[Vision2020] Moscow Ordinance 2002-13 aka The "Topless" Ordinance

Mon Jul 3 13:09:15 PDT 2006

Not good enough, sir.  You plainly state that you feel some of the council 
are "paid for" by those that are against Dougie and the CC - a charge you 
either should back up or back-up-from and apologize for (don't worry, that 
too is rhetorical; I realize it will NEVER happen.)

You can cast aspersions against anyone you wish but you are clearly saying 
that you feel they were "bought" or that their seat(s) were bought.  
Personally, I didn't "hand pick" any of the people on the City Council and I 
do not know of anyone else who did.  Mayhap you'd be so good as to point out 
which ones you feel were and those that were not bought?  And who paid for 
them?

Didn't think so.

Typical kirker/Dougie supporter and learn-at-the-knee behavior - make 
accusations against a blank of people and then not bother to be man enough 
to back the statements up.

J  :]

>From: "g. crabtree" <jampot at adelphia.net>
>To: "J Ford" <privatejf32 at hotmail.com>,<vision2020 at moscow.com>
>Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Moscow Ordinance 2002-13 aka The "Topless" 
>Ordinance
>Date: Mon, 3 Jul 2006 06:51:47 -0700
>
>No darling, I was making a statement, not a charge. There is no question 
>that councilmen Stout and Ament enjoyed broad support from the anti CC 
>crowd, as well as groups that identify themselves as progressive.  I do not 
>believe that there is anything unethical, immoral, illegal or particularly 
>remarkable about this, I merely point it out as a fact. It has been called 
>to my attention on this forum repeatedly that I should not be surprised 
>that they will dance with (and for) them that brung 'em.
>
>Please remember that when you hear the popping and banging over the next 
>couple days that it's the independence day celebration, not Doug Wilson 
>taking over the town.
>
>Stay cool,
>G. Crabtree
>----- Original Message ----- From: "J Ford" <privatejf32 at hotmail.com>
>To: <vision2020 at moscow.com>
>Sent: Monday, July 03, 2006 12:52 AM
>Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Moscow Ordinance 2002-13 aka The "Topless" 
>Ordinance
>
>
>>"....."progressive" buddies along with their hand picked (and paid for) 
>>city council people"?
>>
>>Care to explain this statement?  I mean, you sound like you're making a 
>>charge - mayhap you can back it up or are you going to let it go as is?
>>
>>J  :]
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>>From: "g. crabtree" <jampot at adelphia.net>
>>>To: "Saundra Lund" <sslund at adelphia.net>, <vision2020 at moscow.com>
>>>Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Moscow Ordinance 2002-13 aka The "Topless" 
>>>Ordinance
>>>Date: Sun, 2 Jul 2006 15:54:33 -0700
>>>
>>>Mrs. Lund, why is that when the CC critics and their various 
>>>"progressive" buddies along with their hand picked (and paid for) city 
>>>council people attempt to impose their will on a collective Moscow, in 
>>>the form of NSA/CC harassment, unionization of city employees or 
>>>anti-growth measures, it's democracy at work but when A decency ordinance 
>>>is passed, with the support of several local congregations and five non 
>>>CC council members, an ordinance that is similar to many others across 
>>>the nation, it's "ridiculous and reactionary," and a case of ramming 
>>>through bad law and using undo pressure as well as contributory to making 
>>>Moscow a laughing stock? And all because of Doug Wilson? I seem to sense 
>>>a serious double standard at work here. Again.
>>>
>>>I also really don't recall there being a feeling of desperation in the 
>>>air when Ord. 2002-13 was enacted and am certain that a lynch mob 
>>>mentality was not at work. To refer to goings on surrounding the 
>>>enactment of the topless ordinance as a sacrificial crisis is to grossly 
>>>overstate matters in an attempt to make a tenuous, to the point of 
>>>nonexistent argument. If the majority of Moscow truly feels that they 
>>>were "steamrolled," it should be fairly easy to have this odious piece of 
>>>law making repealed. Perhaps you'll have citizen/councilman Ament bring 
>>>this urgent matter up at the next council meeting? Maybe Mr. Stout would 
>>>like to champion this important cause for you? Remember what happens if 
>>>good people do nothing.
>>>
>>>gc
>>>
>>>----- Original Message ----- From: "Saundra Lund" <sslund at adelphia.net>
>>>To: <vision2020 at moscow.com>
>>>Sent: Sunday, July 02, 2006 11:42 AM
>>>Subject: [Vision2020] Moscow Ordinance 2002-13 aka The "Topless" 
>>>Ordinance
>>>
>>>
>>>>Visionaries:
>>>>
>>>>I got an email today from a friend who worked with the group which tried 
>>>>to
>>>>overturn Moscow's ridiculous and reactionary topless ordinance that was
>>>>rammed through due to pressure from the Christ Church "PAC."
>>>>
>>>>My friend sent me a link to an entry on Doug Wilson's blog and thought 
>>>>it
>>>>did an excellent job of explaining the Christ Church's role in that mess
>>>>that steamrolled over the beliefs of the majority of our community:
>>>>
>>>>"Those who stir up strife in towns, churches, cities, or nations are 
>>>>trying
>>>>to create a situation when everyone will get to a point of desperation, 
>>>>and
>>>>then try to resolve the problem with some kind of dramatic action. That
>>>>dramatic action is sudden, forceful, fascinating, and its effects are 
>>>>very
>>>>potent . . . and temporary.
>>>>
>>>>This is why mobs function the way they do. This is how lynching occurs. 
>>>>.
>>>>.But it is a pseudo-salvation. It is a lie. When this kind of person
>>>>succeeds in stirring up a sacrificial crisis, he gets the mob, or the 
>>>>crowd,
>>>>or the presbytery, or the congregation, as the case may be, whipped up 
>>>>into
>>>>a sacrificial crisis and ready for a dramatic solution to all the 
>>>>trouble. "
>>>>http://www.dougwils.com/index.asp?Action=Anchor&CategoryID=1&BlogID=2510
>>>>
>>>>Indeed.
>>>>
>>>>A law was passed that AFAIK to this day has *never* been enforced. 
>>>>However,
>>>>it did manage to make Moscow, Idaho a national laughing stock  :-(
>>>>
>>>>I have to agree with my friend . . . and I also have to wonder why 
>>>>Wilson
>>>>doesn't see himself in his own words  :-(
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>Saundra Lund
>>>>Moscow, ID
>>>>
>>>>The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good people to 
>>>>do
>>>>nothing.
>>>>- Edmund Burke
>>>>
>>>>***** Original material contained herein is Copyright 2006, Saundra 
>>>>Lund.
>>>>Do not copy, forward, excerpt, or reproduce outside the Vision 2020 
>>>>forum
>>>>without the express written permission of the author.*****
>>>>
>>>>
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>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>=====================================================
>>>List services made available by First Step Internet, serving the 
>>>communities of the Palouse since 1994.                 http://www.fsr.net 
>>>mailto:Vision2020 at moscow.com
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>>
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