[Vision2020] The Future

Fri Jul 1 19:39:12 PDT 2005

Saundra

Why do you assume that I was refering to you?  Was there anything in what I 
wrote that belittled your position?

I am suggesting to you that no matter what your other positions, if we have 
no University here and or that University is slowly but surely cut to near 
nothingness, all your other concerns won't be worth warm spit.  If all these 
rental properties are not full of students and all those students are not 
putting Mom and Dads money into Moscow's economy, how long do you think that 
it will be before this town will simply blow away on the Palouse winds?

This town needs to protect its most important asset, the U of I and at the 
same time it needs to diversify to add what Aaron Harp refered to as 
additional legs to the areas economy.  What are your property taxes going to 
be like if we see a major down turn in U of I funding or enrollments?

So, yes, I see that as a pretty major area that we can all agree on, the 
areas economy needs to be strong and we are tied to the University to see 
that it remains so.

Look at it this way, if we are all goat smellingly poor and in financial 
pain, then everything is fair and equitable, but I do not think that anybody 
wants that kind of equality.

If we are so busy leveling the playing field that the audience and the 
players all exit stage right, do you think that people will congratulate us 
on our diligence, or do you think they will be screaming for their money 
back?

Pounding NSA for a few dollars in Taxes is not going to do anything to help 
us have better schools or open and maintain parks or beautify downtown or 
any other thing.  Generating new sources of tax revenue by attracting new 
business, pushing to add revenues from more money coming in from the 
University in research funding and boosting the sales from our existing 
businesses are what can get the dollars needed.

If everybody was flush, do you think that anybody would care if we put in a 
new bunch of school buildings?  People were worried about money, since the U 
of I had cuts and more might just be on the way, so they turned down the 
School District on bond levies.  If the University was booming or we had a 
new large employer to boost economics for the community, they would have 
passed that levy in a trice.

So is taxing NSA or Logos going to raise enough money to cover what that 
bond would have?

And once you understand that, where do you think we need to concentrate our 
efforts?  Because there are only so many people and only so many hours in 
the day, priorites do have to be made.

So please, if I am wrong and we should drop worrying primarily about making 
sure we still have an econmy here as our top community concern, make the 
case so I can understand why thats so.  And if indeed our priority needs to 
be spending hours and lucre and community time on rounding up a few cases of 
people who should be paying a few grand in taxes, make the case for why its 
more important than trying to get millions more in tax reciepts from new 
business.  I will gladly endorse your cause if you can show me that with our 
limited funds and time, its whats best for the future of the community.

Phil Nisbet

>From: "Saundra Lund" <sslund at adelphia.net>
>To: "'Phil Nisbet'" <pcnisbet1 at hotmail.com>,<vision2020 at moscow.com>
>Subject: RE: [Vision2020] The Future
>Date: Fri, 1 Jul 2005 15:00:24 -0700
>
>Hi Again Phil,
>
>You wrote:
>"For the very reasons that you state, this community has to stop quibbling
>over the tiny stuff and start organizing to become more politically
>effective in insuring that Micron and the Eagle Mafia do not high grade all
>of our futures."
>
>My question for you is why do you present this as an either/or situation?
>What makes you think that the people you perceive as "quibbling over the
>tiny stuff" don't care and aren't involved in what I guess you assume is 
>the
>"bigger picture"?
>
>This is something that irritates me.  Because of the position I've taken
>regarding the fair, equitable, and just distribution of property taxes, I
>think there's a perception that's my *only* cause.  Nothing could be 
>further
>from the truth -- it's just the cause that's most visible at the moment.
>
>Besides, we are all individuals with our own individual strengths and
>interests free to have our own hopes, dreams, opinions, beliefs, thoughts  
>.
>. . and causes  :-)  Different people are, presumably, most effective in a
>range of different areas.
>
>Yeah, I really just don't get it when people argue from the false premise
>that it's an either/or kind of thing.
>
>Not to mention I think it's antagonistic to community-building to . . .
>belittle the interests and concerns of others who have different interests
>and concerns.
>
>
>JMHO,
>Saundra Lund
>Moscow, ID
>
>The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good people to do
>nothing.
>Edmund Burke
>
>***** Original material contained herein is Copyright 2005, Saundra Lund.
>Do not copy, forward, excerpt, or reproduce outside the Vision 2020 forum
>without the express written permission of the author.*****
>
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: vision2020-bounces at moscow.com [mailto:vision2020-bounces at moscow.com]
>On Behalf Of Phil Nisbet
>Sent: Friday, 01 July 2005 11:01 AM
>To: vision2020 at moscow.com
>Subject: RE: [Vision2020] The Future
>
>Mark
>
>For the very reasons that you state, this community has to stop quibbling
>over the tiny stuff and start organizing to become more politically
>effective in insuring that Micron and the Eagle Mafia do not high grade all
>of our futures.
>
>You and I have had many a politcal disagreement over the years, but I do 
>not
>call you names and you have never done such to me.  We can disagree and
>still discuss, find common ground and accomplish joint goals.
>
>I am not sure that all the people on this list are aware of the things can
>be accomplished when people of varying views set aside anomosity and strive
>together.
>
>When Phil Nisbet of Grassroots for Multiple Use and Mark Solomon of the ICL
>put aside their differences, the first Habitat Conservation Agreement for
>Endangered Species was born.  That agreement ended up restoring miles of
>spawning grounds for Chinook Salmon and steelhead and at the same time gave
>ranchers in Lemhi and Custer Counties a chance to clean up their acts
>without extreme financial hardship.  We could have just as easily screamed
>at each other and hurled insults, but I still remember the fun of doing
>pledge for pledge of GMU against ICL on Books for Bucks (Candice Donnicht's
>annual Salmon School District fundraiser) on the Salmon Radio instead.
>
>We can make a great community better by practicing some commity  We can 
>make
>a great community better by seeking our common ground and finding ways to
>work together to achieve our common dreams.  If Phil and Mark can do it,
>surely some of the rest of these well educated and well meaning folks can
>find it in themselves to do the same?
>
>Phil Nisbet
>
> >From: Mark Solomon <msolomon at moscow.com>
> >To: "Phil Nisbet" <pcnisbet1 at hotmail.com>, vision2020 at moscow.com
> >Subject: RE: [Vision2020] The Future
> >Date: Fri, 1 Jul 2005 10:22:21 -0700
> >
> >Phil,
> >
> >The shipment of UI jobs to campuses elsewhere has less to do with local
> >real estate and a lot more to do with the parochialism of the Idaho
> >Legislature. The Legislature, for reasons known (Simplot, Micron, the
> >Boise "mafia", etc) and unknown have been doing their best to shave off
> >programs from the UI Moscow campus for over 20 years. The engineering
> >programs have been their largest target. You're right... those programs
> >stand the best chance of receiving grants that focus on technology and
> >they are to a large extent going elsewhere. The University Place
> >project (before it turned into the debacle it now is) was primarily a
> >UI response to that Legislative pressure.
> >
> >Until the Legislature changes their tune on both program emphasis
> >location and appropriate employee compensation, local Moscow
> >development issues are just about irrelevant to retaining a quality
>research faculty at the UI.
> >
> >Mark Solomon
> >
> >At 9:14 AM -0700 7/1/05, Phil Nisbet wrote:
> >>Tom
> >>
> >>You can have all the little stores in downtown that you dream of and
> >>it will not replace any lose of high paying University Salaries.  And
> >>other Universities are snapping up what this one either turns away or
> >>ships to other locations.
> >>
> >>Just as an example, the plastics industry is moving to include
> >>nanotechnology into its designs to make nano-composite materials that
> >>will help to improve the life of products.  If a plastic bummer is
> >>stronger than steel and has half the weight, energy savings result.
> >>If a nano-composite can make a house less flammable, lives are saved
> >>and inert nano-composites can be used to replace more toxic fire
>retardants.
> >>
> >>So the plastics industry sees growth in those types of materials going
> >>from less than 1% of their sales to 30-40% of their sales in the next
> >>decade, from a current sales of just under a $100,000,000 to in excess
> >>of
> >>4 trillion dollars.
> >>
> >>University of Alaska Fairbanks just snagged $17,000,000 in a grant to
> >>study just one aspect of nanotech composites.  University of
> >>Pennsylvania picked up some research initially done here in Moscow and
> >>got a DOE grant for about ten million to look at how nano particles
> >>could assist in nuke waste disposal.  Heck, the NIST of the Department
> >>of Commerce is handing away $600,000,000 a year in grants and do we
> >>have any active here in Moscow?
> >>
> >>You have to sell one heck of a lot of Wild Women Traders dresses or a
> >>pot of Tie Die T-shirts to equal even a fraction of what’s out there
> >>in terms of research money, let alone the potential for spin off
> >>technology businesses that this kind of work could be bringing in.
> >>
> >>If we keep losing jobs at U of I and refuse to get in touch with the
> >>future of technology, this will end up being nothing more than an
> >>admin center for branch campuses that get all the good jobs and all
> >>the Research Grants.  How many shops can we have in Downtown, Tom, if
> >>the University loses more jobs and payroll?
> >>
> >>The reason that the non-conforming businesses are siting in downtown
> >>is that the business climate here makes downtown space cheap. Housing
> >>costs are through the roof here and what sort of disposable income do
> >>you think that kids making minimum wage at Wendy’s or Tri-State have
> >>once they pay their landlords?  Half the school year population is
> >>living hand to mouth and we offer no better paying jobs to them.  Want
> >>to see non-conforming uses move?  Increase disposable income by getting
>some real jobs in here.
> >>If downtown businesses could make more profits, they would of a matter
> >>of course push those other businesses out and expand.
> >>
> >>How many jobs will beating the CCers up and forcing them to leave
> >>bring in?  How many jobs will turning Wallmart out end up ponying up
> >>here in Moscow?
> >>
> >>And its not that I concur with Doug Wilson’s ideology or that I am in
> >>love with Wally World’s stores, I just see people chasing their tails
> >>and refusing to deal with real economic development issues.  This area
> >>needs jobs and yet this very list felt free to jump all over Barbara
> >>and claim she was part of an evile conspiracy for even suggesting that
> >>we need economic development.  As the person in charge of Economic
> >>Development in the county, rather than assist her and get some
> >>desirable growth, she ends up fighting an uphill battle to get even a
> >>few things going in the Alturas Park.
> >>
> >>So stop whining about downtown and tell us, what sort of development
> >>should we be looking at? How should we as a community get with the
> >>University to see that it ships no more jobs out to Boise or CDA?  How
> >>should we go about attracting firms to move here and use our access to
> >>a large intellectual community to increase hob opportunity here?
> >>
> >>That’s what the FUTURE is about, not NSA or LOGOS or any of the other
> >>piddling issues that absorb your time.
> >>
> >>Phil Nisbet
> >>
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