[Vision2020] More sidewalks

[Janesta Carcich]

Kit, what do you mean by "how physically able?"
*gentle smile* The sidewalks should be the same as the
are in the summer. Well most of the sidewalks are,
anyway.... accessible! Why should one group of people
not be able to go out, and be stuck at home, because
some people are too lazy to either shovel and pick at
their icy walk, or hire someone.

Pat, I heard they were working on it! I applaude those
who have gotten out there and cleared the ice. I love
to go downtown, and your efforts are appreciated by
myself, and others like me! *warm smile* Trouble is,
it will probably be like the summer Dad would have me
wash all those windows at Paradise Villa... the second
I was done, it would rain, just enough to wet the
windows, then a dust storm would kick up! At 14 I knew
it was a plot by Dad and God to keep me busy! Lets
hope this winter isn't a sassy one! 

Thank you from my friends and me, who don't get around
like we used to.... to all of you for your sidewalk
efforts, and a HUGE thank you to Chief Weaver, and his
staff for enforcing the ordinance. 

Janesta Carcich
--- Pat Kraut <pkraut at moscow.com> wrote:

> I believe the city is working very hard on the
> sidewalk thing. Note the
> people working on them all over town.
> 
> 
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Kit Craine" <kcraine at moscow.com>
> To: "2020 Vision" <vision2020 at moscow.com>
> Sent: Thursday, December 08, 2005 5:32 PM
> Subject: [Vision2020] More sidewalks
> 
> 
> I didn’t get these back (perhaps I hit Reply rather
> than Reply-All), so
> am sending them again. They are comments on the
> sidewalks issue. I’m
> resending because I think they are important. The
> bottom line is: how
> physically able do people need to be to walk the
> streets of Moscow in
> winter?
> 
> Kit Craine
> 
> 
> 1).
> This is the short answer to Chasuk’s question.
> Sidewalks are part of
> the public right-of-way, which is not the same thing
> as public
> property.  It is a form of easement where the public
> has the right to
> pass over (i.e. cross) private property. The owner
> of the property has
> a legally duty to ensure that people crossing their
> property can do it
> safely. In terms of responsibility and liability,
> the public sidewalk
> is no different than any other spot on your
> property. If a visitor,
> invited or not, is injured because of unsafe
> conditions, the property
> owner is legally liable for the damages. The
> difference between the
> public sidewalk and your property is that you can’t
> forbid passage to
> people who are just walking by.
> 
> Perhaps it would be more tasteful to look at
> shoveling sidewalks as a
> form of civic sharing. I labor to clear my sidewalk
> so you can cross my
> property safely and you do the same for me. And
> those who don’t share,
> must sit in the corner for a while.
> 
> 
> On Dec 7, 2005, at 11:26 AM, Chasuk wrote:
> 
> > Kit, Janesta, this is not addressed to either of
> you, specifically,
> > but is addressing a general situation that you
> have brought to our
> > attention.
> >
> > On 12/7/05, Kit Craine <kcraine at moscow.com> wrote:
> >> For as long as I can remember, the City's
> response to problems related
> >> to snow is that it doesn't happen enough to worry
> about--or to change
> >> their procedures. As many can attest, it only
> takes a split second to
> >> slip, fall, and land with a broken bone. The few
> minutes someone
> >> spends
> >> clearing their sidewalk can save another months
> of pain and big
> >> medical
> >> bills. If property owners don't fulfill their
> responsibilities, the
> >> City should take an active roll in protecting
> public safety.
> >
> > I'm going to have to admit that I am divided on
> this issue.  If I am
> > responsible for clearing the snow from the
> sidewalk in front of my
> > house, then it is _my_ sidewalk, and I should be
> able to disallow
> > trespassers.  If it isn't my sidewalk, then,
> logically, I should not
> > be responsible for keeping it clear.
> >
> > A business is extending an invitation, "please
> visit me," but a
> > homeowner is not inviting the public to stroll
> past their house.  Is
> > the sidewalk public or private property?  If it is
> public property,
> > then the city is responsible for maintaining it;
> if it is private
> > property, then keep your accident-prone self away.
> >
> > Note that I am not actually such a curmudgeon that
> I would prevent
> > little old ladies (or little old men or younger
> versions of either
> > sex) from strolling across my property, but such
> permission might be
> > conditional, with appropriate signage reading "Use
> at your own risk."
> >
> > I don't own property, and I don't anticipate that
> I ever will, so
> > these musings are purely theoretical.
> >
> 
> 2).
> The precise language of the code is:
> 
> “It shall be the duty of every owner of  any land,
> building, or lot
> within the City to  to  remove snow and/or ice from
> adjacent  sidewalks
> to permit the safe pedestrian  passage upon said
> sidewalks bordering
> said  property and to abate the nuisance set forth 
> in this Chapter.for
> a period of twenty four (24) hours,  ” (Moscow City
> Code, Title 5,
> Chapter 9: Removal Of Snow And Ice)“
> 
> At the risk of getting embroiled in a semantics war,
> that is fairly
> clear--it’s the entire sidewalk; the following
> phrase (‘to permit safe
> ...) is the reason why the sidewalk must be cleared.
> 
> Of course, arguing the semantics may be fun, but the
> fact is that any
> snow/ice that is left on a sidewalk has a tendency
> to melt then
> refreeze--thus creating an extremely dangerous
> situation. A completely
> cleared sidewalk, on the other hand, will usually
> remain bare and dry
> until more snow falls.
> 
> Kit Craine
> 
> On Dec 7, 2005, at 11:32 AM, Janesta Carcich wrote:
> 
> > Greetings,
> >
> > I had a very informative conversation with our
> Chief
> > of Police, Dan Weaver regarding sidewalks. He was
> > really helpful in assisting me to understand the
> > ordinance, how it is written, and what it is
> lacking.
> >
> > Chief Weaver stated they are being more aggressive
> > this year. The person who warns, and writes
> citations
> > to business owners regarding their sidewalks is
> also
> > the animal control officer. Apparently, she is
> pretty
> > busy tending to strays, and loose pets. I
> suggested
> > the parking ticket writers be the eyes and ears
> for
> > her, and contact her when there is a problem.
> > Hmmmmm????? That gives me an idea! Better yet, why
> not
> > train THEM do ticket writing for icy sidewalks?
> They
> > are walking frequently in the downtown district. I
> > haven’t seen the ordinance, but apparently it is
> vague
> > in terms of how much of the sidewalk needs to be
> > cleared, how wide, by what time, all kinds of
> things
> > are missing!
> >
> > In my opinion, the walks should be clear from the
> curb
> > to the front door of the business. then, from
> property
> > line to property line. How else can we safely get
> from
> > the curb to the door, or another business, if all
> that
> > is required is a three foot wide walkway in front
> of
> > the business? We can not expect to park in front
> of
> > the business we are shopping at, that just isn't
> > possible anywhere, unless you are in Troy, where
> > parking is not an issue.
> >
> 
=== message truncated ===


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