[Vision2020] The Great Debate

Thu Jul 13 23:51:46 PDT 2006

"Even if you are right about Doug, don't you realize in order to wrestle a 
pig, you first
have to get down in the mud with him?"

First, YOU called Dougie a pig, not I.

Second, we are admonished REPEATEDLY not to touch pigs, therefore I will 
not.  Remember, Jesus sent them off a cliff rather than seeing them harm 
others.

Third, I am not fond of the type of mud you seem willing to wallow in and 
will therefore leave you to it.

And Fourth we are, again, admonished to bring to light those that would 
pervert and destroy God's Word for their own gain.  I will continue to speak 
out against Dougie for as long as it takes.  You wish to do otherwise - go 
for it.

You don't like what you read - don't read it.  Simple.

J  :]

>From: "rvrcowboy" <rvrcowboy at clearwire.net>
>To: "Vision2020" <vision2020 at moscow.com>, "J Ford" 
><privatejf32 at hotmail.com>
>Subject: Re: [Vision2020] The Great Debate
>Date: Thu, 13 Jul 2006 22:01:13 -0700
>
>J Ford asks:  ""......Who decides what we will follow word for word in the
>Bible and what we won't?  Em, Dougie - 'cause he's been doing so for 30(+)
>years and that makes him qualified to make those kinds of decisions."
>
>The truth is, if one is a real man (or woman), one must decide for oneself
>whether to follow, or not to follow, anything in the Bible.  A minister can
>preach any sermon, any way that minister can but it is up to each 
>individual
>in the flock to decide what to accept or not accept.  This is called "free
>will" and it is the very basis of faith.  We all have the free will to
>accept the Word or to reject It.
>
>It appears very childish to continue some of the senseless nonsense 
>directed
>against Doug Wilson and Christ Church that appears here in the forum.  I
>believe most people here are adult enough to make up their own mind without
>the constant witticism from those who constantly strive to stir up their 
>own
>personal posse to ride out and verbally hang those they dislike.
>
>For instance, Mr. Ford, to what benefit is it to you to continually make
>your nasty little innuendos about Mr. Wilson?  Does it make you feel 
>bigger,
>stronger, more superior, more intelligent or what?  You could probably be
>all of those things just by rising above this inane need to put others down
>to make yourself appear better.  I am sure most of the other people here 
>are
>tired of reading your little digs, regardless of their feelings about Doug
>Wilson, just as I am.
>
>Lighten up, take a pill and look for something good to say once in awhile.
>It might suprise you how much more respect you will get for it.  Even if 
>you
>are right about Doug, don't you realize in order to wrestle a pig, you 
>first
>have to get down in the mud with him?
>
>Enjoy the good, ignore the bad...let God do the judging, He is highly
>capable and we are not.
>
>Dick S.
>
>
>
>
>
>----- Original Message -----
>From: "J Ford" <privatejf32 at hotmail.com>
>To: <vision2020 at moscow.com>
>Sent: Thursday, July 13, 2006 8:04 PM
>Subject: Re: [Vision2020] The Great Debate
>
>
> > "......Who decides what we will follow word for word in the Bible and 
>what
> > we won't?"
> >
> > Em, Dougie - 'cause he's been doing so for 30(+) years and that makes 
>him
> > qualified to make those kinds of decisions.
> >
> > J  :]
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > >From: "kerry becker" <kerrybecker6924 at hotmail.com>
> > >To: rvrcowboy at clearwire.net, vision2020 at moscow.com, sdredge at yahoo.com
> > >Subject: Re: [Vision2020] The Great Debate
> > >Date: Thu, 13 Jul 2006 17:08:31 -0700
> > >
> > >
> > >This is what I can never understand.  How do we (society) decide what 
>we
> > >will follow traditionally in the Bible and what things can/should be
> > >changed or adapted?
> > >
> > >Homosexuality is a sin but there are over 600 sins listed in the bible!
>We
> > >don't stone or sacrifice anymore because we've developed and changed as 
>a
> > >society, yet homosexuality is still a sticking point.  I don't get it.
>Who
> > >decides what we will follow word for word in the Bible and what we 
>won't?
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >From: "rvrcowboy" <rvrcowboy at clearwire.net>
> > >To: "Vision2020" <vision2020 at moscow.com>, "Scott Dredge"
> > ><sdredge at yahoo.com>
> > >Subject: Re: [Vision2020] The Great Debate
> > >Date: Thu, 13 Jul 2006 13:35:09 -0700
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >Scott,
> > >
> > >I respectfully disagree with you that there are no victims where
> > >homosexuality is concerned.  That is a topic we can cover at another 
>time
> > >if you like.  Let's just say, for now, that it is not always between
> > >consenting adults and there are other ramifications stemming from it.
> > >Perhaps some of my feelings will be revealed to you when I finally get 
>my
> > >answer to the Chas letter written.
> > >
> > >That having been said, the topic was not originally just about
> > >homosexuality but about sin in general, at least that was my take on 
>it.
> > >The question being:  Is homosexuality a Biblical sin?
> > >
> > >I believe it is.  As I stated in my post; I don't see how any rational
> > >person could reach any other conclusion from reading any translation of
>the
> > >Bible.  I also stated that I am no Biblical scholar, so I could be
> > >mistaken.
> > >
> > >When I spoke of adultry, rape, stealing, etc., I was merely making a
>point
> > >that these are also sins and that homosexuality should not be made a
> > >greater sin than any of them.  I will also speak my opinion more
>succinctly
> > >about these matters in my answer to Chas.
> > >
> > >I suppose my answer to you, in a nutshell, would be that my opinion 
>about
> > >what is and is not sin does not carry much weight.  The question before
>us
> > >is whether the Bible (thus God) considers these things sins.  I believe
>it
> > >(He) does.
> > >
> > >I hope this clarifies my original post for you.
> > >
> > >Peace,
> > >
> > >Dick S.
> > >
> > >----- Original Message -----
> > >From: Scott Dredge
> > >To: vision2020 at moscow.com
> > >Sent: Thursday, July 13, 2006 11:30 AM
> > >Subject: Re: [Vision2020] The Great Debate
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >rvcowboy,
> > >
> > >There are clearly victims involved in situations of adultery, rape,
> > >cheating, and stealing.  Not so with homosexuality.  Are you really
>unable
> > >to see the difference between consenual adult activity and scenarios of
> > >someone viciously hurting someone else?
> > >
> > >-Scott
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >"rvrcowboy" <rvrcowboy at clearwire.net> wrote:
> > >-----------------------------------------------
> > >-- SNIP --
> > >I agree with you that Jesus' overwhelming
> > >message is that we love one another.  I just don't believe that loving
>one
> > >another justifies our
> > >sins.  Please understand, I don't rate the sin of homosexuality any
> > >differently than adultrey,
> > >rape, cheating, stealing, or any other sin.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
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