[Vision2020] Re: Memo to Commissioner Kimmell

Ted Ryan coffeemonkey100 at hotmail.com
Tue Aug 24 10:29:01 PDT 2004

I am not defending anyone here except myself, if I were to need it.  I was
questioning Captain Kirkers response about the war and his very dismissive
attitude.  I am simply saying that because someone lost, doesn't mean we
can't learn something from them.  Whether or not it was a good time in the
community to use an example like Lee is not for me to decide, I have been
absent in the community when a lot of this has happened.  However, I was not
addressing the timing of this event, simply pointing out that losers and
winners can teach us all.  Moreover, I would contend that Lee was not
defending slavery in and of itself, I think he was as eager to rid the world
of it as anyone, what he was defending was the North's right to tell them
how to do it and the North's jurisdiction in the matter in the first place.
One of the issues was slavery, but he wasn't defending slavery itself.  To
say so is to misunderstand history.

Concerning your statement, "whose leadership has praised the condition of
slavery in the south".  That is simply inaccurate.  I have not heard or read
of anyone praising the condition, and you would be hard-pressed to find
someone other than a true slave believer, who would.  All they have said is
the condition COULD exist and not be a sinful, however, we must work to rid
ourselves of slavery because that condition is awful.  Statements such as
yours, "praising the condition" really only add to false information that is
constantly brewed in this forum.  It may not even be intentional, but after
so many unintentional twisting of peoples words, it no longer resembles what
they have ever said.

If you are really interested in finding out about some what CC members said
at the time, go back to the archives.  You will be surprised at what you
read, so much of what is circulating in this forum now is fabrication, clean
and simple.

Ted Ryan

> Message: 6
> Date: Tue, 24 Aug 2004 08:55:12 -0700
> From: Sara Anderson <ande1022 at uidaho.edu>
> Subject: [Vision2020] Re: Memo to Commissioner Kimmell
> To: vision2020 at moscow.com
> Message-ID: <3b4ac53b9a37.3b9a373b4ac5 at uidaho.edu>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
> Ted,
> There are things to be learned by losing.  However, in general, what one
learns by losing is how to lose.  Robert E. Lee did not lose a softball
game, he lost a war in which he was defending the practice of slavery.  Not
only that, but Kimmel is not giving this presentation in a vacuum.  He's an
elder of a church whose leadership has praised the condition of slavery in
the south.  Then consider the "friends" of Christ Church including Grant and
> It's not illegal, but neither is Extreme Makeover.  Both are bothersome to
me.  It creeps me out that Moscow leadership is espousing the harmful ideas
that come from Christ Church.  If you're fine with it, well, that creeps me
out too.  And, again, it's legal for you to give me the heebie jeebies, but
it's downright annoying when you play naive.
> Sincerely,
> Sara Anderson
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