[Vision2020] William F Buckley Jr.

Fri Feb 29 17:32:31 PST 2008

Sunil et. al.

I recommend everyone see "Manufacturing Consent," and if you have seen it
before, watch it again.  Or better yet, read the book of the same title,
co-authored by Noam Chomsky and Edward S. Herman:

http://www.zeitgeistfilms.com/film.php?directoryname=manufacturingconsent

http://thirdworldtraveler.com/Herman%20/Manufac_Consent_Prop_Model.html

I don't think Buckley would have "smashed" Chomsky in the face even if
Chomsky had suddenly jumped up and down and went on a hysterical raging rant
against Nixon and his war crimes in Vietnam.  Most likely it was not meant
as a literal threat.  But it was a threat as it was worded, nonetheless,
though conditional upon Chomsky's future behavior.

What is a "direct threat?"  Or a "bald faced threat?" If I say, "Sunil, if
you get angry in my presence, I will smash you in the face," this seems
direct enough... Do you mean the threat must have no conditions upon it at
all?  The threat must state "I am going to smash you in the face, period."
Anyway, I understand what you mean, I think...

Ted Moffett
On Fri, Feb 29, 2008 at 1:28 PM, Sunil Ramalingam <
sunilramalingam at hotmail.com> wrote:

> Ted,
>
> I sent my post out after watching the clip showing that discussion.  I
> didn't mean 'whack' as in 'kill.'  Rather, I meant to say that Buckley
> didn't simply and unconditionally threaten to hit Chomsky in the face.
>
> Rather, it was a 'threat' conditioned upon Chomsky's possible loss of
> temper.  So I took Buckley to mean that should Chomsky lose his temper, then
> Buckley would hit him in the face.  I view that as different from a direct
> threat, and Chomsky didn't appear to take it as a direct threat, as he
> continued his discussion.  It's been a long time since I've seen
> 'Manufacturing Consent,' and I don't recall how Chomsky took the comment.
>
> Certainly my political views are far closer to Chomsky's than Buckley's,
> but I can't see this as a bald-faced threat.
>
> Sunil
>
>
>
>  ------------------------------
> Date: Fri, 29 Feb 2008 13:16:04 -0800
> From: starbliss at gmail.com
> To: sunilramalingam at hotmail.com
> Subject: Re: [Vision2020] William F Buckley Jr.
> CC: vision2020 at moscow.com
>
>
> Sunil et. al.
>
> In Chomsky's film "Manufacturing Consent," after showing a court case
> document "United States Of America vs. Noam Chomsky" dealing with Chomsky's
> arrest for protest over the Vietnam War at the Pentagon ("front mall,"
> "refused to move," the court document indicates), which is followed by copy
> from the New York Times, June 27, 1973, shown listing Chomsky on a White
> House "enemies list," at 51:12 into the film, there is footage from
> Buckley's "Firing Line" from 1969:
>
> Firing Line, 1969
>
> Chomsky, in reference to the Vietnam War:
>
> Sometimes I lose my temper.  Maybe not tonight.
>
> Buckley:
>
> Maybe not tonight.  Because if you would, I'd smash you in the G*d d**ned
> face.
>
> This exchange elicited low keyed laughter from both of them.
>
> Buckley's words were clear.  He threatened to smash Chomsky in the face,
> even if this was not meant literally.  No one said Buckley said "I'm gonna
> whack you," which, according my understanding of this slang phrase, means
> kill someone.
>
> Ted Moffett
>
> On 2/28/08, *Sunil Ramalingam* <sunilramalingam at hotmail.com> wrote:
>
> Well, I don't know if I'd say he threatened to punch Chomsky in the face.
> He said he would if Chomskey lost his temper, but it wasn't a 'I'm gonna
> whack you ' by any means.  At least not in that exerpt.
>
> Sunil
>
> > To: lfalen at turbonet.com; starbliss at gmail.com; chasuk at gmail.com;
> vision2020 at moscow.com
> > From: thansen at moscow.com
> > Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2008 23:27:54 +0000
> > Subject: Re: [Vision2020] William F Buckley Jr.
> >
> > Buckley threatens to punch Chomsky in the face
> > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PEIrZO069Kg
> >
> > Seeya round town, Moscow.
> >
> > Tom Hansen
> > Moscow, Idaho
> >
> > > Ted
> > > I hadn't heard that about Chomskey. He did threaten to punch Gore
> > Vidal, after Vidal
> > called hiim a Nazzi. He imediatly regreted it.
> > > Roger
> > > -----Original message-----
> > > From: "Ted Moffett" starbliss at gmail.com
> > > Date: Wed, 27 Feb 2008 14:21:46 -0800
> > > To: Chasuk chasuk at gmail.com
> > > Subject: Re: [Vision2020] William F Buckley Jr.
> > >
> > > > William F. Buckley once threatened to punch Noam Chomsky in the face
> on
> > > > "Firing Line" when Chomsky appeared as a guest. This is shown in
> > Chomsky's
> > > > film, "Manufacturing Consent."
> > > >
> > > > Having said that, I miss "Firing Line," and I respected Buckley's
> > principled
> > > > and eloquent conservatism. He publicly stated that the Iraq War was
> a
> > > > failed policy, and opposed the war on drugs. Many think these
> > positions are
> > > > "left wing." Yet I think that both the Iraq War and the war on drugs
> > > > promote a "liberal" big government/big spending approach, that
> should
> > > > inspire intense skepticism from anyone who advocates a general
> policy
> > that
> > > > big government intrusive tax payer burdening solutions to problems
> are
> > to be
> > > > avoided if possible.
> > > >
> > > > I'm surprised by how many so called conservatives continue to insist
>
> > that
> > > > the invasion of Iraq was not a mistake, as the costs of the Iraq
> > occupation
> > > > climb hundreds of billions upon hundreds of billions of dollars, and
>
> > world
> > > > wide terrorism continues, in part inspired by hatred of the USA,
> > > > for occupying Islamic nations.
> > > >
> > > > William F. Buckley writing on the Iraq War at URL below:
> > > >
> > > > http://www.nationalreview.com/buckley/buckley200602241451.asp
> > > >
> > > > CIA Bin Laden analyst Michael Scheuer on YouTube regarding Ron
> Paul's
> > wise
> > > > foreign policy views on the war on terror:
> > > >
> > > > CIA Michael Scheuer Binladin Expert: Only Ron Paul Gets It
> > > >
> > > > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jOqXdbe7CVM
> > > >
> > > > ------------------------
> > > > Vision2020 Post: Ted Moffett
> > > >
> > > > On 2/27/08, Chasuk <chasuk at gmail.com> wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > On Wed, Feb 27, 2008 at 11:13 AM, lfalen <lfalen at turbonet.com>
> wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > > Flags should be flown at half mast today. William F. Buckley
> died
> > this
> > > > > morning at 82.
> > > > >
> > > > > I love William F. Buckley, but do you really think that he is such
> an
> > > > > American icon that he merits flags at half-mast?
> > > > >
> > > > > I wonder, is there any official, designating criterion for this
> > honor?
> > > > >
>
>
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