[Vision2020] Inconvenient Truth -- What WE REALLY HAVE TO DO

[debismith at moscow.com]

And, as usual, Donovan-I-Know-It-All-Just-Ask-Me-Arnold has the only experience that counts. 
Donovan, Joe and the rest of us may be far-leftists, but you remain a self made idiot. Stop 
spouting and start using the good brain you were given. Give up attempting to zing your betters 
and listen for a flippin' change. You have not been everywhere, have not done everything, and 
your experience remains limited. Ask a question without asserting/inserting the appropriate 
response for a change? Just a suggestion...
Debi R-S

Date sent:      	Thu, 24 Aug 2006 17:13:29 -0700 (PDT)
From:           	Donovan Arnold <donovanjarnold2005 at yahoo.com>
To:             	Joe Campbell <joekc at adelphia.net>
Copies to:      	vision2020 at moscow.com, Nils Peterson 
<nils_peterson at wsu.edu>
Subject:        	Re: [Vision2020] Inconvenient Truth -- What WE REALLY HAVE TO 
DO

Joe,
  
  I have ridden enough buses to know that most people that ride the bus do so because it is 
their best or only option. 
  
  You are as inaccurate about the ridership of buses as you are of your own political standing. 
You are indeed a far leftest:
  
  
Economic Left/Right: -5.88
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -6.62
  That is a leftest, if not a socialist. You rank up there along with Mao Tse Tung and Lenin. 
  
  Best,
  
  _DJA

Joe Campbell <joekc at adelphia.net> wrote:  I might regret this in the morning BUT:

1/  I'm not a "far leftist." To suggest that I am shows just how far right  this country has gone. I 
love baseball, apple pie, hot dogs, and Subaru.

2/ In most semesters -- like this one -- the bus is my main form of transportation to work. And I 
work in another state!

3/  Come ride the bus with me, Donovan, and you'll see that, in Moscow at  least, "most 
people" do not ride it for "economic reasons." Some do but  most do not. I bet you'll have fun, 
too!

(Before responding to this last point recall that I actually ride the buses in Moscow and you do 
not. )

Best, Joe

---- Donovan Arnold  wrote: 

=============
I  said real ridership Joe. I did not say everyone. You and Niles on  occasion in Moscow is not 
real ridership. And I can tell you, most  people that ride a bus, train, subway, trolley etc. do so 
for economic  reasons. What is funny about some of you adult far leftists is that you  take a 
general statement, intended to be a general statement, and try  to prove it is an inaccurate 
statement by providing one or two  examples, out of billions of instances, in an attempt to 
disprove its  accuracy. Cows do not fly because you have see one catapulted across  the sky. 
It might be true in an instance or two, but for the most part,  cows don't fly. 
  
  
  Best,
  
  _DJA

Nils Peterson  wrote:  Actually, the bus is a "Third Place" in the way that the COOP deli and 
One
World are. People don't just ride, they enjoy one another and network. Now
if they just served refreshments...


On 8/24/06 12:04 PM, "Joe Campbell"  wrote:

> The funny thing, Donovan, is that both Nils and I ride the bus. Neither of us
> have to ride the bus out of economic necessity. Your comments are just funny!
> The fact is both Nils and I love to ride the bus and there are a bunch of
> others like us. I told you that on the next to last bus of the day from WSU
> yesterday there was standing room only.
> 
> --
> Joe Campbell
> 
> ---- Donovan Arnold  wrote:
> 
> =============
> Niles writes:
>   
>   
> "I doubt we'll find the political will to
> take the scale of actions Donovan suggests."
> 
> Niles, if we lack the will to do what it takes to save the Earth,
> then the Earth is surly doomed.
> 
> Dan Carscallen writes:
> 
> "Hey, you gotta start somewhere."
> 
> What's the point of building a catapult to go 1/4 the way
> across a canyon we must cross, you are better off staying where you are. We
> will
> not save the Earth if this generation does not do something drastic
> and soon. 
> 
> 
> The only reason buses have real ridership is because of economic
> necessity of the riders.
> 
> Nobody WANTS to ride a bus. They smell, they are crowded, unsafe, unclean,
> inconvenient, slow, and uncomfortable. People do it mostly because it is their
> best
> option, not because they are trying to save the Earth.
> 
> If you really want to raise bus ridership raise gas prices, make them clean,
> safer, more convenient, and much more comfortable. Add cushy seats that have
> online access, more buses, more locations, and give them their own lane.
> 
> For Moscow, a trolley on the old railroad tracks would work nicely.
> 
> Best,
> 
> _DJA
> 
> 
> 
>   
> 
> Nils Peterson  wrote:  Thanks Dan for sharing
> information on Valley Transit ridership. I understand
> that they have a new route for commuters from Lewiston to Moscow. Perhaps we
> need periodic reminders of the data that these systems are growing.
> 
> And thanks for pointing out that we can, and need, to start small -- because
> without that personal action, I doubt we'll find the political will to take
> the scale of actions Donovan suggests.
> 
> 
> On 8/24/06 8:13 AM, "areaman> wrote:
> Donovan says:
> "You guys are thinking so small, so tiny. It doesn't help save the earth
> even a day to do these tiny things."
> 
> Hey, you gotta start somewhere.
> 
> An aside to Joe:  Believe you me, my good buddy Tom LaPointe is getting
> the word out there as far as Moscow Valley Transit is concerned.  Would
> he like more people to ride the bus?  Heck yes, but I'm here to tell you
> that I've seen charts and graphs and whatnot presented by Tom that shows
> nothing but increasing ridership for Moscow Valley Transit.  While I'm
> not a guy who would normally ride the bus -- various reasons, including
> a short bicycle or motorcycle commute to work -- I'm all in favor of
> having that option for people.
> 
> DC
> 
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