[Vision2020] the pledge

Pat Kraut pkraut at moscow.com
Sun Jan 29 14:42:49 PST 2006 

I have a friend just past the cemetary who is thrilled with the new store...it will be within walking distance.


  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: joekc at adelphia.net 
  To: Donovan Arnold 
  Cc: vision2020 at moscow.com ; DonaldH675 at aol.com 
  Sent: Sunday, January 29, 2006 2:05 PM
  Subject: Re: [Vision2020] the pledge


  So by your reasoning, Donovan, your choices are limited since we don't have a Burger King or a Shop Co in Moscow. In fact, my choices are limited since the closest McDonalds is two blocks away and not in my kitchen. 

  What I care about most are my own choices and having a Super Wal-Mart will limit them by a lot. The Super Wal-Mart is scheduled to be located about 1/2 mile from my house, drastically changing the area where I live. I voice my negative views about the proposed Super Wal-Mart in an effort to see if there are others who share my views and my values; folks who live in Moscow precisely because it is different from all the other towns in the world and have no desire to make it just like every place else; folks who care more about local ownership, aesthetic values, and human rights than low-price and convenience which are the ONLY things that Wal-Mart has going for it. Check your list below and see if I'm wrong. 

  In the end, I am not the one who will make the decision, so it is just false to say that, by expressing my views on the subject, I am limiting anyone's choices. In the end, if we are lucky enough to preserve our uniqueness and not have a Super Wal-Mart here it will be because it is of the will of the people, expressed either through actions of elected city officials or through the actions of a great many of Moscow's citizens. 

  Note that a large part of what I'm doing is merely pointing out to folks that all of the arguments that you and others use suggesting that Super Wal-Mart will increase our choices are fallacious. I'm willing to let people decide for themselves who is right.
  --
  Joe Campbell

  ---- Donovan Arnold wrote:

  =============
  "Since we already HAVE a Wal-Mart and a Super Wal-Mart is scheduled to go into Pullman, please tell me how it is that keeping a Super Wal-Mart out of Moscow limits anyone's choice." Joe Campbell

  Joe,

  I do not think you are comprehending the argument here. It does not matter the reasons why thousands of shoppers want a Super Wal-Mart. The questions is whether 30,000 shoppers and a willing company want to exchange property have the right to do so when they are following all the same federal, state, and local laws as everyone else. Can a rowdy, noisy, obnoxious minority group of people stop a store from providing for the needs of lower income families and those that wish to shop there?

  If you want reason of why it limits choice I will give you several of them;

  Someone does not have a car to drive to Pullman

  Someone does not want to burn the gas to drive to Pullman

  Someone does not WANT to drive to Pullman

  Someone does not have the TIME to drive to Pullman

  Someone is not allowed to go to Pullman or cross state lines

  Someone wants to work at a Super Wal-Mart in Idaho

  Some one does not want to pay 5% tax on groceries

  Someone wants to keep tax dollars in Idaho

  Someone wants to do one stop shopping in Idaho

  Someone wants to go for long walks indoors in the winter or rain

  Someone wants to do donuts in their big parking lot a 12PM

  Someone wants to walk or ride a bike to Wal-mart

  There is giant snow storm a Pullman is too far

  There ice cream might melt

  There trunk does not close and want to avoid the highway

  They get lost in Pullman

  They hate Pullman

  Pullman traffic is horrible because they have a game

  They do not know their way around Pullman

  They like the Color Blue

  The Queen of England is English

  Their girlfriend is ugly

  OK so the last three were irrational and illogical but so is the reasons for opposing the right of shoppers to shop where they want.

  _DJA




  joekc at adelphia.net wrote: Since we already HAVE a Wal-Mart and a Super Wal-Mart is scheduled to go into Pullman, please tell me how it is that keeping a Super Wal-Mart out of Moscow limits anyone's choice. As I have stated and argued previously, two Super Wal-Marts would eventually limit our choices far more.
  --
  Joe Campbell

  ---- Donovan Arnold wrote:

  =============
  "Saying the pledge is like saying a public prayer; it is an effort by believers to force nonbelievers (whatever the belief might be; religious,patriotic, political and so on) to comply with the believers version of reality, no matter how screwy and non-rational that belief might be."-Don Huskey

  Ironic statement coming from a guy who wants to prevent 30,000 Palouse residents from freely shopping at the store of their choice because of his screwy non-rational political beliefs.

  _DJA


  DonaldH675 at aol.com wrote: Donovan,
  I did not claim that anyone made the recommendation to quit saying the pledge because at the time I posted I had no idea who had made the suggestion. It was my own idea that saying the pledge was and is a waste of time. And might I add that at no time did I say anything about anyone's right to say the pledge privately whenever they so chose. Saying the pledge is like saying a public prayer; it is an effort by believers to force nonbelievers (whatever the belief might be; religious,patriotic, political and so on) to comply with the believers version of reality, no matter how screwy and non-rational that belief might be.

  Don Huskey

  "First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they fight you, then you win." Mahatma Gandhi
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