[Vision2020] Wealth, Truth, and Salvation

[Ignore False Prophets!]

Keely,

Thank you for your thoughtful response.  Thank you also for showing me that
I have failed badly to express myself clearly.  If you did not follow what I
was saying, then those that need to consider that message most certainly did
not appreciate its intentions.

Hence, I will try in my very best but human way to answer your concerns and
comments in the context of wealth and salvation as taught by Christ Jesus in
the *New Testament*.

First though, you should know the principles I base my words upon.



1.         There is a Mighty God who created the universe and all things in
it in a manner by which we do not, and perhaps cannot, totally understand.



2.         This Mighty God gave us Jesus Christ to tell us of the gift of
eternal salvation and the curse of eternal punishment and to tell us through
Jesus how we can come to enter either of these two states.



3.         That what Jesus taught was true and that he was painfully
punished and slain on the cross by those who feared the consequences of the
Power and Truth of His Message.



4.         Some of theWords of God are found in *The Holy Bible*, and God's
latest written message to us is found in the *New Testament*.



5.         Since the Bible was written by men (the Bible might have been far
different if they had been written by women), it is neither perfect nor
inerrant.  Though the pure thoughts of God may be Perfect, when they are
taken by, retold, used, or written by man with their faulty and incomplete
understanding, they lose their perfection.  Hence, the Perfection of God's
thoughts have been marred and distorted by human frailty, imperfection of
understanding, miscommunication, ignorance, and, I am afraid, pride, ego,
the desire to control, selfishness, and meanness of spirit.  Those that tell
us that the Bible is inerrant are at least fools, if not blasphemers, as
they are telling us that something produced by humanity can be perfect.  Some
of these who insist upon the "inerrancy of the Bible" do so not to urge
God's Way, but for their own personal recognition, gain, and the false
achievement of authority.  To assert that the Bible is inerrant is to say
that some men were as wise and as perfect as God.  Sacrilege!



6.         Since the Bible is not in errant, we must use the tools that God
gave us to discover those parts of the Bible closest to his Divine
Intentions.



7.         In my previous post to Vision 2020, which you have so graciously
read, I wrote some of my views on this matter, which views are also held by
a very unorganized group of other wayfarers:



*Matthew* is the first book of the *New Testament*, God's last written
message to us.  In *Matthew* God gives us the clearest, most clear,
unadorned vision of what God wishes for us to do and the consequences of
following or not following his Commands.  The great majority of competent
biblical scholars, past and present, agree that *Matthew* is the most
accurate human record we have of the teachings and life of Christ.  Some,
too much I am afraid, of what comes after *Matthew* is not only a perversion
of it, but sometimes a masculine ego-driven contradiction of it.  This is
not to say that all that follows *Matthew* is false, but rather that if it
disagrees with *Matthew*, it is a human, sometimes intentional
misrepresentation of God's True Intentions and Ways, and thus is an
unrighteous travesty of false doctrine.



*Therefore*, if something in the *New Testament* seems inconsistent with the
clear, unadorned words found in *Matthew*, believe the words of Christ found
in *Matthew*, not the other.





We are now in a position, Keely, to discuss wealth, salvation, and the
issues of dress, ostentation, tithing, and kindness you have graciously
commented upon.



I hope you will let me begin by quoting the most remarkable passage found in
any of the scriptures of any western religion, and* one whose understanding
is absolutely crucial* to an understanding of the Will and Way of God.





Gods' Word from Matthew 25: 31 through 46



"When the Son of Man comes in his glory, and all the angels with him, then
he will sit on the throne of his glory.

All the nations will be gathered before him, and he will separate people one
from another as a shepherd separates the sheep from the goats, and he will
put the sheep at his right hand and the goats at the left.



Then the king will say to those at his right hand, 'Come, you that are
blessed by my Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the
foundation of the world; for I was hungry and you gave me food, I was
thirsty and you gave me something to drink, I was a stranger and you
welcomed me, I was naked and you gave me clothing, I was sick and you took
care of me, I was in prison and you visited me.'

Then the righteous will answer him, 'Lord, when was it that we saw you
hungry and gave you food, or thirsty and gave you something to drink?

And when was it that we saw you a stranger and welcomed you, or naked and
gave you clothing?

And when was it that we saw you sick or in prison and visited you?'

And the king will answer them, 'Truly I tell you, just as you did it to one
of the least of these who are members of my family, you did it to me.'



Then he will say to those at his left hand, 'You that are accursed, depart
from me into the eternal fire prepared for the devil and his angels; for I
was hungry and you gave me no food, I was thirsty and you gave me nothing to
drink, I was a stranger and you did not welcome me, naked and you did not
give me clothing, sick and in prison and you did not visit me.'

Then they also will answer, 'Lord, when was it that we saw you hungry or
thirsty or a stranger or naked or sick or in prison, and did not take care
of you?'

Then he will answer them, 'Truly I tell you, just as you did not do it to
one of the least of these, you did not do it to me.

And these will go away into eternal punishment, but the righteous into
eternal life."





Please take a moment to reread and to carefully understand these words and
their impact.



At the end of earthly time, all who have lived are going either to eternal
reward or eternal punishment.  How will one's fate at end of earthly time be
solely determined?  It will be solely determined by how one treated the
unfortunate!



In this passage God tells of what the future after the end of earthly times
will be like and the *only* way we can help control the kind of
participation we will have in that future.



For these reasons alone, this passage would be remarkable.  But what adds to
its remarkableness is God's Great Generosity of Selfless Spirit:  The price
of eternal reward *does not depend in any way* whether one believes in God,
prays, asks for salvation, goes to church, or in any way uses or endorses
the trappings of organized religion!  To those that cannot believe this for
whatever reason, then I urge them to read and to reread that passage over
and over again until the meaning of these clear, unadorned Words of Christ
become clear and become a guide for their life.



God will not judge a person at the end of earthly times by what church they
went to, or how many times, or if they went at all, or how much money they
gave to a church, or how loudly they prayed and pled.



God's criteria of judgment are simply and clearly given.  We will be judged
on how well, within in your means, that we gave food to the poor, gave
potable liquid to the thirsty, gave welcome to strangers, gave clothing to
the naked, gave care to the sick, and gave visits to those in prison.  Sound
unlikely?  Read again the Words of Christ above!



Further guidance is given by Jesus to those with an abundance over which
they need to live a basic, simple, plainly comfortable life:





Gods' Word from Matthew 6: 19 through 21



"Do not store up for yourselves treasures on earth, where moth and rust
consume and where thieves break in and steal; but store up for yourselves
treasures in heaven, where neither moth nor rust consumes and where thieves
do not break in and steal.

For where your treasure is, there your heart will be also."





Gods' Word from Matthew 19: 16 through 24



Then someone came to him and said, "Teacher, what good deed must I do to
have eternal life?"

And he said to him, "Why do you ask me about what is good? There is only one
who is good.

If you wish to enter into life, keep the commandments.

He said to him, "Which ones?"

And Jesus said, "You shall not murder; You shall not commit adultery; You
shall not steal; You shall not bear false witness; Honor your father and
mother; also, You shall love your neighbor as yourself."

The young man said to him, "I have kept all these; what do I still lack?"

Jesus said to him, "If you wish to be perfect, go, sell your possessions,
and give the money to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven; then
come, follow me."



When the young man heard this word, he went away grieving, for he had many
possessions.



Then Jesus said to his disciples, "Truly I tell you, it will be hard for a
rich person to enter the kingdom of heaven.

Again I tell you, it is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle
than for someone who is rich to enter the kingdom of God."





It is not easy to be a Christian when living in wealth or abundance over a
simple, basic, plainly comfortable life.  The price of eternal reward is not
a life of ease and disregard for the unfortunate but a reward *earned* by
life of helping others in the most generous way one can.



No one is to go hungry or unclothed in order to help the unfortunate.  But
the message from Christ is clearly:  *Avoid extravagance always*.  Give that
which is more than you need to live simply and in plain comfort to the
unfortunate so that they may enjoy a simple and plainly comfortable life
also.  Do not buy ten dresses when just three will serve you.  Do not pay
$500.00 for a suit when one that cost $75.00 will do.  Give the resources
you do not need over living a simple basic, if not plainly comfortable life,
to help those that cannot do so because of their lack of resources or their
misfortunes.



Sound hard?  It is!  Why should you do it?  What will happen if you
don't?  Read
again Christ's Words above.



Let us now deal, Keely, with your comments on dressing for church in the
context of the above.  Again adding Gods' Word from Matthew 6: 28 through 30
:





"And why do you worry about clothing?  Consider the lilies of the field, how
they grow; they neither toil nor spin, yet I tell you, even Solomon in all
his glory was not clothed like one of these.

But if God so clothes the grass of the field, which is alive today and
tomorrow is thrown into the oven, will he not much more clothe you — you of
little faith?"





You say:



"I also know that many sincere believers are convinced that their finest
attire -- finest, not flashiest -- is appropriate for the congregational
service, and I respect that."





I am sorry if you take this as a rebuke, but it is not what those who wear
their "finest" falsely believing they are honoring God think.  *What counts
is what God says.*  Many times one's "finest" represents extravagance –
unjustifiable expenditures over what is really needed for a basic, plainly
comfortable life, and thus represents the denial of giving the overage to
the unfortunate.  In addition, wearing one's "finest" is a prideful,
self-loving expression to be avoided, as clearly commanded by Christ in the
passage quoted just above.  Honor God not by fancy dress or many of them,
but by using your money and doing all you can to help the unfortunate.  That
is the only way to earn eternal reward and to show your love and respect for
God.



You request that I not mention Christ Church.  I am sorry but I cannot honor
that request and at the same time do my evangelistic duty.  Jesus frequently
used stories and parables to make his message clear.  Since I cannot be but
a poor, thin shadow of The Master, I will not egotistically forsake the
tools he used to deliver his mighty Word.



How much more help could have been given to the unfortunate if the Pastor's
of Christ Church wife and other kin and also all the affluent among the
congregation did not dress so extravagantly and stylishly but gave the money
so spent to help the unfortunate?  How much closer would they be to eternal
reward and how much farther would they be from eternal punishment if they
dressed simply and humbly.  How much closer to eternal reward would these
affluent people be if they gave all their high-flown finery to Good Will or
the like so that the unfortunate might buy at an affordable price these
garments and alleviate suffering the shame and embarrassment wrought by
their torn and threadbare clothing?



Do choirs need fancy robes to honor God with song?  Or would God prefer that
the cost of these fancy robes be instead diverted to helping the
unfortunate?  Is it not the same for altar boys and other celebrants
including priests, pastors, and other players in the contrived dramas of
worship?  *Where* does Jesus direct you to spend that which is over what you
need for a simple, plainly comfortable life?  Does Christ urge you to spend
it on finery, on the buildings and other entrapments of organized religion
to honor him?  Or does he urge you to spend it to help the unfortunate?  Is
Christ so incomplete and so spiritually poverty ridden that He needs your
worldly offerings or does He say to give them to the unfortunates?



If you are having trouble answering these questions then perhaps a rereading
of *Matthew* 25: 31 through 46 above will help you answer them



And it is not just the extravagant clothing of some of the congregation of
Christ Church that is an abomination to God and a sure ticket to eternal
punishment.  There are many who build on the mountain and in the valley
vain, grossly extravagant dwellings.



For example, there is one in the congregation of Christ Church who name is
the same as what might be used to describe the dwelling he is erecting on
the mountain -- a very extravagant, ostentatious, expensive, unseemly
structure.  Has he not read or understood the words from *Matthew *above?**



If this fortress building man has read these words, will he sell these
trappings, erect a modest abode on a modest lot, and give the difference to
help the unfortunate?  Or will he seek solace from the wealth amassing
Pastor Douglas Wilson – some explanation showing that the clear, unadorned
words from *Matthew* are somehow in error?



And what will the prideful, greedy, Pastor Douglas Wilson say?  Probably:  "You
are fine.  Your material success is a sign that you are among God's chosen.
You will be saved for certain.  It is all the more reason for your money to
continue to be given to support and to forward my true ministry of God."





Gods' Word from Matthew 7: 15 through 20



"Beware of false prophets, who come to you in sheep's clothing but inwardly
are ravenous wolves.

You will know them by their fruits.

Are grapes gathered from thorns, or figs from thistles?

In the same way, every good tree bears good fruit, but the bad tree bears
bad fruit.

A good tree cannot bear bad fruit, nor can a bad tree bear good fruit.

Every tree that does not bear good fruit is cut down and thrown into the
fire.

Thus you will know them by their fruits."





To the fortress builder and others like him:  Hello!  Three comments:



1.         Not only would such egregiously blasphemous pastoral advice as
represented above be directly contrary to the words above from *Matthew*,
but would show the Pastor in his true colors as an avaricious, vain,
empire-building false prophet.



2.         The chosen of God are those that follow his command to care for
the unfortunate, not others who believe that their church going and prayers
are what matters.  No one should believe an errant, vain pastor, who thinks
he is smarter than God, when he tells them that they are "saints" bound for
heaven and all others are lost sinners.  Believing such tripe and pridefully
acting as if it is true is not the sign of sainthood but rather the Mark of
Cain!



3.         In *Matthew*, Christ said:



"If you wish to be perfect, go, sell your possessions, and give the money to
the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven; then come, follow me."



Christ did not say "give the money to the church," he said, "give the money
to the poor."  You do not get points for tithing, but rather points are
subtracted for that money given to a church could and should, according to
Christ, be given instead to help the unfortunate.  If you have read the
first passage cited from *Matthew* above, you will understand that a
physical church is not even necessary for worship.  One can worship with
one's family or friends in one's home as easy as or even better than going
to a church.  In fact, worshiping at home and with your actions is superior
to going to some church where false prophets may lead you from eternal
reward with false or distracting doctrine, and were money is spent mostly on
entrapments rather than on the unfortunate.



Sound unchristian to you?  Then you have failed to understand the true
meaning of the clear, unadorned words from *Matthew* first cited above.





I was distressed to hear about the treatment your friend Ellen received at
New Saint Andrews, a claimed ministry of Christ Church.  Instead of dwelling
on the rude, belittling comment Ellen received from a representative of that
school, we should ask what Jesus might have done.  Clearly, Jesus would have
offered a friendly, non-judgmental greeting, genuine solace, comfort, and
love.  It is mockery, then, for New Saint Andrews to call itself Christian
if the reported behavior has occurred.



I have noticed in my short time here that it is not Christian Love that
flows from the Ministries of Christ Church, but rather invective, insolence,
blasphemy, and prideful arrogance.  They continue this fusillade of
unchristlike behavior even though it has been pointed out to them many times
by believers and nonbelievers alike that such acts are contrary to God's
Word and are in fact blasphemous acts in themselves:





Gods' Word from Matthew 5: 38 through 48



"You have heard that it was said, 'An eye for an eye and a tooth for a
tooth.'

But I say to you, Do not resist an evildoer.

But if anyone strikes you on the right cheek, turn the other also; and if
anyone wants to sue you and take your coat, give your cloak as well; and if
anyone forces you to go one mile, go also the second mile.

Give to everyone who begs from you, and do not refuse anyone who wants to
borrow from you.



"You have heard that it was said, 'You shall love your neighbor and hate
your enemy.'

But I say to you, Love your enemies and pray for those who persecute you, so
that you may be children of your Father in heaven; for he makes his sun rise
on the evil and on the good, and sends rain on the righteous and on the
unrighteous.

For if you love those who love you, what reward do you have?  Do not even
the tax collectors do the same?

And if you greet only your brothers and sisters, what more are you doing
than others? Do not even the Gentiles do the same?

Be perfect, therefore, as your heavenly Father is perfect".





The behavior of Douglas Wilson, the pastor of that cesspool of spiritual
sewage and corruption called the Christ Church Ministries must make Jesus
weep, and must give Him more pain than the spikes which transfixed His Body
to the cross.



But, I fear, there is worse.  If I am reading some of the posts on Vision
2020 correctly, this so-called Pastor Douglas Wilson has willfully committed
a very, very grievous sin against God and humanity.



The pastor in an act violently in opposition to the just above cite from *
Matthew* deliberately and with anger struck out at an apostate who had the
courage to reveal Wilson's fraudulence and thus threaten his authority,
wealth, comfort, and ease.  Wilson did this by willfully arming one of his
current bitter, misbegotten parishioners with information gained in trust
and confidence in God's name during a private, pastoral counseling session.
Worst yet, that poor misbegotten, armed with information and soul destroying
venom publicly used that information to threaten, to intimidate, and to
inflict great pain upon the apostate.



How could any real pastor continue to represent himself as a messenger of
God after such a cruel, willful, retaliatory, contemptuous deed?  Hence:





Gods' Word from Matthew 7: 15 through 20



"Beware of false prophets, who come to you in sheep's clothing but inwardly
are ravenous wolves.

You will know them by their fruits.

Are grapes gathered from thorns, or figs from thistles?

In the same way, every good tree bears good fruit, but the bad tree bears
bad fruit.

A good tree cannot bear bad fruit, nor can a bad tree bear good fruit.

Every tree that does not bear good fruit is cut down and thrown into the
fire.

Thus you will know them by their fruits."





I hope, Keely, that you have been enlightened by the above and not bored by
it.  Please permit me to repeat form my first post the following:



Confidence men (and women) are called that because they excel at winning
your confidence while stealing your purse.  The last persons to recognize
and to disavow a confidence man posing as a pastor (who greedily disputes
God's, clear unadorned words from *Matthew* about wealth in order to forward
themselves) are found among the wealthy.  These wealthy, ill-starred persons
selfishly love themselves and their riches so much more than they love God.
They do not appreciate the Great Treasures God offers in Eternal Life, and
so these poor, soon to be wretched for eternity pretenders to Christianity
choose to be the doomed marks -- clinging to their wealth for the short time
we are here on earth -- of a pastoral confidence man.



To help you find the truth of what I speak of above, I append below a few
relevant passages from *Matthew* from the *Holy Bible*, New Revised Standard
Edition.  I have also attached an MPC file with a reading of these same
words.



To all women and men, but especially to those ensnared by the false,
mocking-of-God debris coming from Christ Church of Moscow, Idaho and its
opportunistic Pastor, Douglas Wilson, I urge you to read and hear these
clear, unadorned words of God.



For those unfortunate students of Logos School and of New Saint Andrews,
their misled parents, and all others in the world who have been led astray
by false prophets and who have MPC players, I urge to load this MPC file
into your players, to put your players on Repeat, and to listen to these
clear, unadorned Words of God many times daily until you have not only
memorized them, have understood them, but have made them part of the guiding
principles of your lives.



After you have read or listened to these Words of God, you will know what to
do about any Viper's Nest you find yourselves in.  But a word of caution:  Do
not wait too long to escape these unholy pits or the toxins you are being
injected and inculcated with therein will inoculate you strongly against
receiving the Truth, perhaps forever.



Glory to Christ!  Let us hear His Words and thus love and honor Him by
emulating his Way!



Amen.





A simple wayfarer flitting through your midst,



Paul Sunneth



^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^



Selected Verses from *Matthew*, God's Truest Words, from *The Holy Bible*,
New Revised Standard Version





Gods' Word from Matthew 5: 38 through 48



"You have heard that it was said, 'An eye for an eye and a tooth for a
tooth.'

But I say to you, Do not resist an evildoer.

But if anyone strikes you on the right cheek, turn the other also; and if
anyone wants to sue you and take your coat, give your cloak as well; and if
anyone forces you to go one mile, go also the second mile.

Give to everyone who begs from you, and do not refuse anyone who wants to
borrow from you.



"You have heard that it was said, 'You shall love your neighbor and hate
your enemy.'

But I say to you, Love your enemies and pray for those who persecute you, so
that you may be children of your Father in heaven; for he makes his sun rise
on the evil and on the good, and sends rain on the righteous and on the
unrighteous.

For if you love those who love you, what reward do you have?  Do not even
the tax collectors do the same?

And if you greet only your brothers and sisters, what more are you doing
than others? Do not even the Gentiles do the same?

Be perfect, therefore, as your heavenly Father is perfect".





Gods' Word from Matthew 6: 1 through 8



"Beware of practicing your piety before others in order to be seen by them;
for then you have no reward from your Father in heaven.

"So whenever you give alms, do not sound a trumpet before you, as the
hypocrites do in the synagogues and in the streets, so that they may be
praised by others. Truly I tell you, they have received their reward.

But when you give alms, do not let your left hand know what your right hand
is doing, so that your alms may be done in secret; and your Father who sees
in secret will reward you.

"And whenever you pray, do not be like the hypocrites; for they love to
stand and pray in the synagogues and at the street corners, so that they may
be seen by others. Truly I tell you, they have received their reward.

But whenever you pray, go into your room and shut the door and pray to your
Father who is in secret; and your Father who sees in secret will reward you.

"When you are praying, do not heap up empty phrases as the Gentiles do; for
they think that they will be heard because of their many words.

Do not be like them, for your Father knows what you need before you ask
him."





Gods' Word from Matthew 6: 19 through 21



"Do not store up for yourselves treasures on earth, where moth and rust
consume and where thieves break in and steal; but store up for yourselves
treasures in heaven, where neither moth nor rust consumes and where thieves
do not break in and steal.

For where your treasure is, there your heart will be also."





Gods' Word from Matthew 19: 16 through 24



Then someone came to him and said, "Teacher, what good deed must I do to
have eternal life?"

And he said to him, "Why do you ask me about what is good? There is only one
who is good.

If you wish to enter into life, keep the commandments.

He said to him, "Which ones?"

And Jesus said, "You shall not murder; You shall not commit adultery; You
shall not steal; You shall not bear false witness; Honor your father and
mother; also, You shall love your neighbor as yourself."

The young man said to him, "I have kept all these; what do I still lack?"

Jesus said to him, "If you wish to be perfect, go, sell your possessions,
and give the money to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven; then
come, follow me."



When the young man heard this word, he went away grieving, for he had many
possessions.



Then Jesus said to his disciples, "Truly I tell you, it will be hard for a
rich person to enter the kingdom of heaven.

Again I tell you, it is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle
than for someone who is rich to enter the kingdom of God."





Gods' Word from Matthew 6: 28 through 30



"And why do you worry about clothing?  Consider the lilies of the field, how
they grow; they neither toil nor spin, yet I tell you, even Solomon in all
his glory was not clothed like one of these.

But if God so clothes the grass of the field, which is alive today and
tomorrow is thrown into the oven, will he not much more clothe you — you of
little faith?"





Gods' Word from Matthew 7: 15 through 20



"Beware of false prophets, who come to you in sheep's clothing but inwardly
are ravenous wolves.

You will know them by their fruits.

Are grapes gathered from thorns, or figs from thistles?

In the same way, every good tree bears good fruit, but the bad tree bears
bad fruit.

A good tree cannot bear bad fruit, nor can a bad tree bear good fruit.

Every tree that does not bear good fruit is cut down and thrown into the
fire.

Thus you will know them by their fruits."





Gods' Word from Matthew 25: 31 through 46



"When the Son of Man comes in his glory, and all the angels with him, then
he will sit on the throne of his glory.

All the nations will be gathered before him, and he will separate people one
from another as a shepherd separates the sheep from the goats, and he will
put the sheep at his right hand and the goats at the left.



Then the king will say to those at his right hand, 'Come, you that are
blessed by my Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the
foundation of the world; for I was hungry and you gave me food, I was
thirsty and you gave me something to drink, I was a stranger and you
welcomed me, I was naked and you gave me clothing, I was sick and you took
care of me, I was in prison and you visited me.'

Then the righteous will answer him, 'Lord, when was it that we saw you
hungry and gave you food, or thirsty and gave you something to drink?

And when was it that we saw you a stranger and welcomed you, or naked and
gave you clothing?

And when was it that we saw you sick or in prison and visited you?'

And the king will answer them, 'Truly I tell you, just as you did it to one
of the least of these who are members of my family, you did it to me.'



Then he will say to those at his left hand, 'You that are accursed, depart
from me into the eternal fire prepared for the devil and his angels; for I
was hungry and you gave me no food, I was thirsty and you gave me nothing to
drink, I was a stranger and you did not welcome me, naked and you did not
give me clothing, sick and in prison and you did not visit me.'

Then they also will answer, 'Lord, when was it that we saw you hungry or
thirsty or a stranger or naked or sick or in prison, and did not take care
of you?'

Then he will answer them, 'Truly I tell you, just as you did not do it to
one of the least of these, you did not do it to me.

And these will go away into eternal punishment, but the righteous into
eternal life."



Amen.
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