[Vision2020] Re: Only the short sighted think Death Penalty MustBe Aboli...

[rvrcowboy]

Ted Moffett wrote:  "The death penalty in any nation is a tool that can be used to impose tyranny, even if it exists within a system that at this moment appears to respect justice, fairness and the rights of the individual."

Ted,  why can't liberals apply this same logic to the most innocent, the unborn?

Dick  
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Ted Moffett 
  To: ToeKneeTime at aol.com 
  Cc: vision2020 at moscow.com 
  Sent: Thursday, May 04, 2006 12:30 AM
  Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Re: Only the short sighted think Death Penalty MustBe Aboli...


  Tony et. al.

  Anyone who has committed a crime deserving of the death penalty can be given life in prison without parole instead.  So then there is no recidivism, unless it occurs in prison, the prisoner escapes, or somehow the laws change to allow the prisoner out.  And please don't carp about the costs of life imprisonment... if dollars and cents quantified justice we'd let MBAs from Harvard determine who gets a quality trial and who does not, based on how much media time could be sold for the trial coverage.  And death penalty cases are very costly with the appeals process, etc. 

  With life imprisonment without parole, if a mistake was made there is time to correct the injustice.  With the death penalty enforced if someone is later found innocent...

  Justice is not cheap.  If you want cheap justice, move to China.   You might find that your Christian beliefs (aggressive public opposition to forced abortions) and lifestyle draw the attention of the Chinese Communist Party, who can have you executed in short order (trumped up charges?), with minimal rights to a fair trial or access to an appeal, etc. 

  The death penalty is a prime symptom of a dictatorship...Or is it one of the prime tools of a dictatorship?  Both?

  The death penalty in any nation is a tool that can be used to impose tyranny, even if it exists within a system that at this moment appears to respect justice, fairness and the rights of the individual.  This potential for abuse alone justifies banning the death penalty.  I don't trust the state to determine who gets to live or die based on a flawed legal system, nor do I trust that in the future the state may not have the machinery of the death penalty high jacked for the sake of military/economic/political/ideological "special interests." 

  Support for the death penalty is symptomatic of those who, despite any appearances as critics of government regulation, are authoritarians at heart, who think the government should have the ultimate say in the life and death of human beings.  Talk about an egregious overextension of government power...!!!!  I can't imagine any power more egregious.  Well, OK, Winston (1984) was crushed as a human being by the state to make a statement that the state has the power to destroy (as in destroy the spirit, beliefs and love a human being followed) a human being who opposes said state, while they are alive, the point being this is worse than having the state simply execute its opponents, because it is a destruction of the very freedom seeking individualistic humanity in the soul of a human being that constitutes the essence of the opposition of the individual to the power of the state... 

  You might want to consider the decision by former Illinois Republican Governor Ryan regarding the death penalty in Illinois, and also the work of the Innocence Project:

  http://www.pbs.org/newshour/bb/law/jan-june01/penalty_5-10.html

  http://www.innocenceproject.org/

  Ted Moffett

  On 5/3/06, ToeKneeTime at aol.com <ToeKneeTime at aol.com> wrote: 
    ACS,

    No, no, you misunderstand.  I did not say that executing the innocent was justified as a deterrent.  I was simply pointing out that any system administered by fallible humans is going to result in some percentage of errors.  I don't believe that we should respond to this unavoidable consequence by dumping the entire program.  Your inclination to do exactly that is understandable but potentially VERY costly.  I believe that the end result would be a far GREATER loss of life do to recidivism. 

    Hope this sheds more light on my position.

    Best,  --Tony

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