[Vision2020] no superwalmart -- Tribune report
Mark Solomon
msolomon at moscow.com
Wed Jun 21 06:46:22 PDT 2006
Matt,
I frankly don't know if a gas line already exists in the corridor and
if so, what size. It hardly surprises me the the utility company is
installing a 6" main. Aside from serving any future customers who
might locate there, utilities often take advantage of opportunities
to interconnect main service routes to provide system redundancy in
the event of a shut down of another portion of the system. If you've
ever worked in the construction trades, you'll also know that the
non-materials cost (labor, excavation machinery, etc) of installing a
pipeline is the lion share of the cost so installing a larger pipe to
accommodate potential use is very common.
As far as Whitman County installing a water main you're just wrong.
Whitman County, just like Latah County, is not a water rights holder,
has no well, no pump, no treatment plant so they have no water to put
in a pipe. Zero. Zilch. Nada. Pullman does, but they have already
declined to provide services outside their city limit as has Moscow.
When you talk about sales taxes, you're assuming that there are new
retail dollars being spent instead of a redistribution of sales from
existing businesses. The only way new sales occur is when there is
new money added to the retail pool. Schweitzer is doing that as Jeff
has pointed out, with effects on both sides of the border, and I
think that's great although if I was a Pullman planner I would be
very concerned about the increasing demand on the city water supply
created by the attendant growth in Pullman housing starts.
Matt, if you've been following my work on water, you'll know I've
been proposing solutions for over two decades. Some of them are now
being implemented. Remember the recent city adoption of their water
conservation ordinance re lawn watering? Where do you think that came
from?
That's all I have time for right now... I've got to go to work on the
drill rig where I'm coordinating the county's hydrogeological
drilling project that is attempting to answer at least one of the
unanswered aquifer questions: how does water get into the upper
basalt aquifer?
m.
At 10:22 PM -0700 6/20/06, Matt Decker wrote:
>Mark,
>
>Hey you might be right, Hawkins might not build. However, I until
>that point I will assume they will. Check out the 6" gas line going
>to the border. Do you think that is was put in for a one acre
>telecom business? Maybe the Nissan dealership smack in the middle of
>Moscow and Pullman? I think not. In fact I would willing to bet
>Whitman county will run a 12" water main out to the border within 2
>years. Why? Beacause they are smart and will enjoy the revenue.
>Money for their children, law enforcement, science centers, etc. We
>on the other hand don't want the tax revenue.
>
>We want to imagine that Moscow will stay a 20 K populas forever.
>Lets wise up though, its not. In fact its one of the fastest growing
>states . Couerdalane is the fourth fastest growing small towns in
>the US. Idaho will grow. Point being do we want to weigh the
>differences and realize that we can have growth, maintain or since
>of community, and conserve our precious water?
>
>On a different point Mark, you keep bringing up the point of taxes
>being a small point. Why? Property taxes of a walmart or lowes or
>sportsmens warehouse or whatever will bring about 20-30 k per year.
>Sales tax per your 12-17 percent of the sales tax staying locally
>would bring on a conservative annual gross income of 10 Mill, around
>60 K(yes my assumptions but Im sure realistic). Which would eqaul
>80-90 k not even including donations towards our area. Granted we
>take a chance of big black empty spots if they go under. Doesn't any
>business?
>
>Mark whats gets me, is that I find you as a very intelligent and
>devoted man, which I respect. I don't understand why you don't have
>any solutions towards our problems. Such as water, what whould we
>do? Grey Water, resevoirs, remove yards all together? What would be
>the growth that you would like to see specifically? I agree that a
>Naylor Farms or a Walmart are not the best answer, but limiting all
>growth on an iffy water issue, which could be resolved by a little
>thought and elbow grease is not the sollution.
>
>Good night
>MD
>
>>From: Mark Solomon <msolomon at moscow.com>
>>To: "Matt Decker" <mattd2107 at hotmail.com>, jeffh at moscow.com,
>>london at moscow.com, vision2020 at moscow.com
>>Subject: Re: [Vision2020] no superwalmart -- Tribune report
>>Date: Tue, 20 Jun 2006 05:21:31 -0700
>>
>>Matt,
>>
>>Read my previous posts and columns on why it is unlikely that the
>>Hawkin's development will be built (water supply) and the
>>difference in taxation structures between Idaho and Washington that
>>diminishes the importance of sales tax revenues in the general
>>scheme of things in Moscow. Sure, there would be an increase in
>>property tax revenue if a building was built in Moscow, but that
>>can be of a very fleeting nature witness the dark Tidyman's
>>building and the 33% reduction in assessed value now that it is
>>dark. That spiral down will continue each year it is empty as part
>>of the commercial property assessment formula is an "income test".
>>
>>Mark
>>
>>At 10:25 PM -0700 6/19/06, Matt Decker wrote:
>>>Mark,
>>>
>>>How was the party? Was everyone giving high fives to the fact that
>>>Wally world is gone? Did we all have a good time since this was
>>>the best for Moscow? I myself laugh in dismay wondering why we
>>>push these companies 100 feet over the border.
>>>
>>>Now the new rumor is Walmart is trying to move in with the Hawkins
>>>development. Well hey you won. You might have managed to push them
>>>over to Whitman county, allowing hundreds of thousands of dollars
>>>of tax revenue to be spent over there. My kids will hopefully have
>>>a new school by the time they are 16, but not at this rate.
>>>
>>>Face it Mark, tax money is crossing the border. Why shouldn't we join in?
>>>
>>>Matt
>>>
>>>>From: Mark Solomon <msolomon at moscow.com>
>>>>To: Jeff Harkins <jeffh at moscow.com>, "Bill London"
>>>><london at moscow.com>;, vision2020 at moscow.com
>>>>Subject: Re: [Vision2020] no superwalmart -- Tribune report
>>>>Date: Sun, 18 Jun 2006 07:13:00 -0700
>>>>
>>>>Jeff,
>>>>
>>>>I never said I was not concerned about the loss of sales tax
>>>>dollars. I did say that due to the ID sales tax distribution
>>>>formula and the difference in tax structures between WA and ID,
>>>>the weight of sales tax revenue in the decision to approve or
>>>>disapprove a motor business rezone in Moscow was a minor part of
>>>>the issues to be considered, especially as the Pullman
>>>>supercenter was expected to siphon off the Pullman trade that had
>>>>been coming to Moscow. Let's remember that we were not given a
>>>>choice between building a store in Pullman or Moscow: the Pullman
>>>>store was well on the path toward approval while the Moscow store
>>>>had not even been heard of. And to answer your question ahead of
>>>>time: I would have opposed a Moscow supercenter even if it was
>>>>the first out of the blocks as we already have a Walmart and a
>>>>Winco.
>>>>
>>>>Beyond that, hats off to Schweitzer for building their business
>>>>in the Palouse. We all benefit.
>>>>
>>>>Mark S.
>>>>
>>>>At 12:27 AM -0700 6/18/06, Jeff Harkins wrote:
>>>>>Commissars
>>>>>
>>>>>Yes, this was disappointing news - the loss of this retail
>>>>>investment is tragic. But, perhaps WalMart will reconsider the
>>>>>Pullman location and move the supercenter store to the corridor
>>>>>(and close the current Moscow location).
>>>>>
>>>>>Grocery patrons can then enjoy sales-tax-free grocery purchases
>>>>>- and get all the shopping benefits of a supercenter - without
>>>>>actually having to have one in Moscow. I recall Solomon and
>>>>>others not concerned about loss of sales tax revenue since there
>>>>>is not a direct return on those dollars to city coffers.
>>>>>
>>>>>With the new four-lane road, access should be great and my guess
>>>>>is that there will be more than adequate parking. In all
>>>>>likelihood, WallMart will allow the Moscow-Pullman shuttle bus
>>>>>to use their location for a bus stop. Proximity to Bike trail
>>>>>will make two-wheel access easy.
>>>>>
>>>>>I had the chance to visit the new Kennewick WalMart supercenter
>>>>>store a couple of weeks ago. They had a very good organic food
>>>>>section (most of the produce locally grown - Tri-Cities area)
>>>>>and the best selection of Mexican/Spanish condiments I have seen
>>>>>outside of Mexico.
>>>>>
>>>>>Oh, that hissing sound you hear - don't worry about it.
>>>>>
>>>>>Perhaps it passed your noting, but front page of Daily News also
>>>>>carried a story about job growth in Pullman. It was noteworthy
>>>>>to see that Schweitzer Eng. will expand its manufacturing
>>>>>facilities in Pullman and add another 300 jobs. Presumably the
>>>>>initial infusion of salary dollars to Pullman will be
>>>>>approximately $20 MM dollars annually (300 jobs at $65,000). As
>>>>>those salaries are converted into product (all of which are
>>>>>exported utility grid and related components), the gross effect
>>>>>to the Pullman area could exceed $50 MM annually - as a point of
>>>>>reference, that is about $15 to $20 MM higher than the total
>>>>>annual gross production of agriculture in Latah County.
>>>>>
>>>>>Meanwhile, our own local brain trust is busily crafting their
>>>>>vision of the ultimate planned economy ... high rise condos and
>>>>>apartments within one mile of downtown? Mixed use neighborhoods
>>>>>with easy access shopping, electric car repair and laundramats -
>>>>>???????? Will neighborhood taverns be allowed???
>>>>>
>>>>> ... and Beebe withdrew his proposal for Grain Elevator Condos????
>>>>>
>>>>>I wonder if the town center will be paved in red bricks?
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>At 04:09 PM 6/16/2006, you wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>>Wal-Mart shelves Moscow super center
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>By ELAINE WILLIAMS
>>>>>>of the Tribune
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Wal-Mart has put plans for a super center in Moscow on the back burner.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Wal-Mart will not pursue a location on the southeast corner of
>>>>>>Mountain View Road and Highway 8, east of a former Tidyman's
>>>>>>site and near Eastside Marketplace, said Karianne Fallow, a
>>>>>>spokeswoman for Wal-Mart in Boise.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>"Wal-Mart has decided to re-evaluate our opportunities for a
>>>>>>super center in Moscow,'' Fallow said in a Thursday
>>>>>>announcement.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>"While we're fully committed to continuing to serve our
>>>>>>customers on the Palouse, we can't continue to delay our
>>>>>>relocation plans at this time,'' Fallow said.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Wal-Mart will continue to operate its existing Moscow store, Fallow said.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Wal-Mart will also seek to open a 223,000-square-foot super
>>>>>>center on Bishop Boulevard in Pullman, Fallow said.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>That project has been appealed by Pullman Alliance for
>>>>>>Responsible Development in Whitman County Superior Court.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>And Wal-Mart will also look for alternative super center sites
>>>>>>in Moscow, Fallow said. "We still continue to view Pullman and
>>>>>>Moscow as two very distinct markets.''
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Fallow said Wal-Mart has no plans to build a super center in
>>>>>>Lewiston at this time. Rumors about such a store have been
>>>>>>circulating in Lewiston for months.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Wal-Mart's decision is directly related to action taken by the
>>>>>>Moscow City Council last month, Fallow said.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>The panel rejected a request to rezone 77 acres from
>>>>>>agriculture-forestry to motor business, a designation that
>>>>>>could have opened the door for a number of big-box retailers on
>>>>>>the site.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>At the time, the council indicated that a rezone request for a
>>>>>>lesser amount of property might be acceptable.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>But Wal-Mart isn't interested in following up, Fallow said.
>>>>>>"The city council has continually changed the rules of the
>>>>>>game. And creating a guessing game for any kind of development
>>>>>>is a very expensive endeavor.''
>>>>>>
>>>>>>First the land needed to be rezoned and then how much needed to
>>>>>>be rezoned wasn't clear, Fallow said.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Then it wasn't possible for the store plans to be reviewed
>>>>>>before the rezone and other parts of the process were settled,
>>>>>>Fallow said.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Attempts to reach the city's elected officials Thursday
>>>>>>afternoon by e-mail were not successful. All of them were out
>>>>>>of town, most of them attending the Idaho Association of Cities
>>>>>>conference in Lewiston.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>"We certainly respect the decision Wal-Mart has made,'' said
>>>>>>Bill Belknap, assistant city supervisor. "We wish them the best
>>>>>>in their endeavors.''
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Mark Solomon, a coordinator of No Super Wal-Mart, said Moscow
>>>>>>already has the services a Wal-Mart would have provided at its
>>>>>>own store and in retailers owned by Palouse residents.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>"It's great news that the most predatory retailer on the planet
>>>>>>won't be gaining any larger presence in Moscow,'' Solomon said.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Solomon's group already had a party planned for 7 p.m. tonight
>>>>>>at the 1912 Center in Moscow to mark the previous zoning
>>>>>>decision of the city council. "There will be additional cause
>>>>>>to celebrate Moscow's vitality,'' Solomon said.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>But Fallow said it's wrong for Moscow residents to view her
>>>>>>employer's decision as a victory. "With a super center comes
>>>>>>additional jobs, additional tax revenue. You name it, there are
>>>>>>a lot of benefits to having a super center in the city.''
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Solomon disagreed. Wal-Mart jobs replace better paying ones in
>>>>>>existing local businesses, Solomon said.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>------
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Williams may be contacted at ewilliam at lmtribune.com or at (208)
>>>>>>743-9600, ext. 261.
>>>>>>=====================================================
>>>>>> List services made available by First Step Internet,
>>>>>> serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.
>>>>>>http://www.fsr.net
>>>>>>mailto:Vision2020 at moscow.com
>>>>>>====================================================
>>>
>>>
>>>>=====================================================
>>>> List services made available by First Step Internet,
>>>> serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.
>>>> http://www.fsr.net
>>>> mailto:Vision2020 at moscow.com
>>>>====================================================
>>>
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>>
>
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