[Vision2020] The maladjusted and those who enable them...
Tony
tonytime at clearwire.net
Sun Mar 18 20:40:48 PDT 2007
Debirs, actually I DO get it frequently enough, which is most likely untrue
for a nasty and hostile harpy like you. Rest assured, no amount of pleading
on your part could induce me to pay your type any attention at all. This
pathetic notion of yours that woman "supply" sexual gratification is sad and
outdated. You are the one living in the past, as these days satisfaction is
a two way street.
And you don't have a freaking clue as to the nature of the woman I know.
They are hardly the insecure little dough-heads you label them. Fact is,
I'd put their intelligence up against yours any day. Judging from the
quality of your contributions to this forum, you'd come in last place.
Now go unbelt your strap-on and leave me alone.
Hugs and kisses,
-Tony
----- Original Message -----
From: <debismith at moscow.com>
To: "Tony" <tonytime at clearwire.net>; <vision2020 at moscow.com>
Cc: <vision2020 at moscow.com>
Sent: Friday, March 18, 2011 6:53 PM
Subject: Re: [Vision2020] The maladjusted and those who enable them...
> Well, ToeKnee still just doesn't get it. Sorry, Dude, but a "you have what
> I want, and I have to
> plead to get it" is just old hat. Men and women may be different in the
> ways they approach
> and resolve things, but the idea that women are the ones who feed the
> masses, care for the
> kids, and supply the sexual needs is way outdated. It has no bearing on
> the current reality for
> most families or relationships.
>
> ToeKnee, however much he has experienced with women (those insecure ones
> who will have
> him and his BS) , is woefully underprepared for the reality of the
> present. The majority of the
> women with whom I have contact would discard ToeKnee in a flash. Several
> would consider
> him---he professes to be a good provider---but would discard him based on
> his posting here
> about his prowess and the role of women in his life. Too mcuh about his
> sexual
> neediness.They are not looking for blowhards or bragardts. Even the women
> who want a care-
> taker want someone with sanity...Both men and women are interested in
> people who are
> interesting. Foilks like ToeKnee, a one-trick-pony, are not interesting.
> They are just
> exhaustingling dull. He may be good in bed, and lots of folks are, but if
> there is nothing
> interesting to talk about before and after, it's just complicated
> masturbation. ToeKnee may be
> really good at this, but most Women are little more
> discriminating.....perhaps his own
> masturbatory fantasies are enough for him. I'm sure that that would be the
> case for any woman
> faced with a choice betweeen ToeKnee and her own imagination....
>
> Debi R-S.From:
>
>
> "Tony" <tonytime at clearwire.net>
> To: "J Ford" <privatejf32 at hotmail.com>
> Date sent: Sun, 18 Mar 2007 15:00:30 -0700
> Copies to: vision2020 at moscow.com
> Subject: Re: [Vision2020] The maladjusted and those who enable
> them...
>
> [ Double-click this line for list subscription options ]
>
> Thoughtful and cordial post, J.
>
> Thanks.
>
> By "confidence with woman," I mean to describe a man who knows what
> makes them tick. Who understands that while they of course wish and
> deserve to be treated as equals with men, this does not mean denying
> their obvious and glorious femininity. They in most cases like to be
> treated as human beings; no double entendre's and creepy stares, but
> opened doors, genuine interest and attention, thorough grooming and a
> non-threatening but still sexually charged interaction.
>
> Men and woman are BOTH attracted to confidence. And as for a woman, I
> see no reason why childrearing and housekeeping would preclude
> confidence. Take care of a couple toddlers sometime! It will require
> confidence, determination and guts.
>
> Ands that's AFTER a valium.
>
> Just kidding J.
>
> Guess what I'm getting at is that we are both hard wired through many
> millennia to be attracted to one another. Why allow all this
> politically correct, feminist bullshit to get in the way of a good
> time?
>
> J, you woman have always been aloof and in control. Always capable
> with the proper approach, of have us salivating and begging for a
> scrap. We men are all dogs anyway J, but when you get to know us you
> will enjoy teaching us tricks.
>
> Woof!
>
> -Tony
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "J Ford" <privatejf32 at hotmail.com>
> To: <vision2020 at moscow.com>
> Sent: Saturday, March 17, 2007 7:41 PM
> Subject: Re: [Vision2020] The maladjusted and those who enable them...
>
>
>>
>> No offense meant, but "attractiveness" in a male OR female involves
>> more than just the outside appearances. The INSIDE appearances also
>> need to be good looking. What I mean by that is that the person's
>> attitude, demeanor, helpfulness to the family and community, etc.
>> has to all be considered when you look at a person and say they are
>> attractive or not. Anyone can put on enough outside garb to make
>> their bodies look good (to each their own on that one.) but if the
>> insides (the mental and emotional sides) are messed up, no amount of
>> make-up or fashionable (?) clothing or shoes as well as well-quaffed
>> hair will make a person "attractive". IMHO, of course.
>>
>> I am NOT sure what you mean by "confidence with women" - is that
>> like Doug F or Doug W or Tony S who think the only thing a women is
>> good for is popping out babies, being sub-servant and homebodies -
>> of that, they are confident?
>>
>> Or do you mean that they (the men) have confidence in themselves
>> enough to talk and treat a women like an equal, yet still retain
>> their (the men's) manliness (whatever the hell that means)?
>>
>>
>>
>> J :]
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>>From: "Tony" <tonytime at clearwire.net>
>>>To: "Art Deco" <deco at moscow.com>
>>>CC: vision2020 at moscow.com
>>>Subject: Re: [Vision2020] The maladjusted and those who enable
>>>them... Date: Sat, 17 Mar 2007 07:37:54 -0700
>>>
>>>Wayner, did it ever cross your mind that perhaps Dale was simply
>>>acknowledging reality with his use of the moniker "studly?" As an
>>>experienced and confident male, I am amused by your pathetic
>>>conclusion that all men who possess the confidence with woman that
>>>you evidently lack, are automatically in the closet. Woman are
>>>attracted to confident, masculine men, Wayner. Do you fall, well,
>>>short?
>>>
>>>Don't make reflexive assumptions about your betters pal.
>>>
>>>Now go do the dishes.
>>>
>>>-TONY
>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>> From: Art Deco
>>> To: Vision 2020
>>> Sent: Friday, March 16, 2007 1:15 PM
>>> Subject: Re: [Vision2020] The maladjusted and those who enable
>>> them...
>>>
>>>
>>> Gary,
>>>
>>> A few short points, but don't take the first one too seriously or
>>> at
>>> all
>>>personally:
>>>
>>> 1. "... sometimes a cigar is merely a cigar." Hmmm. I
>>> wonder
>>> what
>>>Freud or Rorschach would say about the choice of this particular
>>>aphorism in the context of this discussion.
>>>
>>> 2. For your consideration, excepted from
>>>http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ted_Haggard:
>>>
>>> Ted Arthur Haggard (born June 27, 1956) is a former American
>>> evangelical
>>>preacher. Known as Pastor Ted to the congregations he has served, he
>>>is the founder and former pastor of the New Life Church in Colorado
>>>Springs, Colorado; a founder of the Association of Life-Giving
>>>Churches; and was leader of the National Association of Evangelicals
>>>from 2003[1] until November 2006.
>>>
>>> In November 2006, he resigned or was removed from all of his
>>> leadership
>>>positions after allegations of homosexual sex and drug abuse were
>>>made by Mike Jones, a former male prostitute. Initially Haggard
>>>denied even knowing Mike Jones, but as a media investigation
>>>proceeded he acknowledged that some allegations, such as his
>>>purchase of methamphetamine, were true. He later added "sexual
>>>immorality" to his list of confessions.[2]
>>>
>>> ...
>>>
>>> Haggard has condemned "homosexual activity.â? In the documentary
>>> Jesus
>>>Camp, one scene shows a sermon where he preaches, "we don't have to
>>>debate about what we should think about homosexual activity. Itâ?Ts
>>>written in the Bible."[18] Although Haggard opposes same-sex
>>>marriage, he has suggested that there should be civil unions for
>>>homosexual couples.[19]
>>>
>>> Under Haggard's leadership, the NAE released "For the Health of
>>> the
>>>Nation: An Evangelical Call to Civic Responsibility" in the fall of
>>>2004,[20] "a document urging engagement in traditional culture war
>>>issues such as abortion and gay marriage but also poverty,
>>>education, taxes, welfare and immigration."[20] The NAE has stated
>>>that "homosexual activity, like adulterous relationships, is clearly
>>>conÂdemned in the Scriptures."[21]
>>>
>>> Haggard is only one of many religious and political figures,
>>> mostly
>>>Republican (for example, Spokane's last mayor), who condemned
>>>homosexuality
>>>but were discovered to be active, if not ravenous practitioners of
>>>such. Clear cases of reaction formation.
>>>
>>> To the point: Did not Haggard exhibit the signs of reaction
>>> formation
>>>discussed in my post that you so kindly commented upon? Did not
>>>Haggard's own admissions about his feelings and behaviors reveal the
>>>truth? How are the signs shown by Tony, Farris, Cultmaster Douglas
>>>Wilson, etc, all who rabidly proclaim the same homophobia any
>>>different from the pre-exposure signs which Haggard and his fellow
>>>hypocrites exhibited?
>>>
>>> When someone salivates, obsesses, and loudly harangues over some
>>> other
>>>adults' private sexual behavior with other adults, it argues that
>>>the salivator is having some real problems themselves. Further, one
>>>would expect a libertarian to roundly condemn such egregious,
>>>pathological forays into matters of personal choice and freedom.
>>>
>>> 3. If you or anybody want to debate the morality of
>>> homosexuality,
>>>then I, and probably a lot others on this list-serve, are completely
>>>willing to do so on the basis of observation and reason, but not on
>>>the basis of unverifiable religious superstition.
>>>
>>> 4. You write:
>>>
>>> "Does the fact that you are so vehemently opposed to any type of
>>>religious doctrine mean that you harbor messianic tendencies?"
>>>
>>> False assumption. I am vehemently opposed to superstition of all
>>> kinds
>>>including religious superstition and belief in the supernatural as a
>>>basis upon which to make moral, social, or political decisions.
>>>However, many religious ethical dicta (though not in such unyielding
>>>firmness and specificity) can be supported by
>>>non-superstitious/non-supernatural observations and reasons in many
>>>cases.
>>>
>>> For your libertarian enjoyment, perhaps you might read The
>>> Leviathan
>>>http://oregonstate.edu/instruct/phl302/texts/hobbes/leviathan-conten
>>>ts.html, by Thomas Hobbes who was basically a nonbeliever (and the
>>>founder of modern libertarianism), as an example of a purely secular
>>>defense/explanation of many western moral beliefs. As a further
>>>example, there is a lot of empirical validity to Buddha's
>>>description of daily human life -- a description which led him to
>>>propose an ethic similar to the Greek Stoics (another group
>>>containing nonbelievers/anti-superstitionists). [There is a
>>>continuing debate over whether Buddha himself was a believer in the
>>>modern sense of the term.]
>>>
>>> Since your premise was false, there is no need to discuss your
>>>conclusion. Nice try though.
>>>
>>> 5. Speaking of reaction formation: What would think of a
>>>hypothetical man's sexual identity and masculinity issues, a man who
>>>would not only rabidly espouse homophobia, but would resort to an
>>>utterly ridiculous comb-over, and who would make himself the
>>>laughing-stock of some of his hypothetical GPS caching group by
>>>hypothetically naming himself "Studly" in the group? Does this not
>>>remind you of the braggarts about their sexual exploits and
>>>fertility whose wives and girlfriends frequently leave them for poor
>>>or non-performance, or compensate for their lack of sexual prowess
>>>by having affairs with others more skilled or take up needlepoint?
>>>Or which braggarts secretly share Haggard's desires more strongly
>>>than their heterosexual desires?
>>>
>>> Your humble servant,
>>>
>>>
>>> Art Deco (Wayne A. Fox)
>>> deco at moscow.com
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>> From: g. crabtree
>>> To: Art Deco ; Vision 2020
>>> Sent: Friday, March 16, 2007 11:42 AM
>>> Subject: Re: [Vision2020] The maladjusted and those who enable
>>> them...
>>>
>>>
>>> Wayne,
>>> Psycho babble aside, sometimes a cigar is merely a cigar. you
>>> are so
>>>vehemently opposed to any type of religious doctrine mean that you
>>>harbor messianic tendencies? It would explain quite a lot about how
>>>you deal with anyone who might dare to disagree with your exalted
>>>point of view and multi color pronouncements.
>>>
>>> g
>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>> From: Art Deco
>>> To: Vision 2020
>>> Sent: Friday, March 16, 2007 9:29 AM
>>> Subject: Re: [Vision2020] The maladjusted and those who enable
>>> them...
>>>
>>>
>>> Tony,
>>>
>>> reaction formation (plural reaction formations): In
>>> psychoanalysis,
>>>a defense mechanism in which somebody condemns something that has a
>>>strong, driving unconscious appeal.
>>>
>>>
>>> reaction formation is a defense mechanism in which
>>> anxiety-producing
>>>or unacceptable emotions are replaced by their direct opposites.
>>>This mechanism is often characteristic of obsessional neuroses. When
>>>this mechanism is overused, especially during the formation of the
>>>ego, it can become a permanent character trait. This is often in
>>>those with obsessional character and obsessive personality
>>>disorders. This does not imply that its periodic usage is always
>>>obsessional, but that it can lead to obsessional behavior. Example:
>>> A man who is overly aroused by pornographic material who utilizes
>>>reaction formation may take on an attitude of criticism toward the
>>>topic.
>>>
>>>
>>> REACTION-FORMATION : The blocking of desire by its opposite.
>>>"Reaction-formation" is the term Freud uses to describe the
>>>mechanism whereby the ego reacts to the impulses of the id by
>>>creating an antithetical formation that blocks repressed cathexes.
>>>For example, someone who feels homosexual desire might repress that
>>>desire by turning it into hatred for all homosexuals.
>>>
>>>
>>> Perhaps you and Farris might confront and thus deal directly
>>> with
>>> your
>>>personal demons discretely in private, rather than so obviously
>>>exhibiting them in public. I am sure that everyone would benefit,
>>>especially you and Farris: both your stultifying repressions and
>>>secret frustrations could be at least partially deadened. And after
>>>you have relived your tensions, perhaps you might be able to pass on
>>>your personal experiences with the cure and your newly found
>>>contacts to Cultmaster Douglas Wilson and his apparent secret
>>>admirer Douglas Jones, both who appear to need such therapy quite
>>>badly.
>>>
>>> Your internally inconsistent post also reveals the grave doubts
>>> you
>>>have about your masculinity and sexual identity when you have to
>>>resort to posting outright lies. For example:
>>>
>>> "Saundra's determination to avoid reality by choosing to doubt
>>> what
>>>has by now become commonplace, rather than investigate, is
>>>disappointing if not surprising."
>>>
>>>
>>> Included in this thread is a post by Saundra giving the URL to
>>> the
>>>story from the Chicago Tribune which casts a very different light on
>>>the story posted originally by the salivating, non-critical Farris.
>>>Saundra investigated; you did not. It is one thing for you and the
>>>gullible, narrow-witted Farris to delude yourselves thinking you are
>>>agent provocateurs, but, in reality, quite another to so clearly
>>>exhibit yourselves as sexually frustrated liars.
>>>
>>> Art Deco (Wayne A. Fox)
>>> deco at moscow.com
>>>
>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>> From: "Tony" <tonytime at clearwire.net>
>>> To: "Art Deco" <deco at moscow.com>
>>> Cc: <vision2020 at moscow.com>
>>> Sent: Friday, March 16, 2007 8:21 AM
>>> Subject: Re: [Vision2020] The maladjusted and those who enable
>>> them...
>>>
>>>
>>> > Wow Doug, you really flushed out the extremist, sodomite
>>> > activists
>>>with your
>>> > entirely reasonable and justified outrage over the public
>>> > school's
>>>abhorrent
>>> > support for inappropriate, dirty and unhealthy behaviors.
>>> Saundra's
>>> > determination to avoid reality by choosing to doubt what has
>>> > by now
>>>become
>>> > commonplace, rather than investigate, is disappointing if not
>>>surprising.
>>> >
>>> > And how about Wayne's complete refusal to address your
>>> > message in
>>>favor of a
>>> > masturbatory fit of name calling? You know you have hit upon
>>> > the
>>>truth in a
>>> > persuasive manner when these folks, who seem determined to
>>> > defend
>>>the
>>> > indefensible, respond in a childlike snit.
>>> >
>>> > Keep up the good work partner.
>>> >
>>> > Best, -Tony
>>> > ----- Original Message -----
>>> > From: "Art Deco" <deco at moscow.com>
>>> > To: "Vision 2020" <vision2020 at moscow.com>
>>> > Sent: Friday, March 16, 2007 7:25 AM
>>> > Subject: Re: [Vision2020] And you all say that we have a
>>> > political
>>>agenda?!
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >> Replaying:
>>> >>
>>> >> This kind of right wing/religious bullshit is what happens
>>> >> when
>>>misguided,
>>> >> stupid, and/or tyrannical people depend on superstition for
>>> >> their
>>>moral
>>> >> beliefs rather than observation and reasoning.
>>> >>
>>> >> W.
>>> >> ----- Original Message -----
>>> >> From: "Sue Hovey" <suehovey at moscow.com>
>>> >> To: "Saundra Lund" <sslund at roadrunner.com>;
>>> <vision2020 at moscow.com>
>>> >> Sent: Thursday, March 15, 2007 6:31 PM
>>> >> Subject: Re: [Vision2020] And you all say that we have a
>>> >> political agenda?!
>>> >>
>>> >>
>>> >>> Note Waltz's final comment, "All our kids are great kids,
>>> >>> whether
>>>they
>>> >>> are
>>> >>> gay or straight," is, I believe, the point of these
>>> >>> classes. Too
>>>bad she
>>> >>> doesn't get it.
>>> >>>
>>> >>> Strange the Trib article doesn't even mention the
>>> >>> nondisclosure
>>>contract
>>> >>> bit, which, if true, would be a significant issue for the
>>> >>> press.
>>>I
>>> >>> seriously doubt there is anything to the claim students
>>> >>> have to
>>>sign a
>>> >>> contract promising "not to tell their parents." Public
>>> >>> school
>>>folks who
>>> >>> work with teenagers know they tell everything--to everyone,
>>> >>>
>>> except
>>>maybe
>>> >>> their parents, until they turn 40 and around the dinner
>>> >>> table
>>> tell
>>>us all
>>> >>> that stuff we really don't want to know now.
>>> >>>
>>> >>> Mrs. Walz's daughter was hurt when her beliefs were
>>> >>> challenged.
>>>But
>>> >>> that's
>>> >>> how kids grow, and adults, too. To be called on to examine
>>> >>> ones
>>>beliefs
>>> >>> is
>>> >>> not to say they are necessarily wrong; but as one who grew
>>> >>> up
>>>believing
>>> >>> pretty much what Mrs Walz would have her daughter believe,
>>> >>> I wish
>>>someone
>>> >>> had challenged my attitudes when I was 17 or so.
>>> >>>
>>> >>> Thanks for the lin .
>>> >>>
>>> >>> Sue Hovey
>>> >>> ----- Original Message -----
>>> > gt;> From: "Saundra Lund" <sslund at roadrunner.com>
>>> >>> To: "'Sue Hovey'" <suehovey at moscow.com>;
>>> >>> <vision2020 at moscow.com> Sent: Thursday, March 15, 2007
>>> >>> 11:01 AM Subject: RE: [Vision2020] And you all say that we
>>> >>> have a
>>> political
>>> >>> agenda?!
>>> >>>
>>> >>>
>>> >>>> Hi Sue,
>>> >>>>
>>> >>>> You might want to check out this link to a story that was
>>> >>>> in the
>>>Chicago
>>> >>>> Trib:
>>> >>>> http://tinyurl.com/2arte6
>>> >>>>
>>> >>>> Not surprisingly, the story is actually quite a bit
>>> >>>> different
>>>than the
>>> >>>> drivel Doug Farris wants us to believe. Seems to me the
>>>religious
>>> >>>> reactionaries need to get their stories straight -- it's
>>> >>>> hard to
>>>make
>>> >>>> the
>>> >>>> argument about the whole nonsense of some confidentiality
>>>contract when
>>> >>>> everyone knows about the event in advance and parents can
>>> >>>> opt to
>>>not
>>> >>>> have
>>> >>>> their children participate. Notice, too, the names & how
>>> >>>> Ellen
>>>Waltz,
>>> >>>> whose name appears in the Trib, seems to be changing her
>>> >>>> story
>>>:-P
>>> >>>>
>>> >>>>
>>> >>>> Saundra Lund
>>> >>>> Moscow, ID
>>> >>>>
>>> >>>> The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for
>>> >>>> good
>>>people to
>>> >>>> do
>>> >>>> nothing.
>>> >>>> - Edmund Burke
>>> >>>>
>>> >>>> ***** Original material contained herein is Copyright 2006
>>>through life
>>> >>>> plus 70 years, Saundra Lund. Do not copy, forward,
>>> >>>> excerpt, or reproduce outside the Vision 2020 forum
>>> >>>> without the express written
>>>permission of
>>> >>>> the author.*****
>>>
>>>
>>>
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>>>
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>>
>> _________________________________________________________________
>> i'm making a difference. Make every IM count for the cause of your
>> choice. Join Now.
>> http://clk.atdmt.com/MSN/go/msnnkwme0080000001msn/direct/01/?href=ht
>> tp://im.live.com/messenger/im/home/?source=hmtagline
>>
>>
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