[Vision2020] Adulterous PerjurerSwarmed in Hanoi

Art Deco deco at moscow.com
Sun Dec 10 13:28:09 PST 2006


Tony,

There was no credible evidence for WMD.  Evidence was present. But it was 
polluted to uselessness because the intelligence presented by the 
administration to those making the decisions about the world was 
intentionally presented to them incompletely and dishonestly politicized to 
argue for the war.  A bi-partisan committee established this over a year 
ago.  Google for it.  [What do you think the treasonous outing of Valerie 
Plame was about?]


Almost all the intelligence information showing no WMD was suppressed 
intentionally.  The evidence claiming WMD came from liars and con artists 
like Chabali and others who we now assert victimized us.

You, Hannity, O'Reily, Pat Kraut, Bush, and Cheney are the last Americans 
left who publicly deny that the pre-war intelligence was intentionally 
cooked in favor going to war.  A review by the bi-partisan committee 
reported many known facts that argued against what the administration used 
were known by the administration but suppressed.  In addition, the committee 
found that the normal review and testing of the credibility of the 
undercover information sources in Iraq was extremely slipshod, if extant at 
all.  Even the constantly befuddled Bush admitted these shortcomings tacitly 
by changing leadership (twice) at the CIA.

Problems can only be solved when recognized.  One thing that has emerged 
from this debacle:  Our intelligence gathering operations are in great need 
of rethinking and improvement before we make another egregious tragic 
mistake.

W.


----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Tony" <tonytime at clearwire.net>
To: "Art Deco" <deco at moscow.com>
Cc: <vision2020 at moscow.com>
Sent: Sunday, December 10, 2006 10:58 AM
Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Adulterous PerjurerSwarmed in Hanoi


> Wayne I trust you will excuse me for disagreeing with your assertion that 
> there was "absolutely no credible evidence before or after the war that 
> Saddam was in the process of making WMDs or that Iraq was a security 
> threat to the U.S."  After all, Hillary Clinton said prior to our invasion 
> that she felt Iraq posed such a threat.  John Kerry, prior to our assault, 
> said he felt such a threat existed.  Ted Kennedy also voiced such concerns 
> at the same time.
>
> Let me be clear in order to counter the revisionist historians who are 
> contending with accuracy and truth:  THE DEMOCRAT PARTY AS WELL AS THE 
> REPUBLICAN PARTY FELT THAT SUCH A THREAT EXISTED PRIOR TO OUR INVASION OF 
> IRAQ!  This was NOT a Bush initiative.  It was part of  a BI-PARTISAN 
> RESPONSE to a GRAVE ATTACK on our soil.
>
> If you value your credibility Wayne, it would behoove you to stop denying 
> the written historical record.
>
> Merry Christmas.    -T
>
>
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Art Deco" <deco at moscow.com>
> To: "Vision 2020" <vision2020 at moscow.com>
> Sent: Saturday, December 09, 2006 1:07 PM
> Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Adulterous PerjurerSwarmed in Hanoi
>
>
>> Tony,
>>
>> Try a little fair minded, intelligent Googling to discover cajoling,
>> misrepresenting, and lying.  Even many of Bush's party members no longer
>> dispute those allegations.  There was absolute no credible evidence 
>> before
>> or after the war the Saddam was in the process of making WMDs or that 
>> Iraq
>> was a security threat to the U.S.  Further, tyrannical and homicidal as 
>> he
>> was, Iraq and all the worldwide ill-feeling and terrorism the war has
>> spawned is now a much greater security than it ever could have been under
>> Saddam -- not to mention the cost in resources, lives, and incredible
>> suffering on all sides.
>>
>> Here's another moral failing:  Members of the highest level of Bush's
>> administration were willing to out a CIA agent simply to get at her 
>> husband,
>> a critic of the administration's lies about Iraq's nuclear intentions --  
>> a
>> critic who was correct.  Those aides and the cooperating press should 
>> have
>> been hung for treason in my opinion for this clearly treasonable act.
>>
>> However Tony, I am sure that no amount of facts will change your mind or 
>> let
>> you see that Bush has been an arrogant, ignorant, hubris laden executor 
>> of
>> U.S. foreign policy and an almost total f--kup when dealing with large 
>> scale
>> crises at home like Katrina.
>>
>> Even if Bush's pre-war claims about the intentions of Saddam's regime 
>> were
>> probable, a more prudent, less dull-witted President would have committed
>> the resources need to finish the job in Afghanistan including rendering
>> asunder the Taliban, disbanding Bi Laden's merry men, and providing 
>> massive
>> aid to convert the Afghan economy from opium production before going to 
>> war
>> in Iraq with very little allied moral and tactical agreement or allied
>> material support.
>>
>> This whole idiotic expedition has forever changed the world and certainly
>> not for the good.  I'm glad that I'm old and hopefully will not live to 
>> see
>> the carnage that will in time be a direct result of this ill thought out
>> endeavor or be forced to live in squalor in order to pay for it.
>>
>>
>> W.
>>
>> ----- Original Message ----- 
>> From: "Tony" <tonytime at clearwire.net>
>> To: "Art Deco" <deco at moscow.com>; "Vision 2020" <vision2020 at moscow.com>
>> Cc: <vision2020 at moscow.com>
>> Sent: Saturday, December 09, 2006 10:16 AM
>> Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Adulterous PerjurerSwarmed in Hanoi
>>
>>
>>> Art, you have yet to pursuasively demonstrate that President Bush
>>> "cajoled, misrepresented, and lied in order to justify going to war."
>>>
>>> Aside from that glaring false premise, it was an awesome posting.
>>>
>>> Happy holidays.        -T
>>> ----- Original Message ----- 
>>> From: "Art Deco" <deco at moscow.com>
>>> To: "Vision 2020" <vision2020 at moscow.com>
>>> Sent: Saturday, December 09, 2006 9:43 AM
>>> Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Moral Culpability [ was:Adulterous
>>> PerjurerSwarmed in Hanoi]
>>>
>>>
>>>> The worst part of Clinton's expression of his sexual proclivities was 
>>>> his
>>>> willful perjury afterwards, certainly a real moral failing, in my
>>>> opinion.
>>>>
>>>> However, as many have pointed out:  There is a huge difference in moral
>>>> culpability between lying under oath about a blow job given and 
>>>> received
>>>> by
>>>> consenting adults, one of them married, and cajoling, misrepresenting,
>>>> and
>>>> lying in order to justify going to war with its horrendous 
>>>> consequences.
>>>>
>>>> A few of the major differences between the moral seriousness of the two
>>>> actions is that in the latter:
>>>>
>>>> 1.     Hundreds of thousands of people, most of them non-combatants, 
>>>> many
>>>> of
>>>> them children, have been slain,
>>>>
>>>> 2.    Millions, many of them children, have been burned, maimed, or
>>>> otherwise wounded,
>>>>
>>>> 3.    A major economy was all but destroyed,
>>>>
>>>> 4.    The flow of oil to the world was reduced (which we are now paying
>>>> for
>>>> with increased gasoline prices),
>>>>
>>>> 5.    Major parts of the entire Iraqi infrastructure have been 
>>>> destroyed
>>>> or
>>>> severely damaged with its disastrous consequences for human suffering,
>>>>
>>>> 6.    Iraq is now in a civil/religious sectarian war likely to go on 
>>>> and
>>>> on
>>>> without resolution like the Israeli-Palestinian conflict,
>>>>
>>>> 7.    The ability of Islamic terrorists to recruit for and finance 
>>>> their
>>>> operations have been greatly increased (the exact opposite effect 
>>>> desired
>>>> by
>>>> most Americans),
>>>>
>>>> 8.    Billions of dollars have been spent on this misplanned,
>>>> mis-motivated
>>>> expedition which could have been spent in our own country and/or spent 
>>>> to
>>>> help make the world a better place for many others besides ourselves, 
>>>> and
>>>> without leaving our progeny to pay for the cost of this egregious,
>>>> mind-numbing folly,
>>>>
>>>> 9.    The image, power, prestige of our country has been irretrievably
>>>> tarnished beyond redemption worldwide, and
>>>>
>>>> 10.   The faith of the American people in the ability of the office of
>>>> the
>>>> President to make honest, forthright decisions after a judicious review
>>>> and
>>>> critique of information has been greatly, perhaps forever, foundered.
>>>>
>>>> Personally, if instead of his atrocious human suffering causing 
>>>> blunders,
>>>> Bush would have had a blow job from a different person every day of his
>>>> term
>>>> and lied about all of them under oath instead of lying and
>>>> misrepresenting
>>>> us into this war, the world would be a much better, more secure, safer,
>>>> more
>>>> humane place in my heathen opinion.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Art Deco (Wayne A. Fox)
>>>> deco at moscow.com
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> ----- Original Message ----- 
>>>> From: "keely emerinemix" <kjajmix1 at msn.com>
>>>> To: <tonytime at clearwire.net>; <privatejf32 at hotmail.com>;
>>>> <vision2020 at moscow.com>
>>>> Sent: Friday, December 08, 2006 8:29 PM
>>>> Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Adulterous Perjurer Swarmed in Hanoi
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> For the record, I believe that marriage vows are of the utmost
>>>>> importance.
>>>>> I don't believe, however, that millions of dollars should have been
>>>>> spent
>>>>> investigating what surely isn't the only instance of adultery -- and
>>>>> once
>>>>> again, I'm against adultery -- by a President.
>>>>>
>>>>> keely
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> From: "Tony" <tonytime at clearwire.net>
>>>>> To: "J Ford" <privatejf32 at hotmail.com>, <vision2020 at moscow.com>
>>>>> CC: vision2020 at moscow.com
>>>>> Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Adulterous Perjurer Swarmed in Hanoi
>>>>> Date: Fri, 8 Dec 2006 20:19:32 -0800
>>>>>
>>>>> J, your response to my criticism of Bill Clinton's adultery is just
>>>>> plain
>>>>> sick.  Why are you and Keely so glib about Clinton's decision to break
>>>>> the
>>>>> vows he took to his wife before God?  Why does his commission of a
>>>>> felony
>>>>> cause you no concern?  How would you feel had your husband done the
>>>>> same?
>>>>> Have you no grasp of right and wrong?
>>>>>
>>>>> Fascinating!
>>>>>
>>>>> -T
>>>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>>> From: "J Ford" <privatejf32 at hotmail.com>
>>>>> To: <vision2020 at moscow.com>
>>>>> Sent: Friday, December 08, 2006 12:31 PM
>>>>> Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Adulterous Perjurer Swarmed in Hanoi
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> > Ah yes, but giving Tony that kind of "action" would only encourage 
>>>>> > his
>>>>> > bloated-sense-of-self-worth-to-women a big, em, thrust.
>>>>> >
>>>>> > 'Course, no one said anything about it having to be a women that 
>>>>> > does
>>>>> > the
>>>>> > deed...could be an intern that accommodates his more baser needs,
>>>>> > which
>>>>> he
>>>>> > continues to express he has, here on the list.
>>>>> >
>>>>> >
>>>>> > J  :]
>>>>> >
>>>>> >
>>>>> >
>>>>> >
>>>>> >
>>>>> >>
>>>>> >>At the risk of being terribly crude and thus offending some of you,
>>>>> Tony's
>>>>> >>comments remind me of a T-shirt about our president that I saw in a
>>>>> >>catalog
>>>>> >>recently  --
>>>>> >>
>>>>> >>"Will someone please give this guy a blowjob so we can impeach 
>>>>> >>him???"
>>>>> >>
>>>>> >>Blushing, but wondering how much shipping and handling would be,
>>>>> >
>>>>> >>
>>>>> >>
>>>>> >>From: "Tony" <tonytime at clearwire.net>
>>>>> >>To: <nickgier at adelphia.net>
>>>>> >>CC: vision2020 at moscow.com
>>>>> >>Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Adulterous Perjurer Swarmed in Hanoi
>>>>> >>Date: Thu, 7 Dec 2006 22:38:37 -0800
>>>>> >>
>>>>> >>Nick, in response to your question about where George bush will be
>>>>> swarmed
>>>>> >>by admirers:  He will be welcomed anywhere men and woman of 
>>>>> >>character
>>>>> >>are
>>>>> >>valued.  Clinton was NOT a man of good character.  He boffed an
>>>>> >>intern,
>>>>> >>making a mockery of his marriage and then committed felony perjury
>>>>> >>afterward.  Bush has acted as an honorable gentleman since taking 
>>>>> >>the
>>>>> oath
>>>>> >>of office -- the assessment of his misguided critics 
>>>>> >>notwithstanding.
>>>>> >>
>>>>> >>Hope that helps with your confusion.
>>>>> >>
>>>>> >>Merry Christmas,   -T
>>>>> >>----- Original Message -----
>>>>> >>From: <nickgier at adelphia.net>
>>>>> >>To: <vision2020 at moscow.com>
>>>>> >>Sent: Wednesday, December 06, 2006 10:42 AM
>>>>> >>Subject: [Vision2020] Clinton Swarmed in Hanoi
>>>>> >>
>>>>> >>
>>>>> >> > Greetings:
>>>>> >> >
>>>>> >> > Someone on this list predicted that Bush would be swarmed 
>>>>> >> > whereever
>>>>> men
>>>>> >>of
>>>>> >> > character are admired.  I would like to know where that foreign
>>>>> >> > place
>>>>> >> > would be?
>>>>> >> >
>>>>> >> > Nick Gier
>>>>> >> >
>>>>> >> > Admirers Swarm Former Clinton in Hanoi
>>>>> >> > Wednesday, December 6, 2006 8:08 AM EST
>>>>> >> > The Associated Press
>>>>> >> > By BEN STOCKING
>>>>> >> >
>>>>> >> > HANOI, Vietnam (AP) â?" Former President Clinton was swarmed for
>>>>> >>autographs,
>>>>> >> > handshakes and photographs on the streets of Hanoi Wednesday by
>>>>> throngs
>>>>> >>of
>>>>> >> > admirers whose warm welcome contrasted sharply with the 
>>>>> >> > restrained
>>>>> >> > reception given President Bush last month.
>>>>> >> >
>>>>> >> > Clinton, in town to sign an agreement between his foundation and
>>>>> >> > the
>>>>> >> > Vietnamese to get more AIDS drugs to children, left the Hilton
>>>>> >> > Hotel
>>>>> in
>>>>> >> > the center of Hanoi, crossed an intersection buzzing with
>>>>> >> > motorbikes,
>>>>> >>and
>>>>> >> > strolled toward Hoan Kiem Lake, the spiritual heart of the city.
>>>>> >> >
>>>>> >> > The United States normalized relations with its former foe under
>>>>> >>Clinton,
>>>>> >> > who was greeted by adoring crowds when in 2000 he became the 
>>>>> >> > first
>>>>> U.S.
>>>>> >> > president to visit Vietnam since the war ended in 1975.
>>>>> >> >
>>>>> >> > "It feels great to be back," Clinton said as he set off for his
>>>>> stroll.
>>>>> >> >
>>>>> >> > The feeling among most Vietnamese was mutual.
>>>>> >> >
>>>>> >> > "I love you!" a young man shouted, reaching over the crowd for a
>>>>> >> > handshake.
>>>>> >> >
>>>>> >> > "There are no words to describe how happy I am," squealed
>>>>> >> > 17-year-old
>>>>> >> > Nguyen Thu Hang, jumping up and down and clutching Clinton's
>>>>> >> > freshly
>>>>> >> > signed autograph. "I'm going to frame this and hang it on my
>>>>> >> > bedroom
>>>>> >> > wall!"
>>>>> >> >
>>>>> >> > Bush didn't emerge from inside tight security to mingle with 
>>>>> >> > crowds
>>>>> >>during
>>>>> >> > his four-day visit to attend the 21-nation Asia-Pacific Economic
>>>>> >> > Cooperation summit.
>>>>> >> >
>>>>> >> > Outside of official meetings, the president's touring included a
>>>>> >> > visit
>>>>> >>to
>>>>> >> > Vietnam's stock exchange, where he struck a gong to open a day of
>>>>> >>trading.
>>>>> >> > He then met with a group of Vietnamese and American businessmen.
>>>>> >> >
>>>>> >> > Clinton came to Hanoi to sign an agreement with the Vietnamese
>>>>> >>government
>>>>> >> > under which his Clinton Foundation will increase the amount of
>>>>> >> > pediatric
>>>>> >> > drugs it is providing to Vietnamese children living with HIV and
>>>>> >> > AIDS.
>>>>> >> >
>>>>> >> > The foundation provided medicine for 400 children in 2006, but
>>>>> >> > plans
>>>>> to
>>>>> >> > triple the number of children it is helping by the end of 2007.
>>>>> >> >
>>>>> >> > Followed by Secret Service agents and Vietnamese police, Clinton
>>>>> >> > stopped
>>>>> >> > along a half-mile route to chat with his Vietnamese admirers 
>>>>> >> > before
>>>>> >>making
>>>>> >> > his way to an art gallery in Hanoi's Old Quarter and then to the
>>>>> >> > tomb
>>>>> >> > of
>>>>> >> > Ho Chi Minh, who led Vietnam's communist revolution.
>>>>> >> >
>>>>> >> > After he and Health Minister Tran Thi Trung Chien signed the
>>>>> >> > pediatric
>>>>> >> > AIDS agreement, Clinton took part in a discussion about AIDS with
>>>>> >>several
>>>>> >> > university students and a young woman living with HIV.
>>>>> >> >
>>>>> >> > The Vietnamese government estimates that 260,000 Vietnamese 
>>>>> >> > people
>>>>> were
>>>>> >> > infected with HIV last year, but public health experts think the
>>>>> actual
>>>>> >> > number is higher. In Vietnam, most infections are linked to
>>>>> intravenous
>>>>> >> > drug use and unprotected sex for money.
>>>>> >> >
>>>>> >> > The Clinton Foundation's activities are being financed by 
>>>>> >> > UNITAID,
>>>>> >> > an
>>>>> >> > organization formed by France and 19 other nations that have
>>>>> >> > earmarked
>>>>> >> > a
>>>>> >> > small portion of their airline tax revenues for HIV/AIDS programs
>>>>> >> > in
>>>>> >> > developing countries.
>>>>> >> >
>>>>> >> > =======================================================
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>>>>> >> > serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.
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>>>>> >>
>>>>> >>
>>>>> >>=======================================================
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