[Vision2020] [Bulk] Re: School Levy Unfair to Poorer Students

Paul Rumelhart godshatter at yahoo.com
Sun Nov 11 23:01:52 PST 2007


Donovan,

Some thoughts:

According to the pamphlet some nice person handed me today, the levy 
will increase property taxes by approximately $1.18 per $1000 of taxable 
net property value.  Thus, the wealthy are getting taxed more than the 
non-wealthy.

Also, it doesn't seem too odd to me that a larger percentage of the 
students in the alternative school are poorer, since one of the reasons 
for having the alternative school is to provide a way for students who 
have to work to stay in school.

I don't see what the ethnicity of the students matters in this case.

The fact that the children are successful because of a crime free well 
adjusted community that is well educated is in large part a result of 
previous funding of education in this community.  Breaking the chain 
will not help things.

Paul

Donovan Arnold wrote:
> "Look.  I've tried reason, rational thinking, and facts.  I don't like 
> to use sarcasm against people.  But to suggest that the only troubled 
> kids in MSD are at the alt school, and that the funding allocations 
> are evidence for a conspiracy against non-college bound students, is 
> absurd.  And, frankly, as close-minded as it is hard-hearted."--Keely Mix
>  
> Who suggested this? You jump to conclusions too often Keely.
>  
> Moscow children are generally successful not because of the cash we 
> spend on them, but because they enjoy a crime free well adjusted 
> community with wealthy parents that are also well educated.
>  
> I am simply stating the FACTS that MSD better funds academic programs 
> than vocational students, and the fact that alternative students 
> are also more likely to be poor and minorities.
>  
> 50% of students in alternative school are poor. Where as only 17% 
> of students at MHS are poor. That is fact.
>  
> Who do you think will be most impacted by an increase in taxes? The 
> poor families of alternative students, or the kids with wealthier 
> parents?
>  
> If poorer students and students that need alternative programs are 
> more negatively impacted by the tax increased, shouldn't they get a 
> promise from the school district for at least equal aid from the levy?
>  
> Debi S. asked, "how does the Alt school, as part of Moscow school 
> district, benefit if the levy fails?"
>  
> They get to keep the money they earned. And what benefit do they get 
> if the levy succeeds, very little, or less than they give.
>  
> Now, if MSD promised to fund alternative programs for students to 
> succeed, it would be in their interest to support the levy.
>  
> To paraphrase Debi, you ask, "How does it benefit poor students to pay 
> higher taxes to support the programs for the wealthier kids?"
>  
> Best,
>  
> Donovan
>  
>
>
> */keely emerinemix <kjajmix1 at msn.com>/* wrote:
>
>     The thing is, Debi, I'm afraid Donovan has stumbled across the
>     most phenomenally amazing secret in the MSD locker. 
>
>     Yes, it's true.  All of the students at Moscow High School (as
>     well as the junior high and the four elementaries, which he didn't
>     include in his argument) are doing, and will do, spectacularly
>     well in life.  Born -- every single one of 'em -- into the
>     nurturing wombs of loving families with abundant finances and
>     generous exposure to art and culture, Moscow kids are so utterly
>     privileged that only a small -- nay, insignificant -- fraction are
>     ensconced in the last-ditch environs of the alt school.  To a one,
>     every single other student is well-adjusted, ambitious, infinitely
>     able to choose from the best of life's offerings, and
>     irretrievably on a path gilded with nothing but ease and success. 
>     Not a one of 'em, bless their little hearts, needs a thing from
>     any one of us.  And thank God!  This bleeding-heart hooey about
>     schoolchildren and schools dealing with the effects of drugs,
>     broken homes, poverty, domestic violence and emotional famine, not
>     to mention the draconian implementation of NCLB, legislative
>     disregard for education, and unstable school financing, is just a
>     smokescreen for the unbridled greed of those who choose to begin
>     their professional careers in a field that pays, at the beginning,
>     less than $30,000 a year.  I mean, they're in it for the money,
>     obviously -- it's not like the public schools benefit any of us in
>     any way, and it's not like there are any other, more lucrative,
>     careers.
>
>     Sigh.
>
>     Look.  I've tried reason, rational thinking, and facts.  I don't
>     like to use sarcasm against people.  But to suggest that the only
>     troubled kids in MSD are at the alt school, and that the funding
>     allocations are evidence for a conspiracy against non-college
>     bound students, is absurd.  And, frankly, as close-minded as it is
>     hard-hearted.  Every student, period, without exception, deserves
>     the very best the schools and community can offer.   I have a
>     college degree.  I have a son in college.  My husband did not go
>     to college, not a single day.  And yet it's his success in
>     business, not to mention his intrinsic smarts, that allows me (by
>     the grace of God) to spend hours a day not working, but writing
>     things like this.  Denying necessary funding to the schools is not
>     the way to advocate for one child, much less a category of student
>     -- as if students could be neatly pegged into categories anyway. 
>
>     This involves people.  Real children.  And the passage of this
>     levy is necessary.  I'll be writing more on "God's will" in regard
>     to levy votes as a counter to Wilson's claiming divine
>     affirmation, if not reward, in the result of last week's and this
>     week's elections.  For now, suffice to say that while school
>     levies are an imperfect method of providing for "least among you"
>     between 5 and 21, it's the best way we have now, and I believe
>     that Moscow is the kind of place that will vote again for its own
>     children.
>
>     keely
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>         ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>         From: debismith at moscow.com
>         To: donovanjarnold2005 at yahoo.com; areaman at moscow.com;
>         vision2020 at moscow.com
>         Date: Sun, 11 Nov 2007 20:33:33 -0800
>         Subject: Re: [Vision2020] School Levy Unfair to Poorer Students
>
>         So, Donovan, how does the Alt school, as part of Moscow school
>         district, benefit if the levy fails?
>         Enlighten please?
>         Debi R-S
>
>             ----- Original Message -----
>             *From:* Donovan Arnold <mailto:donovanjarnold2005 at yahoo.com>
>             *To:* Dan Carscallen <mailto:areaman at moscow.com> ;
>             vision2020 at moscow.com <mailto:vision2020 at moscow.com>
>             *Sent:* Sunday, November 11, 2007 6:28 PM
>             *Subject:* Re: [Vision2020] School Levy Unfair to Poorer
>             Students
>
>             I don't believe I said it wasn't. The question is why is
>             the money we give to MSD not divided to give all children
>             an equal shake?
>              
>             Best,
>              
>             Donovan
>
>             */Dan Carscallen <areaman at moscow.com
>             <mailto:areaman at moscow.com>>/* wrote:
>
>                 Paradise Creek Alt school is part of the Moscow School
>                 District, last time I heard.
>                  
>                 DC
>                  
>                 -----Original Message-----
>                 *From:* vision2020-bounces at moscow.com
>                 <mailto:vision2020-bounces at moscow.com>
>                 [mailto:vision2020-bounces at moscow.com] *On Behalf Of
>                 *Donovan Arnold
>                 *Sent:* Sunday, November 11, 2007 5:38 PM
>                 *To:* vision2020 at moscow.com
>                 *Subject:* [Vision2020] School Levy Unfair to Poorer
>                 Students
>                  
>                 I believe that the current school levy funding
>                 ignoring vocational students needs is highly
>                 discriminatory. If you don't agree me, perhaps these
>                 statistics will change your mind.
>                  
>                 Who in your opinion needs more support from the
>                 community?:
>                  
>
>
>                   *Paradise Creek Regional Alt School*
>
>                 Rank #102
>                 Total Students(2005 - 2006*): 32
>                 Fulltime teachers: 1.5
>                 Student/Teacher Ratio: 21.3
>                 Eligible for discounted/free lunch: 16 ( 50 %)
>                  
>                 Am. Indian/Alaska Native: 1 ( 3 %)
>                 Asian/Pacific Islander: 0 ( 0 %)
>                 Hispanic: 2 ( 6 %)
>                 African American: 1 ( 3 %)
>                 White: 28 ( 88 %)
>                 Unspecified: 0 ( 0 %)
>                 OR
>
>
>                   *Moscow Senior High School*
>
>                 Ranks 11th in state
>                  
>                 Total Students(2005 - 2006*): 603
>                 Fulltime teachers: 34.5
>                 Student/Teacher Ratio: 17.5
>                 Eligible for discounted/free lunch: 102 ( 17 %)
>                  
>                 Am. Indian/Alaska Native: 10 ( 2 %)
>                 Asian/Pacific Islander: 16 ( 3 %)
>                 Hispanic: 18 ( 3 %)
>                 African American: 10 ( 2 %)
>                 White: 549 ( 91 %)
>                 Unspecified: 0 ( 0 %)
>                  
>                 It seems like it is a common pattern to better fund
>                 those with the greatest advantage to began with. Why
>                 is it too much to ask that the MSD promise to allocate
>                 more funding so the kids that cannot afford lunch get
>                 the same opportunities in a public education system as
>                 kids that can afford to buy lunch everyday?
>                  
>                 Best,
>                  
>                 Donovan
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