[Vision2020] Joan and Sunil
Phil Nisbet
pcnisbet1 at hotmail.com
Wed Nov 2 16:40:27 PST 2005
Neither one of you address the underlaying basics.
For Joan, how is it that we are supposed to get the warm and fuzzies about a
regime that has murdered by acts of judicial actions 4000 people in the last
26 years solely for the reason that they were gay?
Sunil, its wonderful to be understanding of all other peoples, but what if
the society in question feels perfectly free to stone to death a 13 year old
girl because she had a baby out of wedlock that was the result of a rape by
her older brother?
Its not Islam that is at issue, its the very strong extremist brand of that
religion that is. Iran is currently ruled by followers of a faith that
allows judicial murder of children for 'sex' crime. They are not just
chatting about stoning people to death, they are flat out stoning them.
They are cutting off the hands of kids for stealing. They are hanging kids
for drinking booze. At the same time they are encouraging people to
volunteer to become suicide bombers and pushing to get a nuclear weapon.
So, even if these guys were sitting on top of nothing but silica sand, they
would and should be a concern for the world and us in particular, since we
are identified by them as 'the Great Satan'.
Oil is the means they themselves are using to keep people backed off,
allowing them to run their nasty regime with threats and inducements of
cheaper crude. If they owned no oil, do you think that the nations of the
world would not respond to the kinds of judicial murder they are carrying
out? For one heck of a lot less than Iran is doing, the people's of the
world combined to bring down the government of South Africa.
Where is the similar outrage for the Iranian Regime?
Phil Nisbet
>From: "Phil Nisbet" <pcnisbet1 at hotmail.com>
>To: pkraut at moscow.com
>CC: vision2020 at moscow.com
>Subject: Re: [Vision2020] What just society does something like this?
>Date: Wed, 02 Nov 2005 09:27:29 -0800
>
>Pat
>
>http://www.wfafi.org/
>
>A group which is covering some of the violence and murder of women by the
>Iran regime.
>
>http://www.iranfocus.com/modules/news/article.php?storyid=137
>
>http://www.iranfocus.com/modules/news/article.php?storyid=634
>
>All I can say or think is what sort of insanity is it that allows the
>killing of children who have been abused by the system, beaten, raped and
>then stoned to death or hanged.
>
>I only hope that they will make the case of Zhila Izadyar, the poor little
>13 year old girl, one that will save her life.
>
>Phil Nisbet
>
>
>>From: "Pat Kraut" <pkraut at moscow.com>
>>To: "vision2020" <vision2020 at moscow.com>
>>Subject: Re: [Vision2020] What just society does something like this?
>>Date: Wed, 2 Nov 2005 08:25:32 -0800
>>
>>They wouldn't have any compassion as we know it for anyone else.
>>Especially
>>the Jews, but truly anyone. On Good morning America this AM they had the
>>woman who has stood up to her city council in Pakistan who gang raped her.
>>She is today's Rosa Parks and what she is doing will rock that world. I
>>believe that she knew, KNEW that the rest of the world would stand behind
>>her and if she could only get the press to tell her story she could change
>>the system. She is incredibly brave. I also think this is some of the
>>fallout from our taking on Saddam. It will give others the courage to face
>>their unfair systems and make very positive changes. I know people
>>involved
>>in Iran in a variety of ways and I think you can expect at some time some
>>inside changes in that country also. While I believe the press is very
>>selective in their stories this woman's story is one that they have helped
>>to promote.
>>----- Original Message -----
>>From: "Phil Nisbet" <pcnisbet1 at hotmail.com>
>>To: <pkraut at moscow.com>
>>Cc: <vision2020 at moscow.com>
>>Sent: Tuesday, November 01, 2005 11:05 PM
>>Subject: Re: [Vision2020] What just society does something like this?
>>
>>
>>Pat
>>
>>I looked all over the net to find what I could on the pictures. It seems
>>that its not what the intial reports claimed the pictures of the kid being
>>punished claimed.
>>
>>What I did find in relationship to punishment in Iran made the pictures of
>>the little boy look pretty tame, though.
>>
>>Currently under death sentence by stoning is a 13 year old girl who two
>>years ago was raped by her 15 year old brother. He got off scot free, but
>>she is to be stoned to death in a pit. 6 children under the age of 16
>>have
>>been executed in Iran this year.
>>
>>Being busted for drinking carries a 100 lash fine, beating with a wire
>>cable. You can be busted three times for the offense and then you are
>>hanged. One 19 year old suffered that fate, hanging, in July.
>>
>>They have hanged 4000 gays since 1979 in Iran according to Iran Human
>>Rights
>>Watch. In the case of Lesbians, just sleeping naked under the covers with
>>one of the same sex is enough to get you 100 lashes with a wire cable.
>>
>>Islamic lawyers who write on the internet seem to think that we
>>'oversensitive westerners' just do not understand that this is not bad.
>>Here's what one of them says on the subject of amputation of limbs;
>>
>>"Mutilating means "to deprive a person of an organ of the body"71 and like
>>'lashing', it too has some negative connotations and I would prefer the
>>alternative 'amputating'. In Islamic law, its application is only confined
>>to the hudood punishments for armed robbery72 and theft73, except of
>>course
>>that it might be applicable to the retributory punishments of qisas. For
>>all
>>practical purposes, the punishment of 'cutting off' the hand is generally
>>invoked for the offence of theft and so I will mention it in some detail."
>>
>>These people have some serious problems. And they also want the bomb. If
>>they are willing to mutilate their own kids, what makes us think that they
>>would have compassion for the lives of others?
>>
>>Phil Nisbet
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> >From: "Pat Kraut" <pkraut at moscow.com>
>> >To: "vision2020" <vision2020 at moscow.com>
>> >Subject: Re: [Vision2020] What just society does something like this?
>> >Date: Tue, 1 Nov 2005 22:00:27 -0800
>> >
>> >Phil: Some of the people seem to be questioning the truth of the photos.
>>I
>> >think they are very compelling but with the questions on the site I also
>> >wonder if they are truth. Perhaps someone knows someone who can do Farsi
>> >will look at the original site. But, the truth is that the middle
>>eastern
>> >countries really do have a code that would follow this type of
>>punishment.
>> >It is why we had to put hands back on some people that had lost them
>>under
>> >Saddam. But, there are many more out there that will not see the inside
>>of
>> >an American hospital. It has been the way of this area for a long time.
>>On
>> >some days I am sure we will not change it and on others I know we are
>> >giving
>> >them a great opportunity to do just that.
>> >I still wonder if they are not doctored in some way.
>> >PK
>> >
>> >----- Original Message -----
>> >From: "Phil Nisbet" <pcnisbet1 at hotmail.com>
>> >To: <vision2020 at moscow.com>
>> >Sent: Tuesday, November 01, 2005 8:47 AM
>> >Subject: [Vision2020] What just society does something like this?
>> >
>> >
>> >I just saw some very grim pictures that were evidently taken in Iran or
>> >Justice done to a small child for stealing a loaf of bread.
>> >
>> >http://bareknucklepolitics.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=126#126
>> >
>> >The pictures have a photographer listed and link back to a Persian
>>language
>> >news net site.
>> >
>> >Any comments from here on this?
>> >
>> >Phil Nisbet
>> >
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