, had you existed then. Bottom-line, I believe you think opposing war is ALWAYS the right thing. I think you are wrong. And I am proved correct by your inability to come up with a real or fictional scenario where you think war or military action is right. I believe you are confused to think there is never a situation that calls for military action or forceful action against another group of people. 
> ?
> Best Regards,
> ?
> Donovan
> ?
> 
> 
> --- On Mon, 4/6/09, Paul Rumelhart <godshatter at yahoo.com> wrote:
> 
> 
> From: Paul Rumelhart <godshatter at yahoo.com>
> Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Six gay men shot to death in Iraq
> To: "Donovan Arnold" <donovanjarnold2005 at yahoo.com>
> Cc: vision2020 at moscow.com
> Date: Monday, April 6, 2009, 6:09 PM
> 
> 
> You've somehow construed a desire to end a war we should never have 
> begun into defending the shooting of gays and women, the beheading of 
> them, the burning of them alive, and condoning the genocide of the Jews 
> in the Holocaust.
> 
> You're either so mentally off-balance that you will grasp for whatever 
> idea you can to save your ill-conceived position, or you are an expert 
> troll.? In either case: fuck you.
> 
> Paul
> 
> Donovan Arnold wrote:
> > Paul,
> >? 
> > That is only because you know it is true! Gays and woman can be shot, 
> > beheaded, and burned alive, and you defend those governments and 
> > societies and think we should send them money and support.
> >? 
> > What is the difference between what Nazis did to Jews, and what these 
> > men are doing to woman and gays?
> >? 
> > Best Regards,
> >? 
> > Donovan
> >
> > --- On *Sun, 4/5/09, Paul Rumelhart /<godshatter at yahoo.com>/* wrote:
> >
> >
> >? ???From: Paul Rumelhart <godshatter at yahoo.com>
> >? ???Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Six gay men shot to death in Iraq
> >? ???To: "Donovan Arnold" <donovanjarnold2005 at yahoo.com>
> >? ???Cc: vision2020 at moscow.com
> >? ???Date: Sunday, April 5, 2009, 7:44 PM
> >
> >? ???The only reasonable response to that, Donovan, is "f*ck you".
> >
> >? ???Paul
> >
> >? ???Donovan Arnold wrote:
> >? ???> Paul,
> >? ???>? I don't see the French, Italians, Japanese, and Indians setting
> >? ???fire to their woman and shooting gays legally do you?
> >? ???>? No doubt, if you had a voice in 1942 you would be defending
> >? ???German treatment of Jews.
> >? ???>? Best Regards,
> >? ???>? Donovan
> >? ???>
> >? ???> --- On *Sun, 4/5/09, Paul Rumelhart /<godshatter at yahoo.com
> >? ???<http://us.mc381.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=godshatter@yahoo.com>>/*
> >? ???wrote:
> >? ???>
> >? ???>
> >? ???>? ???From: Paul Rumelhart <godshatter at yahoo.com
> >? ???<http://us.mc381.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=godshatter@yahoo.com>>
> >? ???>? ???Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Six gay men shot to death in Iraq
> >? ???>? ???To: vision2020 at moscow.com
> >? ???<http://us.mc381.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=vision2020@moscow.com>,
> >? ???"Donovan Arnold"
> >? ???>? ???<donovanjarnold2005 at yahoo.com
> >? ???<http://us.mc381.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=donovanjarnold2005@yahoo.com>>
> >? ???>? ???Date: Sunday, April 5, 2009, 2:11 PM
> >? ???>
> >? ???>? ???Is this limited to Iraq, or should we declare war on everything
> >? ???>? ???that is non-American?
> >? ???>
> >? ???>? ???Paul
> >? ???>
> >? ???>? ???--- On *Sun, 4/5/09, Donovan Arnold
> >? ???>? ???/<donovanjarnold2005 at yahoo.com
> >? ???<http://us.mc381.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=donovanjarnold2005@yahoo.com>>/*
> >? ???wrote:
> >? ???>
> >? ???>
> >? ???>? ? ? ???From: Donovan Arnold <donovanjarnold2005 at yahoo.com
> >? ???<http://us.mc381.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=donovanjarnold2005@yahoo.com>>
> >? ???>? ? ? ???Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Six gay men shot to death in Iraq
> >? ???>? ? ? ???To: vision2020 at moscow.com
> >? ???<http://us.mc381.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=vision2020@moscow.com>,
> >? ???"Paul Rumelhart" <godshatter at yahoo.com
> >? ???<http://us.mc381.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=godshatter@yahoo.com>>
> >? ???>? ? ? ???Date: Sunday, April 5, 2009, 12:39 PM
> >? ???>
> >? ???>? ? ? ???Paul,
> >? ???>? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? As a straight male, I am sure it is easy for
> >? ???you to dismiss
> >? ???>? ? ? ???out of hand, the horrendous crimes against minorities and
> >? ???>? ? ? ???woman in these societies and ignorantly try to compare
> >? ???them to
> >? ???>? ? ? ???US standards, by suggesting I single handedly handle the
> >? ???>? ? ? ???situation if I don't like it.
> >? ???>? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? But, you don't know what it is like to live
> >? ???everyday of your
> >? ???>? ? ? ???life in total fear that someone is going to kill you,
> >? ???even or
> >? ???>? ? ? ???especially, a family member or husband, If you did, you
> >? ???would
> >? ???>? ? ? ???not be dismissing this so readily.
> >? ???>? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? People that defend this, and protect this,
> >? ???enable these people
> >? ???>? ? ? ???to do this, and are just as guilty as those that do it.
> >? ???>? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? Best Regards,
> >? ???>? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? Donovan
> >? ???>
> >? ???>? ? ? ???--- On *Sun, 4/5/09, Paul Rumelhart
> >? ???/<godshatter at yahoo.com
> >? ???<http://us.mc381.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=godshatter@yahoo.com>>/*
> >? ???>? ? ? ???wrote:
> >? ???>
> >? ???>
> >? ???>? ? ? ? ? ???From: Paul Rumelhart <godshatter at yahoo.com
> >? ???<http://us.mc381.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=godshatter@yahoo.com>>
> >? ???>? ? ? ? ? ???Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Six gay men shot to death
> >? ???in Iraq
> >? ???>? ? ? ? ? ???To: vision2020 at moscow.com
> >? ???<http://us.mc381.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=vision2020@moscow.com>,
> >? ???"Donovan Arnold"
> >? ???>? ? ? ? ? ???<donovanjarnold2005 at yahoo.com
> >? ???<http://us.mc381.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=donovanjarnold2005@yahoo.com>>
> >? ???>? ? ? ? ? ???Date: Sunday, April 5, 2009, 12:08 PM
> >? ???>
> >? ???>? ? ? ? ? ???George Bush grabbed a tiger by the tail, for no apparent
> >? ???>? ? ? ? ? ???reason, and now he's handed it off to us.? This isn't
> >? ???>? ? ? ? ? ???about "protecting their lifestyle".? It's about getting
> >? ???>? ? ? ? ? ???the hell out of there and leaving them to their own
> >? ???>? ? ? ? ? ???devices in as stable a way as possible.
> >? ???>? ? ? ? ? ???If it makes sense to you "wipe these societies out",
> >? ???then
> >? ???>? ? ? ? ? ???I'd suggest getting yourself a weapon and heading for
> >? ???>? ? ? ? ? ???Iraq.? Besides, it's not like no one has ever died
> >? ???in this
> >? ???>? ? ? ? ? ???country for the crime of being gay.
> >? ???>
> >? ???>? ? ? ? ? ???Paul
> >? ???>
> >? ???>? ? ? ? ? ???--- On *Sun, 4/5/09, Donovan Arnold
> >? ???>? ? ? ? ? ???/<donovanjarnold2005 at yahoo.com
> >? ???<http://us.mc381.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=donovanjarnold2005@yahoo.com>>/*
> >? ???wrote:
> >? ???>
> >? ???>
> >? ???>? ? ? ? ? ? ? ???From: Donovan Arnold
> >? ???<donovanjarnold2005 at yahoo.com
> >? ???<http://us.mc381.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=donovanjarnold2005@yahoo.com>>
> >? ???>? ? ? ? ? ? ? ???Subject: [Vision2020] Six gay men shot to death
> >? ???in Iraq
> >? ???>? ? ? ? ? ? ? ???To: vision2020 at moscow.com
> >? ???<http://us.mc381.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=vision2020@moscow.com>
> >? ???>? ? ? ? ? ? ? ???Date: Sunday, April 5, 2009, 11:56 AM
> >? ???>
> >? ???>? ? ? ? ? ? ? ???I want to know, from some of these liberals that
> >? ???want
> >? ???>? ? ? ? ? ? ? ???to protect the lifestyle of the Middle Eastern
> >? ???>? ? ? ? ? ? ? ???Nations, how you think these societies should be
> >? ???>? ? ? ? ? ? ? ???allowed to exist where people kill members of their
> >? ???>? ? ? ? ? ? ? ???own family, simply because of their sexual
> >? ???>? ? ? ? ? ? ? ???orientation. And not just kill them, but
> >? ???premeditated
> >? ???>? ? ? ? ? ? ? ???massacres.
> >? ???>? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? Afghanistan is voting on a bill
> >? ???that legalizes men to
> >? ???>? ? ? ? ? ? ? ???be able to rape their wives, and these are
> >? ???supposedly
> >? ???>? ? ? ? ? ? ? ???the "good people" in these societies.
> >? ???>? ? ? ? ? ? ? ???Pakistan's ruling Taliban set their women on
> >? ???fire for
> >? ???>? ? ? ? ? ? ? ???disobeying Muslim law, or their Husband. The Middle
> >? ???>? ? ? ? ? ? ? ???East forces woman to marry men they do not know,
> >? ???love,
> >? ???>? ? ? ? ? ? ? ???or even like.
> >? ???>? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? Doesn't it make since to wipe
> >? ???these societies out?
> >? ???>? ? ? ? ? ? ? ???Eliminate them while they are still small in
> >? ???size and
> >? ???>? ? ? ? ? ? ? ???limited in power? How many millennium must pass
> >? ???before
> >? ???>? ? ? ? ? ? ? ???woman, gays, lesbians, and those that are a
> >? ???>? ? ? ? ? ? ? ???little different stop being set on fire and shot
> >? ???>? ? ? ? ? ? ? ???before the world says, "ENOUGH! evolve already,
> >? ???of or
> >? ???>? ? ? ? ? ? ? ???we will destroy your Neanderthal cave man thinking
> >? ???>? ? ? ? ? ? ? ???society."?
> >? ???>? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ???*BAGHDAD, Iraq
> >? ???(CNN)* -- Six gay men were shot dead by
> >? ???>? ? ? ? ? ? ? ???members of their tribe in two separate incidents in
> >? ???>? ? ? ? ? ? ? ???the past 10 days, an official with Iraq's Interior
> >? ???>? ? ? ? ? ? ? ???ministry said.
> >? ???>? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ???
> >? ???http://www.cnn.com/2009/WORLD/meast/04/05/gay.deaths.iraq/index.html
> >? ???>
> >? ???>
> >? ???>
> >? ???>? ? ? ? ? ? ? ???-----Inline Attachment Follows-----
> >? ???>
> >? ???>? ? ? ? ? ???
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> >? ? ? ? =======================================================
> >? ???>
> >? ???>
> >? ???>? ? ? ? ? ???-----Inline Attachment Follows-----
> >? ???>
> >? ???>? ? ? ? ? ???=======================================================
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> >? ???>? ? ? ? ? ???=======================================================
> >? ???>
> >? ???>
> >? ???>
> >
> >
> >
> 
> 
> =======================================================
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