[Vision2020] Not here [was just sarcasm? no!
Paul Rumelhart
godshatter at yahoo.com
Thu May 15 18:27:50 PDT 2008
I think I read more into your response than was there. My apologies.
I just figure that it doesn't matter much if Donovan is one person, a
committee, multiple personalities, a hive mind, a front for a
corporation, a demon host, an AI, or a couple of local church members.
If he says something idiotic, it's still idiotic and if he makes a good
point it's still a good point. I'll just take everything at that level,
except that I have learned on the net to keep my eye out for a good
troll so I won't get suckered into responding. Too often, I fail that
particular test.
Paul
Joe Campbell wrote:
> Sorry, Paul! I didn't mean to suggest that you were taking a stance.
>
> It was the solving the riddle part of your last post to which I was responding.
> It is a logic thing. Pretty annoying, so I'm sorry -- especially for the tone
> (late night). And I do appreciate your last post!
>
> --
> Joe Campbell
>
> ---- Paul Rumelhart <godshatter at yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> =============
> I'm not taking a stance. I merely put that information out there so
> people who care one way or the other could use it or not.
>
> Paul
>
> Joe Campbell wrote:
>
>> Paul,
>>
>> Your post was made Wed May 14 21:05:17 PDT 2008. Earlier, Wed May 14
>> 18:53:08 PDT 2008, Donovan had already posted: “Yeah, since some of you
>> think I am 50 people using the same IP address.”
>>
>> I don't see much point in asking Donovan to "confirm" that he has "Cable
>> One as an internet provider." If you trust his response, why not just accept
>> that all of his posts come from the same IP address, as he already said?
>>
>> And what conclusions can we draw from this information? Well, not much. On
>> Mon May 12 06:16:56 PDT 2008 I posted the following to Donovan:
>>
>> “No one is saying that you've been kidnapped. And no one is saying that all
>> your posts are given by someone else. I think that either (a) some of your
>> posts come from another person or (b) the information for some of your
>> posts is sent to you and you simply cut and paste it and send it in.”
>>
>> Even if (a) is ruled out, (b) is still an option. And until we can find out what IP
>> address Donovan is posting from -- whether it is from his home, or a local
>> coffee shop, or a local college -- it isn't even clear that (a) is ruled out.
>>
>> I don't want to suggest that I've proven anything because I haven't. And
>> you're free to believe whatever you want. As for me, I find it hard to believe
>> that Donovan could have written the following, in response to my question
>> about whether or not someone who believed that gays deserved the death
>> penalty is a sick individual:
>>
>> “It depends on if they are speaking in religious figurative terms; For example,
>> all sinners deserve death, or if they really are advocating the murder of self
>> professed homosexuals. Obviously, anyone that is advocating the actual
>> murder of someone is not mentally balanced. Someone that says, "Sinners
>> deserve death" to illustrate none of us that offend God deserve life, I think is
>> just illustrating a religious/spiritual viewpoint.”
>>
>> I cannot imagine Donovan writing this. In fact, I don't know of a single
>> Catholic who would write something like this. Notice there is a deliberate
>> switch to talk about deserving death, but in fact my question is phrased about
>> deserving the death penalty. This is a very unusual answer to that question.
>>
>> I'm actually very afraid for Donovan since the individual that I suspect is
>> feeding him quotes is a sick individual in my book. I'd like to know the truth.
>>
>> --
>> Joe Campbell
>>
>> ---- Paul Rumelhart <godshatter at yahoo.com> wrote:
>>
>> =============
>> Joe Campbell wrote:
>>
>>
>>> Please read this and compare the writing style to the other posts, and notice
>>> the lack of contractions here. A very clumsy style here -- "There is a great
>>> deal of difference between someone being discriminated against because they
>>> are here taking a job, versus that of their race" -- versus the rather breezy
>>> style of the other postings.
>>>
>>> Again, if anyone -- other than Christovan -- thinks I'm wrong I'd like to here it.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>> I don't want to waste my mental resources (scarce as they sometimes are)
>> on psychoanalyzing Donovan's writing style, but I will point out that
>> you can get some idea who is posting from where by looking at the email
>> headers. If you have an email client that actually lets you see the
>> headers (many Microsoft clients won't let you), then you will see
>> something like this (taken from my copy of the email you are referencing):
>>
>> >From - Wed May 14 18:02:30 2008
>> X-Account-Key: account2
>> X-UIDL: AFpXv9EAAIFiSCtqMwShAxFHSk8
>> X-Mozilla-Status: 0011
>> X-Mozilla-Status2: 10000000
>> X-Mozilla-Keys:
>> X-Apparently-To: godshatter at yahoo.com via 209.191.87.90; Wed, 14 May 2008 15:39:47 -0700
>> X-Originating-IP: [64.126.132.9]
>> Authentication-Results: mta352.mail.re4.yahoo.com from=moscow.com; domainkeys=neutral (no sig)
>> Received: from 64.126.132.9 (EHLO trumpet.fsr.net) (64.126.132.9)
>> by mta352.mail.re4.yahoo.com with SMTP; Wed, 14 May 2008 15:39:45 -0700
>> Received: from trumpet.fsr.net (localhost [127.0.0.1])
>> by trumpet.fsr.net (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id m4EMcjUJ098020;
>> Wed, 14 May 2008 15:38:45 -0700 (PDT)
>> (envelope-from vision2020-bounces at moscow.com)
>> Received: from mail-gw.fsr.net (mail-gw.fsr.net [64.126.132.22])
>> by trumpet.fsr.net (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id m4EMciKU097901
>> for <vision2020 at lists.fsr.com>; Wed, 14 May 2008 15:38:44 -0700 (PDT)
>> (envelope-from owner-vision2020 at mail-gw.fsr.net)
>> Received: from psmtp.com (exprod5mx242.postini.com [64.18.0.162])
>> by mail-gw.fsr.net (8.13.1/8.12.3) with SMTP id m4EMct1v068083
>> for <vision2020 at firststepinternet.com>;
>> Wed, 14 May 2008 15:38:55 -0700 (PDT)
>> (envelope-from donovanjarnold2005 at yahoo.com)
>> Received: from source ([64.126.133.12]) (using TLSv1) by
>> exprod5mx242.postini.com ([64.18.4.10]) with SMTP;
>> Wed, 14 May 2008 18:38:50 EDT
>> Received: from psmtp.com (exprod5mx213.postini.com [64.18.0.72])
>> by mx4.fsr.net (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id m4EMcgnB016777
>> for <vision2020 at moscow.com>; Wed, 14 May 2008 15:38:43 -0700 (PDT)
>> (envelope-from donovanjarnold2005 at yahoo.com)
>> Received: from source ([209.191.124.134]) by exprod5mx213.postini.com
>> ([64.18.4.10]) with SMTP; Wed, 14 May 2008 17:38:49 CDT
>> Received: (qmail 21370 invoked by uid 60001); 14 May 2008 22:38:49 -0000
>> X-YMail-OSG: ZAPVG5kVM1lUEPrGYOzFp6EeN.G1LAvCqFayFRDftkoa41Vpy2XU9h1rhnJuLWs5JQ--
>> Received: from [72.24.91.109] by web38107.mail.mud.yahoo.com via HTTP;
>> Wed, 14 May 2008 15:38:49 PDT
>> Date: Wed, 14 May 2008 15:38:49 -0700 (PDT)
>> From: Donovan Arnold <donovanjarnold2005 at yahoo.com>
>> ....
>>
>>
>>
>> Don't let this cryptic stuff scare you. What you want to look for is
>> the "Received:" line farthest down the list, since they go in order from
>> receiver to sender as you go down the list. In this case, you see the
>> following:
>>
>>
>> Received: from [72.24.91.109] by web38107.mail.mud.yahoo.com via HTTP;
>> Wed, 14 May 2008 15:38:49 PDT
>>
>>
>>
>> The IP address should be the address Donovan is posting from
>> (72.24.91.109). The "via HTTP" part means he's connecting through the
>> web to yahoo's email client. I don't know if he posts from home, from
>> work, from a friends place, from his neighbor's wifi connection, or if
>> he's even the one using that account, but that IP address resolves to:
>>
>> Non-authoritative answer:
>> 109.91.24.72.in-addr.arpa name = 91-109.72-24-cpe.cableone.net.
>>
>> This is an IP owned by cableone.net, which appears to have connections
>> in the Lewiston area but not in Moscow (unless their web page is out of
>> date).
>>
>> I've spot-checked a few messages, and so far all I've seen originate
>> from this IP address.
>>
>> That address could be an endpoint of an onion routing network like tor,
>> but if that were the case I'd expect it to change frequently.
>>
>> Donovan, can you confirm that you have Cable One as an internet
>> provider? Not that it's any of our business, but it might help us solve
>> this "riddle".
>>
>> Paul
>>
>>
>>
>>
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