[Vision2020] Flag burning

Fri Aug 18 21:08:42 PDT 2006

Paul, thanks for a heartfelt and eloquent argument against criminalizing 
flag burning.  Burning the flag is a distasteful, insensitive, incendiary 
(no pun intended) thing to do, but it cannot be made to be illegal.  If bad 
behavior and boarishness were suddenly criminalized, why, my goodness . . . 
the very culture of Moscow would be changed.

Thanks for your weighing in,

keely

From: Paul Rumelhart <godshatter at yahoo.com>
To: Matt Decker <mattd2107 at hotmail.com>
CC: vision2020 at moscow.com
Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Flag burning (was West of Paris, Grand Opening)
Date: Fri, 18 Aug 2006 19:36:31 -0700

How is it any different than somebody simply stating their dissent for
our government's actions?  Clearly, that is covered by the
Constitution.  How soon would somebody be making the argument, if there
was a flag burning amendment passed, that stating your dissent is
synonymous with burning the flag and is therefore no longer
Constitutionally protected?

The ideal of Freedom of Speech is worth a million flags being burned.

There is also another reason I don't like the idea of a law or an
amendment to make burning the flag a crime.  To do so is to make
legislation on the basis of emotion, not reason.  Assuming the flag is
burned safely, there is absolutely no logical reason I can think of why
it should be treated any differently than burning some old sheets or
something.  Emotionally, it makes a visual statement that is powerful.
But rationally, it simply sends a message.  No different than a blog
entry or one of those JibJab videos that went around the Internet at the
last election.  I don't want legislators acting from emotion, I want
them planning ahead and thinking about the consequences of their
actions.  But that's just me.

Paul

Matt Decker wrote:

 > Paul,
 >
 > Symbolic expression? What? Our enemies burn flags and our citizens
 > should not take note, but rather have rational discussion, such as the
 > great Martin Lurther King did. I don't recall him burning flags all in
 > the great name of symbolic distaste of our country. I agree that flag
 > burning is an expression of opinion, but it doesn't make it right. Its
 > time to make this practice illegal.
 >
 > The day that I'll agree with this practice is the day you agree that
 > every willing citizen we be able to take a pop shot at the burners
 > face. Veterens will get two.
 >
 > "Frothing" flag lover out.
 > Matt
 >
 >
 >> From: Paul Rumelhart <godshatter at yahoo.com>
 >> To: vision2020 at moscow.com
 >> Subject: Re: [Vision2020] West of Paris, Grand Opening
 >> Date: Fri, 18 Aug 2006 08:26:45 -0700
 >>
 >> Also, burning the flag is a symbolic statement and an expression of
 >> an opinion.  Are we such a weak country that we can't take a little
 >> mockery?  That a statement like that would have us frothing at the
 >> mouth and overreacting to it?  I thought we were more sensible than
 >> that.
 >>
 >> If a person can't express their dissent in a supposedly free country,
 >> then that country is no longer free.
 >>
 >> Maybe we should be listening to them, just to make sure they don't
 >> have a valid point.  If they do, then maybe we should try to fix the
 >> problem instead of banning the expression of it.
 >>
 >> Paul
 >>
 >> Joe Campbell wrote:
 >>
 >>> Matt,
 >>>
 >>> I agree that burning the flag is wrong, plain and simple. But as
 >>> Andreas points out, a law against such actions would be counter to
 >>> both the Constitution and the very principles of freedom on which
 >>> this country is built. That seems like a much greater wrong.
 >>>
 >>> Furthermore, my guess is that, were a law against flag burning
 >>> passed, it would only increase the number of flag's burned. Does
 >>> anyone know the number of flags that have been burned in, say, the
 >>> last year? I bet it is relatively small. But think of how many
 >>> people would burn flags in protest of an anti-flag-burning law.
 >>>
 >>> If you could explain to me what purpose we'd achieve by passing such
 >>> a law, I'd be grateful. On the face of it, it seems like a really
 >>> bad idea.
 >>>
 >>> --
 >>> Joe Campbell
 >>>
 >>> ---- Matt Decker <mattd2107 at hotmail.com> wrote:
 >>>
 >>> =============
 >>> Or it could be that burning the flag is wrong, plain and simple.
 >>> Maybe they are wasting one but Ill take that one day for doing the
 >>> right thing and fixing what should have done the first time.
 >>>
 >>>
 >>>
 >>>
 >>>> From: "Andreas Schou" <ophite at gmail.com>
 >>>> To: "Matt Decker" <mattd2107 at hotmail.com>
 >>>> CC: vision2020 at moscow.com
 >>>> Subject: Re: [Vision2020] West of Paris, Grand Opening
 >>>> Date: Thu, 17 Aug 2006 22:49:11 -0700
 >>>>
 >>>> On 8/17/06, Matt Decker <mattd2107 at hotmail.com> wrote:
 >>>>
 >>>>
 >>>>> Mr. London,
 >>>>>
 >>>>> And just as they should. Why shouldn't the congress take one day
 >>>>> out of
 >>>>> their schedule in order to make flag burning an offense?
 >>>>>
 >>>>>
 >>>> Because doing so is taking a day out of their schedule to violate or,
 >>>> alternatively, create exceptions to the Constitution which they have
 >>>> all sworn to uphold? I don't know. Could be that.
 >>>>
 >>>> -- ACS
 >>>>
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 >>
 >
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