[Vision2020] Nick, Saundra and the Princess
keely emerinemix
kjajmix1 at msn.com
Tue Aug 15 05:33:22 PDT 2006
The Tribune and other papers that don't report themselves on matters of
national security rarely use sources who speak on condition of anonymity,
and the experts/critics/studies referred to are generally attributed in the
story or, at the very least, are available to editors who hold reporters
accountable for their accuracy in quoting sources. And if you read "studies
have shown that an all-donut diet increase the risk of obesity," do you
really require a specific study to reference if the story then quotes
physicians, nutritionists, and fat people?
The presence of editors and a professional standard is what separates real
journalists from the pajama-clad masses in the blogosphere. Nothing against
jammies or the people in them, but it ain't journalism.
Fully attired for the day, with mascara and everything,
keely
From: "Tony Simpson" <tonytime at clearwire.net>
To: "keely emerinemix" <kjajmix1 at msn.com>
CC: <vision2020 at moscow.com>
Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Nick, Saundra and the Princess
Date: Mon, 14 Aug 2006 23:11:35 -0700
Anonymous sources RARE in the mainstream media? Keely, are you kidding me?
The Lewiston Tribune relies on them on nearly a daily basis. We are advised
that such and such is so because "critics say", "experts agree", "studies
have shown", a source spoke on "condition of anonymity" and so forth. I
read these ALL THE TIME. I would expect you to defend the press as you come
from a family of journalists, but refusing to acknowledge an obvious reality
because it would require some introspection is hardly honest or
constructive.
Also, I am not a "hater" of the mainstream press simply because I expect
them to live up to their own professional standards. It is not unreasonable
for people to expect reporters and editors not to inject their personal
opinion off the editorial page by attributing it dishonestly to non existent
sources or by couching it under the phony heading "analysis".
Patiently waiting for you to acknowledge the legitimacy of this fair minded
and rational critique, --Tony
----- Original Message ----- From: "keely emerinemix" <kjajmix1 at msn.com>
To: <tonytime at clearwire.net>
Cc: <vision2020 at moscow.com>
Sent: Monday, August 14, 2006 5:35 PM
Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Nick, Saundra and the Princess
>I'd like to think, Tony, that my heart is in the right place even when
>defending people who aren't my friends...
>
>You say I reciprocated un-Christlike and snotty behavior in addressing the
>Princess. Really? "Princess LackingHuevos" really got to you, huh? Do
>you think that perhaps a precedent in silly namecalling was set by me or by
>the one who embraces "Princess Sushitushi" in his/her writing? I
>acknowledge having a serrated edge up my sleeve at times, but I only employ
>it when responding to the brethren, and only when they set the tone.
>
>Second, I am a former newspaper reporter and a third-generation print
>journalist. Very few of the "mainstream media" rely on anonymous sources
>for most of their reporting, although the bloggers tend to regurgitate a
>lot of whatever gets through their Internet connections. Attribution is
>hammered into the press from the beginning; no one takes seriously
>information relayed by the reporter who can't or won't tell where she/he
>got it from. This means that I don't report, for example, that Tony
>Simpson is Conservative Thought Czar of the Clearwater Valley -- instead,
>I, as a journalist, would report that former CTC of the CV Bud
>Blatherholler had anointed him thusly at the group's annual convention. The
>"who, what, when, where, and why" doesn't get to be dreamed up by the
>reporter; the reporter gathers the five Ws from sources, almost all of whom
>are identified almost all of the time. There are, of course, exceptions,
>but anonymity as a rule just doesn't cut it in the reputable media.
>
>Now, I realize you don't care one whit what I think or say about the media
>-- it's just that I owe it to my dad and grandfather to try to defend the
>press against rabid haters of "the mainstream media." I may be funny that
>way, but I prefer to get my news through the MSM than through the
>blogosphere, especially given Dale Courtney's recent -- nay, perennial --
>missteps in the field of truth-seeking and news reporting.
>
>But hey, that's just me. And you certainly are entitled to rely on
>whatever sources you want -- but as a defender of ultimate truth and
>standards of behavior, you might want to examine your bias a bit more
>carefully.
>
>keely
>
>
>From: "Tony Simpson" <tonytime at clearwire.net>
>To: "keely emerinemix" <kjajmix1 at msn.com>
>CC: <vision2020 at moscow.com>
>Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Nick, Saundra and the Princess
>Date: Mon, 14 Aug 2006 13:33:49 -0700
>
>Keely,
>
>My post which offended you was merely a request for a specific response to
>an argument rather than an ad hominem (sp?) tirade. This was a reasonable
>request. As an intellectual you should appreciate my concern here. But
>you were defending a friend or two, so your heart was in the right place.
>
>Curious about two things you touched upon...... 1) Why do you condemn
>Tanaka as un Christ--like because she uses on occasion, "snotty
>rejoinders", when you, Keely, have just finished referring to Tanaka in a
>decidedly un Christian and "snotty" manner? Consistency is crucial Keely.
>
>2) The distatste expressed by you and crew on this forum for views
>expressed anonymously would seem to preclude your consideration of half of
>what you read in the newspaper and periodicals. They rely heavily on
>anonymous sources. Do you summarily disregard "news" reports relying in
>whole on charges leveled by thoose who would "prefer to remain anonymous"?
>Just seeking clarification.
>
>Enjoy the palouse summer. I am insanely jealous.
>--Tony
>----- Original Message ----- From: "keely emerinemix" <kjajmix1 at msn.com>
>To: <tonytime at clearwire.net>; <sslund at adelphia.net>
>Cc: <vision2020 at moscow.com>
>Sent: Monday, August 14, 2006 9:00 AM
>Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Nick, Saundra and the Princess
>
>
>>As someone who owes her very life to Christ's atonement on the cross --
>>yep, body piercing saved my life! -- I have a few thoughts:
>>
>>I've been staying out of this thread not because of disinterest -- some of
>>you may recall that I have rather strong views on religion -- but because
>>I'm up to mine in alligators trying to coordinate the remodelling of a
>>house, find a renter for our apartment, and accommodate yet another wave
>>of houseguests. It's one of the few times in my life when I've been too
>>busy to wade in to something that matters greatly to me. But before the
>>painter requires my attention this morning, I'd like to make a few points,
>>provoked as I am by Tony's response to Saundra, below.
>>
>>It shouldn't come as a surprise to anyone that I am in near total
>>agreement with the theology espoused by Princess LackingHuevos, who, in
>>his/her anonymity, has done an able job of defending the classic, orthodox
>>Christian doctrine of Christ's atonement on the cross. I could, however,
>>do without the Princess' continued harangue toward my friend Nick Gier,
>>who doesn't agree with the classic, orthodox Christian doctrine of
>>Christ's atonement -- in fact, he finds it rather off-putting. Why this
>>surprises, much less offends, the Princess would be puzzling were it not
>>for said royalty's history of disrespect and rudeness toward those who
>>hold to beliefs he doesn't, both from inside or outside of the fold. I
>>think it's clear to all that while Sushitushi is an apt defender of the
>>doctrines of the faith, the tone taken indicates that he/she is also a
>>poor imitator of the One those doctrines point to.
>>
>>Nick Gier isn't a Christian. That's not a judgment on my part; it's not
>>to say that he's not kind, gracious, loving, gentle and merciful. He is
>>all of those things, as are many people who don't claim Christ as their
>>Savior. Those who call on the name of the Lord Jesus are rightfully
>>counted as Christians, and those who don't, aren't. If Nick has made it
>>clear that he has found satisfaction and solace in other faith traditions
>>apart from the essential doctrines of Christianity, then why would anyone
>>who claims to be a Christian take such a nasty approach in acknowledging
>>their doctrinal differences? This isn't the pastor of First Evangelical
>>Christian Community Tabernacle who's denying the historic teachings of the
>>faith -- that would be worrisome -- but a scholar who is not a professing
>>Christian. Nick Gier isn't an "enemy" who needs to be contained or
>>disarmed. He's a man who believes that the things Sushitushi believes are
>>lacking in reason, distasteful, or, for whatever reason, simply not for
>>him. There is nothing about that that should invite snotty, mocking
>>rejoinders from those who do believe. Nick and I are friends; he admires
>>me and I admire him, even as we disagree on virtually every point of
>>evangelical theology. God forbid I should attempt to assert my
>>"rightness" apart from common decency or Spirit-filled righteousness.
>>
>>Now, I don't know if the Princess is Doug Jones, Chris Witmer, Ben Merkle
>>or any other leader or defender of the Kirk. I don't much care. I do
>>lament that the Princess is unable to fairly and honestly belly up to the
>>bar by using his/her real name, but I suppose it's tempting to want to
>>revel in rudeness without the messy consequences of doing so without the
>>cloak of anonymity. His arguments might be mature and well-thought out,
>>but it's a little difficult to be swayed by someone who can't bring
>>him/herself to using their given moniker. And I'm assuming it's someone
>>from the Kirk, because of the fervor of support for the leadership and,
>>sadly, because of the cogency of the argument -- most evangelical churches
>>have not raised an army of able, apt defenders of the Gospel, and if they
>>did, I imagine they'd be glowing with pride and unable to do so
>>anonymously.
>>
>>In my reading over the weekend, I came upon something that I think puts it
>>all into context far better than I have, and will perhaps be a benefit to
>>those who practice imprecatory prayer, are dismissive of their theological
>>"enemies," and exalt classical academia over common decency:
>>
>>"Bless those who persecute you, don't curse them, pray that God will bless
>>them. Be happy with those who are happy, and weep with those who weep.
>>Live in harmony with each other. Don't be too proud to enjoy the company
>>of ordinary people. And don't think you know it all! Never pay back evil
>>with more evil. Do things in such a way that everyone can see you are
>>honorable. Do all that you can to live in peace with everyone . . . "
>>(Romans 12:14-18)
>>
>>keely
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>From: "Tony Simpson" <tonytime at clearwire.net>
>>To: "Saundra Lund" <sslund at adelphia.net>
>>CC: vision2020 at moscow.com
>>Subject: Re: [Vision2020] True Muslims and True Americans
>>Date: Mon, 14 Aug 2006 02:08:38 -0700
>>
>>WOW SAUNDRA, you rail on for the bulk of your post at Taro Tanaka without
>>ever ONCE addressing the very thoughtful arguments she presented. What's
>>the problem Dear? Out of your intellectual league?
>>
>>Fed up with the enemies of reason, --Tony
>>----- Original Message -----
>>From: "Saundra Lund" <sslund at adelphia.net>
>>To: <vision2020 at moscow.com>
>>Sent: Saturday, August 12, 2006 9:42 AM
>>Subject: Re: [Vision2020] True Muslims and True Americans
>>
>>
>> > "Taro Tankara" aka "Princess Sushitushi" aka "Princess Camera-Shy" aka
>> > "Princess Who Rushes in Where Trespassers Fear to Tread" aka "Prince >
>>Pay
>> > No
>> > Attention to the Man Behind the Curtain" aka "Prince Late-for-Dinner" >
>>aka
>> > "Prince in One Hour or You Don't Pay!" aka "Princess
>> > Putnotthytrustinprinces" aka "Prince Albasilas Monachus" aka "The
>>Princess
>> > Formerly Known as Prince" aka "Prince McPauper" aka "Princess >
>>Forlornia,
>> > Ever Hopeful Frog Kisser" aka "Shining Prince Stanley Nicholson Genji"
>>aka
>> > "Prince Eduardo Cigarro" wrote:
>> > "I'm almost afraid to reply to Nick, because each time he comes back >
>>with
>> > something nuttier than before."
>> >
>> > No, sorry -- that would be Taro Tanaka with the multitude of alias, >
>>none
>> > of
>> > which are real names.
>> >
>> > This V2020 poster reminds me of one of the Edna's -- the one who >
>>couldn't
>> > decide whether to post as a male or female.
>> >
>> > One who hasn't made the leap of faith to accept God's grace might
>>conclude
>> > that it is Christianity, rather than cowards afraid to sign their own
>> > names,
>> > that causes gender confusion ;-)
>> >
>> >
>> > JMHO,
>> > Saundra Lund
>> > Moscow, ID
>> >
>> > The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good people to
>> > >
>>do
>> > nothing.
>> > - Edmund Burke
>> >
>> > ***** Original material contained herein is Copyright 2006, Saundra >
>>Lund.
>> > Do not copy, forward, excerpt, or reproduce outside the Vision 2020 >
>>forum
>> > without the express written permission of the author.*****
>> >
>> >
>> > =======================================================
>> > List services made available by First Step Internet,
>> > serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.
>> > http://www.fsr.net
>> > mailto:Vision2020 at moscow.com
>> > =======================================================
>> >
>> >
>>
>>
>>=======================================================
>> List services made available by First Step Internet,
>> serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.
>> http://www.fsr.net
>> mailto:Vision2020 at moscow.com
>>=======================================================
>>
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