[Vision2020] Nick, Saundra and the Princess
Tony Simpson
tonytime at clearwire.net
Tue Aug 15 16:41:14 PDT 2006
Hon Keely,
If I was editor of the Right Wing Majority and the tale of your handsprings
were related to be by my plumber, I would quote him verbatim or not run with
the story at all. Bear in mind though that notions of fairness and accuracy
have some meaning to me. Apparently in your case they are hollow slogans.
Giving up on the enablers of yellow journalists, --Tony
----- Original Message -----
From: "keely emerinemix" <kjajmix1 at msn.com>
To: <tonytime at clearwire.net>
Sent: Tuesday, August 15, 2006 9:52 AM
Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Nick, Saundra and the Princess
> My last word on the subject: if you your info was false, and you got the
> info about my "Battle Hymn" walkabout from your plumber or a drinking
> buddy, I'd be able to sue you if, as editor of the Right-Wing Fringe, you
> printed it. That would be actionable if it were false, not actionable if
> it were true -- truth being one of the five classic defenses of libel.
>
> On the other hand, if it were true AND you got the information from Sgt.
> Bob of the MPD, you're in the clear -- and if it were false, and you got
> the false info from Sgt. Bob of the MPD, you'd be protected (unless you
> knew the info was false) and I'd be suing him.
>
> And now I'm off to do things slightly more productive than engaging with
> someone who calls me "Hon" .. . .
>
> keely
>
>
> From: "Tony Simpson" <tonytime at clearwire.net>
> To: "keely emerinemix" <kjajmix1 at msn.com>
> CC: <vision2020 at moscow.com>
> Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Nick, Saundra and the Princess
> Date: Tue, 15 Aug 2006 07:49:47 -0700
>
> Well Keely, I guess I'll have to give you credit where credit is due. You
> are relentless if not honest or fair minded. You insist that newspapers
> are not responsible for what they publish so long as they didn't come up
> with the material themselves but simply regurgitated it off the Associated
> Press wire.
>
> Bill Hall already tried to run that con on me years ago Dear. It was
> disingenuous and unprofessional then as it is today. If you did not have
> the characteristically low ethical threshold of the typical liberal
> journalist, you would recognize how cruel and unfair such a position is.
>
> Under your vicious rules, it would be entirely permissible, ethical and
> appropriate for me to disseminate to 36000 households the "news" that
> Keely Mix was arrested after walking buck naked on her hands through
> Friendship Square, whistling the Battle Hymm of the Republic, so long as I
> got the information elsewhere.
>
> Are you serious Hon, or are you that mercenary?
>
> Newspaper editors and owners who know the difference between right and
> wrong understand that they are responsible for the accuracy and fairness
> of EVERYTHING they print and distribute, regardless of where it originated
> from. It is just this, "Let us do whatever we want--malign anyone we
> want--and not be held accountable" routine, which has eroded the public's
> trust in the old media and fed the popularity of alternative news sources.
>
> You insist that the specific sources allegedly behind "most studies",
> "prominent researchers", and "sources who chose to remain anonymous", are
> known to the editors. That's bullshit Keely. You know it, I know it, the
> bulk of the public knows it, and it's time you stopped attempting to
> mislead them otherwise. If such were the case, why not simply name the
> individuals or studies in question? I know, being the leftist media
> apologizer that you are, you won't answer that question honestly, so I
> will. It's because, as Jimmy Breslin pointed out on the Tonight Show
> years ago, "The reported made it up."
>
> You dare to malign the public as "pajama--clad masses in the blogosphere"
> while singing the praises of a mythical media which adheres staunchly to
> self imposed standards of fairness and objectivity. Gag me with a spoon,
> Keely. That dog won't hunt, bark, roll over or crap in the corner, and we
> all know it. The bloggers you so dismissively sniff at exhibit far more
> regard for fairness and accuracy than the print media you so self
> servingly apologize for.
>
> Before you once again belly up to the keyboard, you may wish to dispense
> with the mascara and everything and enroll in an ethics course instead.
>
> Refusing to allow arrogant liars to con the public, --Tony
> ----- Original Message ----- From: "keely emerinemix" <kjajmix1 at msn.com>
> To: <tonytime at clearwire.net>
> Cc: <vision2020 at moscow.com>
> Sent: Tuesday, August 15, 2006 5:33 AM
> Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Nick, Saundra and the Princess
>
>
>>The Tribune and other papers that don't report themselves on matters of
>>national security rarely use sources who speak on condition of anonymity,
>>and the experts/critics/studies referred to are generally attributed in
>>the story or, at the very least, are available to editors who hold
>>reporters accountable for their accuracy in quoting sources. And if you
>>read "studies have shown that an all-donut diet increase the risk of
>>obesity," do you really require a specific study to reference if the story
>>then quotes physicians, nutritionists, and fat people?
>>
>>The presence of editors and a professional standard is what separates real
>>journalists from the pajama-clad masses in the blogosphere. Nothing
>>against jammies or the people in them, but it ain't journalism.
>>
>>Fully attired for the day, with mascara and everything,
>>
>>keely
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>From: "Tony Simpson" <tonytime at clearwire.net>
>>To: "keely emerinemix" <kjajmix1 at msn.com>
>>CC: <vision2020 at moscow.com>
>>Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Nick, Saundra and the Princess
>>Date: Mon, 14 Aug 2006 23:11:35 -0700
>>
>>Anonymous sources RARE in the mainstream media? Keely, are you kidding
>>me? The Lewiston Tribune relies on them on nearly a daily basis. We are
>>advised that such and such is so because "critics say", "experts agree",
>>"studies have shown", a source spoke on "condition of anonymity" and so
>>forth. I read these ALL THE TIME. I would expect you to defend the press
>>as you come from a family of journalists, but refusing to acknowledge an
>>obvious reality because it would require some introspection is hardly
>>honest or constructive.
>>
>>Also, I am not a "hater" of the mainstream press simply because I expect
>>them to live up to their own professional standards. It is not
>>unreasonable for people to expect reporters and editors not to inject
>>their personal opinion off the editorial page by attributing it
>>dishonestly to non existent sources or by couching it under the phony
>>heading "analysis".
>>
>>Patiently waiting for you to acknowledge the legitimacy of this fair
>>minded and rational critique, --Tony
>>
>>
>>----- Original Message ----- From: "keely emerinemix" <kjajmix1 at msn.com>
>>To: <tonytime at clearwire.net>
>>Cc: <vision2020 at moscow.com>
>>Sent: Monday, August 14, 2006 5:35 PM
>>Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Nick, Saundra and the Princess
>>
>>
>>>I'd like to think, Tony, that my heart is in the right place even when
>>>defending people who aren't my friends...
>>>
>>>You say I reciprocated un-Christlike and snotty behavior in addressing
>>>the Princess. Really? "Princess LackingHuevos" really got to you, huh?
>>>Do you think that perhaps a precedent in silly namecalling was set by me
>>>or by the one who embraces "Princess Sushitushi" in his/her writing? I
>>>acknowledge having a serrated edge up my sleeve at times, but I only
>>>employ it when responding to the brethren, and only when they set the
>>>tone.
>>>
>>>Second, I am a former newspaper reporter and a third-generation print
>>>journalist. Very few of the "mainstream media" rely on anonymous sources
>>>for most of their reporting, although the bloggers tend to regurgitate a
>>>lot of whatever gets through their Internet connections. Attribution is
>>>hammered into the press from the beginning; no one takes seriously
>>>information relayed by the reporter who can't or won't tell where she/he
>>>got it from. This means that I don't report, for example, that Tony
>>>Simpson is Conservative Thought Czar of the Clearwater Valley -- instead,
>>>I, as a journalist, would report that former CTC of the CV Bud
>>>Blatherholler had anointed him thusly at the group's annual convention.
>>>The "who, what, when, where, and why" doesn't get to be dreamed up by the
>>>reporter; the reporter gathers the five Ws from sources, almost all of
>>>whom are identified almost all of the time. There are, of course,
>>>exceptions, but anonymity as a rule just doesn't cut it in the reputable
>>>media.
>>>
>>>Now, I realize you don't care one whit what I think or say about the
>>>media -- it's just that I owe it to my dad and grandfather to try to
>>>defend the press against rabid haters of "the mainstream media." I may
>>>be funny that way, but I prefer to get my news through the MSM than
>>>through the blogosphere, especially given Dale Courtney's recent -- nay,
>>>perennial --
>>>missteps in the field of truth-seeking and news reporting.
>>>
>>>But hey, that's just me. And you certainly are entitled to rely on
>>>whatever sources you want -- but as a defender of ultimate truth and
>>>standards of behavior, you might want to examine your bias a bit more
>>>carefully.
>>>
>>>keely
>>>
>>>
>>>From: "Tony Simpson" <tonytime at clearwire.net>
>>>To: "keely emerinemix" <kjajmix1 at msn.com>
>>>CC: <vision2020 at moscow.com>
>>>Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Nick, Saundra and the Princess
>>>Date: Mon, 14 Aug 2006 13:33:49 -0700
>>>
>>>Keely,
>>>
>>>My post which offended you was merely a request for a specific response
>>>to an argument rather than an ad hominem (sp?) tirade. This was a
>>>reasonable request. As an intellectual you should appreciate my concern
>>>here. But you were defending a friend or two, so your heart was in the
>>>right place.
>>>
>>>Curious about two things you touched upon...... 1) Why do you condemn
>>>Tanaka as un Christ--like because she uses on occasion, "snotty
>>>rejoinders", when you, Keely, have just finished referring to Tanaka in a
>>>decidedly un Christian and "snotty" manner? Consistency is crucial
>>>Keely.
>>>
>>>2) The distatste expressed by you and crew on this forum for views
>>>expressed anonymously would seem to preclude your consideration of half
>>>of what you read in the newspaper and periodicals. They rely heavily on
>>>anonymous sources. Do you summarily disregard "news" reports relying in
>>>whole on charges leveled by thoose who would "prefer to remain
>>>anonymous"? Just seeking clarification.
>>>
>>>Enjoy the palouse summer. I am insanely jealous.
>>>--Tony
>>>----- Original Message ----- From: "keely emerinemix" <kjajmix1 at msn.com>
>>>To: <tonytime at clearwire.net>; <sslund at adelphia.net>
>>>Cc: <vision2020 at moscow.com>
>>>Sent: Monday, August 14, 2006 9:00 AM
>>>Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Nick, Saundra and the Princess
>>>
>>>
>>>>As someone who owes her very life to Christ's atonement on the cross --
>>>>yep, body piercing saved my life! -- I have a few thoughts:
>>>>
>>>>I've been staying out of this thread not because of disinterest -- some
>>>>of you may recall that I have rather strong views on religion -- but
>>>>because I'm up to mine in alligators trying to coordinate the
>>>>remodelling of a house, find a renter for our apartment, and accommodate
>>>>yet another wave of houseguests. It's one of the few times in my life
>>>>when I've been too busy to wade in to something that matters greatly to
>>>>me. But before the painter requires my attention this morning, I'd like
>>>>to make a few points, provoked as I am by Tony's response to Saundra,
>>>>below.
>>>>
>>>>It shouldn't come as a surprise to anyone that I am in near total
>>>>agreement with the theology espoused by Princess LackingHuevos, who, in
>>>>his/her anonymity, has done an able job of defending the classic,
>>>>orthodox Christian doctrine of Christ's atonement on the cross. I
>>>>could, however, do without the Princess' continued harangue toward my
>>>>friend Nick Gier, who doesn't agree with the classic, orthodox Christian
>>>>doctrine of Christ's atonement -- in fact, he finds it rather
>>>>off-putting. Why this surprises, much less offends, the Princess would
>>>>be puzzling were it not for said royalty's history of disrespect and
>>>>rudeness toward those who hold to beliefs he doesn't, both from inside
>>>>or outside of the fold. I think it's clear to all that while Sushitushi
>>>>is an apt defender of the doctrines of the faith, the tone taken
>>>>indicates that he/she is also a poor imitator of the One those doctrines
>>>>point to.
>>>>
>>>>Nick Gier isn't a Christian. That's not a judgment on my part; it's not
>>>>to say that he's not kind, gracious, loving, gentle and merciful. He is
>>>>all of those things, as are many people who don't claim Christ as their
>>>>Savior. Those who call on the name of the Lord Jesus are rightfully
>>>>counted as Christians, and those who don't, aren't. If Nick has made it
>>>>clear that he has found satisfaction and solace in other faith
>>>>traditions apart from the essential doctrines of Christianity, then why
>>>>would anyone who claims to be a Christian take such a nasty approach in
>>>>acknowledging their doctrinal differences? This isn't the pastor of
>>>>First Evangelical Christian Community Tabernacle who's denying the
>>>>historic teachings of the faith -- that would be worrisome -- but a
>>>>scholar who is not a professing Christian. Nick Gier isn't an "enemy"
>>>>who needs to be contained or disarmed. He's a man who believes that the
>>>>things Sushitushi believes are lacking in reason, distasteful, or, for
>>>>whatever reason, simply not for him. There is nothing about that that
>>>>should invite snotty, mocking rejoinders from those who do believe.
>>>>Nick and I are friends; he admires me and I admire him, even as we
>>>>disagree on virtually every point of evangelical theology. God forbid I
>>>>should attempt to assert my "rightness" apart from common decency or
>>>>Spirit-filled righteousness.
>>>>
>>>>Now, I don't know if the Princess is Doug Jones, Chris Witmer, Ben
>>>>Merkle or any other leader or defender of the Kirk. I don't much care.
>>>>I do lament that the Princess is unable to fairly and honestly belly up
>>>>to the bar by using his/her real name, but I suppose it's tempting to
>>>>want to revel in rudeness without the messy consequences of doing so
>>>>without the cloak of anonymity. His arguments might be mature and
>>>>well-thought out, but it's a little difficult to be swayed by someone
>>>>who can't bring him/herself to using their given moniker. And I'm
>>>>assuming it's someone from the Kirk, because of the fervor of support
>>>>for the leadership and, sadly, because of the cogency of the argument --
>>>>most evangelical churches have not raised an army of able, apt defenders
>>>>of the Gospel, and if they did, I imagine they'd be glowing with pride
>>>>and unable to do so anonymously.
>>>>
>>>>In my reading over the weekend, I came upon something that I think puts
>>>>it all into context far better than I have, and will perhaps be a
>>>>benefit to those who practice imprecatory prayer, are dismissive of
>>>>their theological "enemies," and exalt classical academia over common
>>>>decency:
>>>>
>>>>"Bless those who persecute you, don't curse them, pray that God will
>>>>bless them. Be happy with those who are happy, and weep with those who
>>>>weep. Live in harmony with each other. Don't be too proud to enjoy the
>>>>company of ordinary people. And don't think you know it all! Never pay
>>>>back evil with more evil. Do things in such a way that everyone can see
>>>>you are honorable. Do all that you can to live in peace with everyone .
>>>>. . " (Romans 12:14-18)
>>>>
>>>>keely
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>From: "Tony Simpson" <tonytime at clearwire.net>
>>>>To: "Saundra Lund" <sslund at adelphia.net>
>>>>CC: vision2020 at moscow.com
>>>>Subject: Re: [Vision2020] True Muslims and True Americans
>>>>Date: Mon, 14 Aug 2006 02:08:38 -0700
>>>>
>>>>WOW SAUNDRA, you rail on for the bulk of your post at Taro Tanaka
>>>>without
>>>>ever ONCE addressing the very thoughtful arguments she presented.
>>>>What's
>>>>the problem Dear? Out of your intellectual league?
>>>>
>>>>Fed up with the enemies of reason, --Tony
>>>>----- Original Message -----
>>>>From: "Saundra Lund" <sslund at adelphia.net>
>>>>To: <vision2020 at moscow.com>
>>>>Sent: Saturday, August 12, 2006 9:42 AM
>>>>Subject: Re: [Vision2020] True Muslims and True Americans
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> > "Taro Tankara" aka "Princess Sushitushi" aka "Princess Camera-Shy"
>>>> > aka
>>>> > "Princess Who Rushes in Where Trespassers Fear to Tread" aka "Prince
>>>> > >
>>>>Pay
>>>> > No
>>>> > Attention to the Man Behind the Curtain" aka "Prince Late-for-Dinner"
>>>> > >
>>>>aka
>>>> > "Prince in One Hour or You Don't Pay!" aka "Princess
>>>> > Putnotthytrustinprinces" aka "Prince Albasilas Monachus" aka "The
>>>>Princess
>>>> > Formerly Known as Prince" aka "Prince McPauper" aka "Princess >
>>>>Forlornia,
>>>> > Ever Hopeful Frog Kisser" aka "Shining Prince Stanley Nicholson
>>>> > Genji"
>>>>aka
>>>> > "Prince Eduardo Cigarro" wrote:
>>>> > "I'm almost afraid to reply to Nick, because each time he comes back
>>>> > >
>>>>with
>>>> > something nuttier than before."
>>>> >
>>>> > No, sorry -- that would be Taro Tanaka with the multitude of alias, >
>>>>none
>>>> > of
>>>> > which are real names.
>>>> >
>>>> > This V2020 poster reminds me of one of the Edna's -- the one who >
>>>>couldn't
>>>> > decide whether to post as a male or female.
>>>> >
>>>> > One who hasn't made the leap of faith to accept God's grace might
>>>>conclude
>>>> > that it is Christianity, rather than cowards afraid to sign their own
>>>> > names,
>>>> > that causes gender confusion ;-)
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> > JMHO,
>>>> > Saundra Lund
>>>> > Moscow, ID
>>>> >
>>>> > The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good people
>>>> > to >
>>>>do
>>>> > nothing.
>>>> > - Edmund Burke
>>>> >
>>>> > ***** Original material contained herein is Copyright 2006, Saundra >
>>>>Lund.
>>>> > Do not copy, forward, excerpt, or reproduce outside the Vision 2020 >
>>>>forum
>>>> > without the express written permission of the author.*****
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> > =======================================================
>>>> > List services made available by First Step Internet,
>>>> > serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.
>>>> > http://www.fsr.net
>>>> > mailto:Vision2020 at moscow.com
>>>> > =======================================================
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>=======================================================
>>>> List services made available by First Step Internet,
>>>> serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.
>>>> http://www.fsr.net
>>>> mailto:Vision2020 at moscow.com
>>>>=======================================================
>>>>
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>>>>
>>>
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>>>
>>
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