[Vision2020] Health Care

Saundra Lund sslund_2007 at verizon.net
Thu Apr 17 13:41:57 PDT 2008

I'm wondering if anyone cares to share any comments about Frontline's "Sick
Around the World"?  For those interested but who perhaps missed the show,
you can watch it online at:



I'll start out by stirring the pot a bit  J


After watching the show and looking into things further, I'm personally
convinced that neither Clinton's nor Obama's health care proposals are
adequate, but I'm far more supportive of Clinton's plan than Obama's.
Affordable universal health care coverage (considered a basic human right
even in Switzerland) mandates that all actually have coverage, something
Obama's plan neglects.


Health care is likely to be a litmus test of sorts for me between two very
similar (IMHO) candidates in the upcoming election because we're long
overdue to address the unconscionable and deplorable state of health care
access and affordability in this country.



Saundra Lund

Moscow, ID


The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good people to do

~ Edmund Burke


***** Original material contained herein is Copyright 2008 through life plus
70 years, Saundra Lund.  Do not copy, forward, excerpt, or reproduce outside
the Vision 2020 forum without the express written permission of the


From: Ted Moffett [mailto:starbliss at gmail.com] 
Sent: Tuesday, April 15, 2008 2:05 AM
To: Chasuk
Cc: Saundra Lund; vision2020
Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Health Care


There is no "bias" in these facts:




>From the URL above:


The World Health Organization has carried out the first ever analysis of the
world's health systems. Using five performance indicators to measure health
systems in 191 member states, it finds that France provides the best overall
health care followed among major countries by Italy, Spain, Oman, Austria
and Japan.


The U.S. health system spends a higher portion of its gross domestic product
than any other country but ranks 37 out of 191 countries according to its
performance, the report finds. 



Now why is this the case?  Some defend the US health care system with
private HMOs as a high efficiency model, but how can nations with more
socialized health care offer better overall performance with less money?  


So now the rubber meets the road on this issue, the political/economic
biases regarding the private vs. public sector.  The ominous specter of
"socialized medicine" rises from the horizon.  But of course the
multi-hundred billion dollar socialized taxpayer funded military industrial
complex in the USA is benign... Don't worry about wasteful spending, undue
control over government via lobbyists, or being dragged into cruel and
wasteful wars to feed that beast... No, we need to be very worried that
universal health care will undermine the very fabric of our society.  We
need tanks, jets, bombers, missiles, and aircraft carriers, not doctors to
treat children with no health insurance.  That's their parents fault, if
they can't afford a doctor or comprehensive health insurance coverage, after


Anyway, I might just have an opinion on this issue, but I'm holding back to
keep the dialog from being too heated...  


I think the data showing that some nations with more socialized medicine
offer better overall health care than the USA, requires some deft fact
sifting and shifting to get around.  If you are among the rich, no doubt you
can buy the best health care in the world in the USA.  If you are middle or
lower class, good luck!  


Ted Moffett


4/15/08, Chasuk <chasuk at gmail.com> wrote:


Thanks, Saundra.  I'll take a look at it.

I'm a big fan of PBS and NPR (some might say tat this is because their
biases match mine), so I'm sure it will be interesting.


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